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"This is Undaunted Life, a man's podcast.
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I'm your host Kyle Thompson, let's get into it."
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Welcome back to the Forging Table.
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"The mission of Undaunted Life is equipping men to push back darkness with content that
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forges, spiritual, mental, and physical resilience.
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At the Forging Table, you'll see a group of regular guys forging spiritual resilience
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by digging into God's Word, and we're welcoming all of you to come along on that journey
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with us.
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That's Zach, that's Ryan, that's Howard, but guys, does anyone know what the word "manch"
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means?
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I mean, I think that's kind of like a Yiddish thing or like a Jewish thing.
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It's like a Minch?
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Minch?
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Well, if you go to the Googles, a Minch is a person of integrity and honor, and that's
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spelled M-E-N-S-C-H, by the way, and the third definition is a decent responsible person
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with admirable characteristics, and I just got to say right now, there is a Minch at this
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table right now, and it's the guy right across from me, and that is Howard Wickersham, and
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that is because we've had some weird stuff go down with Forging Tables, a lot of stuff
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that we don't really talk about on camera, but the guy that was supposed to be sitting
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in that seat, this is my story to tell, but father-in-law, major, major medical issues,
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he had to hop on an airplane, and of course he's a dutiful guy, and so he told me, "Hey,
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48 hours ago, hey man, we're hopping on a plane, father-in-law, he flat-lined a couple
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of times overnight, we got to go."
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So it's like, of all the things for him to be worrying about, I didn't give two craps
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about what was happening at the Forging Table, but in that moment, it's like, okay, we're
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either going to rock with the three of us, which would have been fine, or we're going
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to have to find a fourth, and my first phone call was Howard, and you were like, okay,
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I got it, and let me talk to the wife, and then here you are less than 48 hours later,
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it's more like 31 1/2 hours or something like that, and here you are sitting here so Howard,
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we appreciate you very much, man, thanks for hopping in, and, and, and, he didn't just
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hop in, and he's just going to like kind of flow with us, you studied, like you, you
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studied, and you woke up, what, you said you woke up earlier this morning, and knocked
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out the last few chapters, so yeah, so very, very thankful for you, but we do need to address
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the elephant in the room, and we need to talk about the fact that Ryan, that might be the
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greatest shirt in the history of the Forging Table, is it, well is that a shirt or is that
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a shacket?
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It's a shacket.
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Okay, for those of you that aren't aware, like that is a shirt jacket.
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Well yeah, yeah, see the inside, show the camera, show the people at home, look at that.
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Now, you might get a little sweaty, because you get a little worked up, especially if
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we start talking about things that are controversial.
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We didn't have to do it all awkward like that, but like, where does the movie reference
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from?
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So, here's the thing about a shirt like that though, that is either something that you
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got at like a super bougie Western store or a gas station, and I'm not sure which, but
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either way, I think it's awesome.
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Do we know where the shirt came from?
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We founded on Facebook with a company called Cerammo, like S-E-R-R-M-O.
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Wait, spell out one more time?
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S-E-R-R-M-O.
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All right, this is not an advertisement, so if they're like a weird company that like
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helps kids, you know, chop off their healthy breast tissue, like we are not giving them,
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"Oh, I've seen these ads."
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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It's flannel season, according to their website.
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Yeah.
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I don't know, this is happening later, so for some of you, this is going to be in the spring.
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Yeah.
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These are nice.
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I bought this jacket, jacket, three years ago, and what I'm finally still enough to wear.
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Oh, as well as I'll say, I haven't seen them wear it.
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Yeah, you've lost all that weight, so you can fit it up.
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Yeah.
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So you finally started listening to me, huh?
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Sorry.
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Well, I've gone on paleo.
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Okay.
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How's that going?
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It's going really well.
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I'm down from 260 to 235 to a good boom.
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Oh, for you, man.
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So for you.
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So for 34, maybe.
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But that's like going in for boxer weight, so like just towel on.
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So what you're saying is, well, we don't need to confirm that.
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We definitely don't need to confirm that.
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But what you're saying is, is that whole everyone in my presence has to be able to do at least
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10 pull-ups, saying that that you might actually be able to pull that off in 2025.
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I don't know about that.
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I mean, I'm trying to drop the weights so I can pull myself up.
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Yeah.
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But yeah, I mean, I'm going to work towards it.
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Okay.
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Tim, I mean, because we're putting this in January, yeah, the year.
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This is January, but really, my goal is to open that bottle of Pappy.
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You're standing.
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All right.
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But now you got to tell everybody, nobody knows what you're talking about.
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Okay.
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So you have a bottle of Pappy, 15-year-olds sitting on your shelf.
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Wait.
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Have you haven't switched?
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Okay.
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Don't worry about that part.
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Yeah.
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Do your.
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Yeah.
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So I've got a bottle of Pappy, 15.
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My wife got me a couple of years ago for Christmas.
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And so I'm like, I need to find a special occasion to open it.
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Well, my goal is not my goal, my standard is how do you like that?
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How do you like somebody who listens to the show?
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My standard is to basically eat healthier.
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So my wife and I have been on kind of a paleo kick for the last couple of months since like
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November.
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You know, we'll still dabble in certain things here and there just because we don't want
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to lose, you know, life in general.
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But like last night, I made a keto friendly or not a keto friendly, a paleo friendly like
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teriyaki sauce with some chicken thighs with cauliflower rice and broccoli.
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Like that was in the meal, you know?
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And so we've been eating that way.
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And so my goal is to get down to 200 pounds.
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If I can get down to 200 pounds, that's 60 pounds from where I was at before, I'm going
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to open that bottle of Pappy.
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For those of you that don't know, Ryan Horne is a cook and he's always talking about foods
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that I can't pronounce.
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They've never heard of, but they're awesome.
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Yeah.
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You always put a glaze on stuff too.
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I feel like every time I talk to you, it's like, it's not just me.
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It's like, well, I've got this super duper balsamic glaze or what.
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I don't know what you like.
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What was the first thing where the glaze you put on that deer that you could help?
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I did.
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I did a blackberry like sauce on top of it.
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So crushed blackberries with a stomach vinegar, a little bit of honey, some salt and just like
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got it into a thick sauce and then stuck it on the back strap or the roast.
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See, I'm like the exact opposite.
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Since I eat this basically every day for lunch, like literally I will cut up the back strap
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into strips.
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I saw Joby actually do this when we were out at the retreat center out in Georgia.
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And like, so what I will do is I will put like a bang load of tallow or butter in the
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cast iron skillet.
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And I, you know, kind of a hack if your wife gets on to you about the cast iron skillet
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constantly making the kitchen dirty or whatever, I put my cast iron skillet inside of my smoker
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inside.
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Oh, I saw it dude in my grill.
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Okay.
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All that splatter and everything going on doesn't matter because it's, I mean, some
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people are real anal about cleaning the inside of their smoker.
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I don't really understand that at all, but I just put a bang load of tallow or butter
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in there.
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And then whenever you cut it up in slices, I'll throw in because I eat about a pound at
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a time of that.
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So I throw it in there and I just basically take tongs and I move it the entire time.
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And so I may basically move in it for maybe about a minute.
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And so I've got a nice like, you know, buttery char on the outside, but then the inside is
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basically rare, medium rare.
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And so it's some of the pieces come out a little bit Pittsburgh style.
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So it's like charred on the outside and then, you know, it's kind of, it's rare on the
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inside.
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So yeah, God, I'm like starving all sudden this sucks.
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Today's our cheat day.
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So like I'm making like, uh, so we're doing stakes New York strip, I'll put them in the
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SUV.
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I'm going to hit them with that G seasoning.
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You, uh, yeah, which by the way, I don't know if I talked about this on the show or not.
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And again, this comes out a few months ago, but so again, I'm, I'm down, I'm hanging out
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with, uh, anyway, I can't tell that part of the story, but anyway, I find out about
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G seasoning and this is like a small family owned and operated, uh, thing where this is
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like grandma's recipe kind of a situation and someone prepared me a steak with G seasoning.
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That's G as in like, what is the letter?
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Yeah.
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Well, yeah.
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G is in the letter.
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I know what letters are.
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I was trying to think of the military alphabet.
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What is G?
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Uh, all the people in the military are like, that's what it's going to be changed to.
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So, uh, so anyway, uh, I take one bite of this steak.
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If this guy prepared for me, I take one single bite and I was like, whoa, what, what did
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you season this with?
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Cause I season all my steak with the same three things.
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It's coarse salt, black pepper, garlic powder and like, dude, that's, that's classic.
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That's really all you need.
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I don't really go, uh, go any different than that.
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And it was so good.
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And he's like, yeah, man, this is like my, my buddy's company and he's like, you know,
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I already have a relationship with like a seasoning company.
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So I can't really talk about it on my socials or things like that.
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And so I just decide I'm going to mention it on the show, right?
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And this was before Christmas, 2024.
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So I just decide, okay, um, this is not an ad.
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I tell everyone on the show, this is not an ad.
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I did not get paid to do this, but I like to share things with you.
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Cause I always get on, get on to guys for they find something awesome and then they don't
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share it around.
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Right.
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So they, they just find like a new band or a new Jiu Jitsu move or like a new snack and
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they're just, they just keep it to themselves.
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And so I share it.
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And then I just make this casual comment where I just say, wouldn't it be awesome if a hundred
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guys in my audience bought, you know, bought one of these and like, that'd be kind of cool
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for this family to get a nice little bump before the end of the year.
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And I was like, yeah, you know, I bought a box of six of them and I gave them out some
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people for Christmas.
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And then I don't think anything about it.
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And I get a random DM on Instagram, a day or two after the episode came out.
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And it's this woman that builds websites and she goes, Hey, are you the podcast host that
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mentioned G seasoning on your show?
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And I was like, Oh, it's just some sort of fishing thing or whatever, but it looked like
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a legit account.
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So I'm like, yes.
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And she's like, look, I built their website a long time ago.
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It's not one of my better websites because this small family owned an operating thing.
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They didn't, they couldn't spend a whole bunch of money on all this, you know, crazy marketing
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stuff.
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And so I just built it.
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But she's like, I can still see their back end.
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They have been flooded with orders over the last two days, absolutely and completely flooded.
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Like, and I, and we're pretty sure it's because of your show.
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And I was like, and in my head, I'm like, well, yeah, it's obviously because of that, but
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I was like, apparently dudes took me seriously.
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And then the, the owners of the company, they, they found my number and they reached out and
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they were just super thankful because for them, and like that made me feel like amazing
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because you know what it, you know how much effort it took for me to mention them on the
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show?
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Exactly.
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None.
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Right.
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I just, I got it.
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And I'm like, this is really good.
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And I just wanted to be kind of like a little, you know, non paid ambassador for this thing
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that I thought was awesome.
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And to this day, there are people like tagging me, cause they had like a hundred followers
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on Instagram, right?
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And then like, then all of a sudden they just sell all the stuff and like anyway, it was,
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it was a really, really cool.
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So I'm looking forward to using it.
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I'm putting it on the silver sous vide and the stakes, then I'm going to put on there,
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reverse serum and the cast iron skillet, and I'm making scalloped potatoes with cheddar
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grated.
10:06
Oh my gosh.
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And then what time is this all happening?
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And honey carrots.
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Oh gosh.
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Yeah.
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So I should come by like a little bit beforehand.
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If you need to come by beforehand, we need to take stakes over my wife during lunch because
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I got a sous vide him.
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He didn't do his job.
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Dang.
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Gosh.
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Okay guys here, you know, it doesn't even matter now.
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Okay.
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We're rolling out.
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We have to cover two chapters of Genesis today.
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But how would he set up now?
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Zach, Zach, you had one job.
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So for those of you that don't know, this is, you know, this is a little bit of peak behind
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the curtain thing.
10:37
This guy did actually apparently go to school.
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This is a timer.
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You see, and all you have to do to get this timer to start so we can kind of know where
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we're at in this whole thing is just hit the top button.
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I was like, Zach, you got this.
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You're good to go.
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And then here I am.
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I'm looking down.
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And what, what do we talk for?
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We've talked for 10 and a half minutes and this thing hadn't been going.
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I've got a timer, but it's for you guys, right?
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Yeah, exactly.
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But hey, we probably should get to work and I don't even, I did the batteries just go
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out.
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Zach, so team on is 10.
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We're good.
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Yeah, it's fine.
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At this point, like here, let's see if it'll actually start going boom, boom, timer is
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going.
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But guys, we do actually need to get in today.
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We're going to be covering Genesis 13 and Genesis 14.
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And one of the good things about having Howard here is if there are any difficult names that
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come up, just so this is for this is for Zach and for Ryan, if there's a difficult name
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that comes up, just stop talking and then Howard will hop in.
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Okay, so if you don't know how to say it, don't just me and meander your way through
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it.
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Just stop talking and Howard hops in.
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Does that work?
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How would we just make Howard read the whole time?
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Well, no, I mean, that's rude.
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I'm going to add some prep time, maybe, you know, no, no, you don't even need the prep
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time.
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You just got that big old brain over there.
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But hey, let's start out.
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We're going to keep the, the narrative of Abram going.
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So we're in acts or sorry, acts.
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We are in Genesis.
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This is we're off the rail.
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So they're all ready.
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It's because we haven't had.
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Look what you did.
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Exactly.
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The timer had been going.
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I would not have made that mistake.
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So Howard, how about we go ahead and start here?
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I don't think there's any bad names on this part, but let's go Genesis 13.
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Let's read the first 13 verses.
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Okay.
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So Abraham went up to Egypt from the give with his wife and everything and everything
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he had and a lot went with him.
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Abraham had become very wealthy and livestock and in silver and gold.
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From the give, he went to the place from place to place until he came to Bethel to the place
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between Bethel and A.I. where his tent had been earlier and where he had built his first
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or built the altar, then they are Abraham called on the name of the Lord.
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Now a lot who was moving about with Abram also had flocks, herds and tents, but the land
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could not support them while they stayed together for their possessions were so great
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that they were not able to stay together.
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And corolling arose between Abraham's herdsmen and lots.
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The Canaanites and the Persites were also living in the land at the time.
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So Abraham said to a lot, "Let's not have any corolling between you and me or between
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your herdsmen and mine, for we are close relatives.
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Is not the whole land before you?
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Let's part company.
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If you go to the left, I'll go to the right.
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If you go to the right, I'll go to the left."
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Lot looked around and saw that the whole plain of the Jordan toward Zor was well watered
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like the Garden of the Lord, like the land of Egypt before this was before the Lord destroyed
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Sodom and Gomorrah.
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So Lot chose for himself the whole plain of the Jordan and set out towards the east.
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The two-parted company, Abram lived in the land of Canaan while Lot lived among the cities
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of the plain and pitched his tent near Sodom.
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Now the people of Sodom were wicked and were sinning greatly against the Lord.
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Done, done, done, yeah, this dramatic, dramatic foreshadowing here.
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But there's a few interesting notes before we get into this first part.
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So in the first verse when it says, "So Abram went up from Egypt."
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I didn't know this, but apparently from where he was going to where he needed to end up,
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it was just going to be an uphill walk the entire time because apparently he was heading
14:05
into Palestine for a highland country.
14:08
And this all would have been very, very slow going.
14:09
Again, this is coming on the heels of him, you know, hiding.
14:13
Sarah's identity and, you know, kind of tricking the Pharaoh and all this type of stuff.
14:18
But the fact that he is so rich is an incredible thing for us to understand because a lot of
14:25
things come off the fact that he's so rich and he basically goes against a lot of different
14:29
customs.
14:30
You know, during this time period, he's going against certain customs that you would see
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from other people that were rich.
14:36
But in terms of this section here, the first thing I really want to talk about is this
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separation that needed to happen because Lot was not as well off as Abram.
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He didn't need to basically humble himself and say, "Hey, hey, hey, let's not argue
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about this.
14:50
You know, I'll kind of let you have first pick."
14:52
But then Lot, you know, basically is like, "All right, I'm going to take the choices
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of land."
14:55
He doesn't meet the selflessness with selflessness, he just kind of thinks himself, "I'm going
15:00
to go ahead and take an advantage."
15:01
I think for a lot of us, like we have a little bit of that in us, whether or not we pull
15:05
that out.
15:06
It's like, "Hey, this is kind of going to be a good opportunity for me."
15:08
Yeah, a few things for us to start out talking there, so ready, set, go.
15:11
I think when we look at it, as we look at Lot, I think he's looking at being closer
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to the cities as more of a business kind of transaction.
15:18
So they had a lot of shepherding, a lot of animals and stuff like that, so sales would
15:23
be a lot easier than people coming from the cities all the way over to the land of Canaan.
15:28
So I think that was a big issue, but I think what I wanted to talk about before we got
15:33
into that, just to reiterate, is when Abraham left during the famine and went to Egypt,
15:41
he didn't have his faith in God.
15:43
And then what I really enjoyed seeing is that God still made him rich, like God still held
15:47
to his promises even though Abraham lost faith.
15:51
And so when he comes back to where he was before, he's even more richly based.
15:57
But then he's also more, how do you want to say it, he's more selfless too, because the
16:01
fact that he was just, that's his nephew, who's, like you said, Kyle, is not like, and he's
16:06
not anybody really, but his nephew.
16:08
And he's like, hey, if you want to go right, I'll go left.
16:11
If you want to go left, I'll go right, whatever you want, I will do.
16:14
So it just shows kind of like the man that that Abraham was.
16:17
I think it's important to discuss here as well, because again, what you're not advocating
16:22
for is this type of, you know, oh, I literally just like slip my mind.
16:28
What is like Joel Steen's claim to fame?
16:29
He's a prosperity gospel, good grief.
16:32
But there's, there's the other side of this within, especially modern Christiandom, which
16:35
is poverty gospel, which is like if you're going to be a Christian, you just can't be
16:39
financially successful.
16:41
And obviously we've heard a lot of different arguments and we've talked about this a lot
16:44
on the show.
16:45
It's like, you know, ministry is expensive.
16:46
Like whenever these, these families go over and they live in India or Bangladesh or something
16:50
like that and they're sharing the gospel around like, that's expensive work to fly them back
16:54
and forth to, to pay for their, for their living in different things like that.
16:57
Most of these people are not, you know, itinerant workers are not tent makers while they're
17:01
over there.
17:02
They're, they're, they're trying to create relationships and do things for other people.
17:06
But that's another thing here is just because Abram was rich doesn't mean that that's guaranteed
17:11
for all of us.
17:13
But it also doesn't, it also means that that's not a negative thing, right?
17:16
That God can bestow riches on whoever the heck he wants to bestow riches on.
17:20
Well, I think the piece about that too, it's like just because he was wealthy doesn't mean
17:24
he's not going to have challenges.
17:25
Exactly.
17:26
And I think that's the thing about this.
17:27
It's like, yeah, there's so many times we think, oh, if I just get to this, if I make
17:31
this much money, then I won't have any more problems.
17:35
And that's a lie that the devil tries to tell us that say, hey, if we get here, we're good.
17:39
But it's like, you know, he was humble enough here to be like, the Lord is going to provide
17:43
him, whether I give all of this land or most of this good land to him, he's going to take
17:47
care of me of, of what I'm going to be.
17:49
So one thing we don't see here, I'm going to, we're going to go ahead, I was just going
17:53
to say here at the beginning that from what I've read with Wiersby here, it talks a lot
17:58
about how Abram had gone through his circumstances in Egypt and learned what it was like to not
18:03
be following God and go through those consequences.
18:05
And so his heart began to change and come back to God, but lots didn't necessarily do
18:10
the same thing.
18:11
And Wiersby talks about this later on, but I think it's important right now to talk about
18:15
it, which is, a lot starts his march towards Sodom, camping out outside, going into the
18:22
city, and then eventually having a position and his whole family becomes part of it while
18:26
Abraham chooses to follow God and it has these consequences.
18:29
So there's so many takeaways from that in your personal life and your community and
18:33
how you identify with God, how you learn from the challenges that he's put you through.
18:38
And this kind of sets the scene for the rest of what we're going to talk about.
18:41
And I think it also sets the scene of grace is not earned, it's given, because we see,
18:47
we'll see throughout these chapters that we go over Abraham, falling away from the faith
18:52
of what God has told him, he's what's going to happen.
18:55
And we're going to see, like you said, a lot moving towards, more towards Sodom, but still
19:00
having that inkling of faith and God still honors that and still holds to his covenant.
19:05
And so their righteousness was never earned.
19:07
It was always just given, it was a gift given by God each.
19:10
I think what we're going to see in these chapters is the patience God has, not only for these
19:15
guys, but for like us as well.
19:17
I don't really like speculating that much.
19:19
Do we think Abraham was a little disappointed after a lot picked the land that he picked?
19:23
Because we have no indication from the text.
19:25
This is complete speculation, guys, it's fun, because guess what?
19:28
This is my Bible study that I let y'all listen in on, okay?
19:31
But there is a part of me that just wonders if he was just like, you know what, I'm going
19:35
to off, you know, when someone offers something, but they're, yeah, we'll see what he takes,
19:39
but they're not expecting him to take the best one.
19:41
And then they take the best one, you're like, kind of wish I wouldn't have offered it from
19:45
the beginning.
19:46
Again, speculating, making it weird.
19:47
I don't think so.
19:48
I think at this point, you know, Abraham's faith in God, just showing like, hey, I'll
19:54
go left if you go right, and I'll go right if you go left.
19:56
Like he had faith no matter what was going to happen.
19:58
And I also don't feel like this land was that close to the city of Sodom, as we think
20:03
it was, you know, it's probably a little bit of a journey.
20:06
And so I don't think he was that upset.
20:10
I think they were going to be a little, I think what he could have been more upset about
20:13
if I was going to be upset is that they were sharing a lot, they land with the Canaanites
20:17
and the Preziites or parasites, parasites, parasites, sorry, Joby, sorry.
20:24
Don't tell Terry.
20:25
Sorry, Joby.
20:26
Yeah.
20:27
So, um, but his numbers drastically go down.
20:30
So you know, you're trying to, you're, they had more numbers in that land.
20:34
So they kind of owned it based on numbers.
20:36
And so him moving off to something else brings his numbers down.
20:38
Yeah.
20:39
So I just made a note of this.
20:40
It's a direct answer to your question from Wiersby, which I think is good, says Abraham
20:44
lived by faith, not by sight.
20:46
No matter what Lot did, Abraham was not worried about his future for he knew that everything
20:50
was in the hands of the Lord.
20:52
Abraham had never read Psalm 47, 4, or Matthew 6, 33, but he was putting both into practice
20:58
by faith.
20:59
He had met God at the altar and knew that everything was under control.
21:03
When God is first in your life, it makes no difference who is second or last.
21:06
And you bring that up the altar, like he created that altar and he came back to it.
21:11
And so like, what's really crazy as I was doing the study here?
21:14
And I was listening to music and outcome to the altar game.
21:17
Which version?
21:18
Change change.
21:19
I'm, uh, no, it wasn't Shane and Shane.
21:21
I'm sure it was a Fertich church elevation.
21:23
Shane, Shane, you mentioned him in a positive light on the show.
21:27
Well, you are a bank for speaking for two minutes.
21:30
Technically Fertich's worship music is, uh, is more theologically correct than a sermon.
21:35
So which is also true.
21:36
That's, that's another thing that just has a quick side note, because I know we've had
21:39
some discussions at this table about, uh, elevation and about Bethel and about different
21:43
places to where it's like, okay, you have to call balls and strikes on individual pieces
21:47
of content.
21:48
Right.
21:49
And so like it's like when someone listens to a five minute rant on my show and then
21:52
they dismiss all 700 plus episodes, it's like, probably not the best thing that you should
21:56
have ever done.
21:57
But if there's a line that's a little theologically squishy in a Bethel song and you're like,
22:01
ah, can't listen to any of it.
22:03
It's like, all right, that's going to be a little bit problematic.
22:05
But to the point that, that we're kind of on, you know, verse four, to the place where
22:09
he had made an altar at the first and their Abram called upon the name of the Lord.
22:13
There's some discussion of like, okay, what is the, you know, what is the impetus behind
22:18
this move?
22:20
Was it a sense of shame?
22:21
Uh, is that why he came to the altar?
22:24
Was it a sense of shame for what he did in Egypt and the lies that he, that he told?
22:28
Or was this just straight up a sense of thankfulness for being delivered from his peril and it
22:33
doesn't have to be either or it could be a mixture of both.
22:35
But we don't see explicitly from the text why Abram called upon the name of the Lord
22:40
and made an altar.
22:41
Uh, was this just duty?
22:43
Was this just an over an abundance and an overflow of the duty that he felt?
22:46
But that is something because for, for some of us, we don't come to the altar unless things
22:51
are really, really jacked up, right?
22:54
That is when we come with our prayers of supplication, right?
22:57
And then some people just go to the altar when they have a need of any kind.
23:00
Some people go to the altar when they're thankful.
23:02
Like when people ask me about my prayer life, I'm like, where I don't struggle at all is
23:05
prayer is a thankfulness.
23:06
I will be walking through the parking lot to my vehicle and I'll think to myself, I have
23:10
a vehicle.
23:11
That is awesome.
23:12
I can get to wherever I need to go.
23:13
And I have a vehicle that is for the most part reliable.
23:16
That is really awesome.
23:17
But when it comes to, oh, I need help making this decision.
23:20
That's where I'm like, yeah, you know, God, you gave me a spirit of wisdom.
23:23
Like, you know, we're good.
23:24
I don't need your help here, which is so stupid.
23:25
But that, that's the one thing that I thought about when we were getting into the verse
23:28
four.
23:29
Yeah.
23:30
And personally, this really stuck out because, um, I think I've come to realize that you
23:36
can't really manufacture your faith, like true genuine trust and faith.
23:43
So you almost have to pray for it.
23:44
It's a gift of grace.
23:45
Like Ryan saying, I mean, have you guys, have you guys encountered that, especially when
23:49
you're having to be patient through a circumstance?
23:51
It's one thing to be thankful, but when you're actually having to have genuine faith to get
23:55
you through something where you can be trusting and be confident and not anxious and not
24:00
worrisome, that's a, that's a big deal.
24:03
That's those moments when you're really going to God and it defines your faith as being real
24:07
and genuine in your life.
24:08
I think I hear you on that because like, you know, I've been going through some struggles
24:12
myself and, and like reading this passage and seeing God's faithfulness even through his
24:17
doubt through Abraham's doubt and everything.
24:19
It's just like, man, this guy actually heard the voice of God and, and it has his doubts
24:25
and it's like, Hey, I'm going through this tough time.
24:26
I'm going to put my faith in God, but sometimes those doubts will kind of hit you up in like
24:29
middle of the night, the be witching hours.
24:31
I think we had a forging instead on that.
24:33
I think it's just the witching hours, but it doesn't matter or whatever.
24:36
So be wished.
24:37
Are you, was that like a reference to the old school television show that you got to watch
24:40
when you were sick?
24:41
Stayed up.
24:42
Nick at night.
24:43
Nick at night.
24:44
No, I wasn't struck out on that one.
24:45
All right.
24:46
Keep going with what you're thinking.
24:47
But what I'm saying is like, sometimes those doubts will, will hit you and so they creep
24:50
up and then, man, I just go into prayer and it's just like, it's just like, man, but when
24:54
those doubts hit me, sometimes I feel bad.
24:56
I'm like, why am I doubting God?
24:57
Right.
24:58
I'm actually curious because like, I think when on your maiden voyage on the forging
25:02
table, I said you have the disposition of a golden retriever, which is 100% true, like
25:06
you're just happy all the time.
25:08
I literally thought about the other day because there's a few people in my life that I ever
25:11
saw them get angry.
25:12
I would think the rapture was going to follow because it would just be like, Oh my gosh,
25:15
this person's angry.
25:16
You're one of those people.
25:17
But like whenever, whenever you get in these types of things, because we've all had the
25:20
dark night of the soul, we've all been in the valley of shadow of death, where's your
25:24
default Howard?
25:25
Because like, you know, again, most people in this audience know I'm pessimistic and
25:29
I go straight to the negative and things like that, but you just seem to have this overwhelmingly
25:32
positive disposition.
25:33
Well, I think it's the, what does it, Mark preached about a couple of weeks ago, Mark
25:37
Hitchcock, Faith Bible Church, Evan, pastor, but you know, all things work together for
25:42
the good of those who love him and are called according to his plans, right?
25:45
Like, and so I think that's, I saw that modeled with my father and my mother, your dad was
25:51
a pastor, right?
25:52
My dad was a pastor.
25:53
And so he had a lot of turmoil in his life.
25:55
I mean, being a pastor is not always the easiest thing and there's conflict in the church.
25:59
And so even at times, you know, you're in major conflicts with people you love.
26:05
And so he takes it with, he took it with a grain of salt, right?
26:09
And you keep your eyes on the bigger picture.
26:11
And so it's just keeping those things in focus of what are we here for?
26:16
You know, the thing I think about now that I have kids too, it's like more is caught
26:19
than taught.
26:20
Okay, and so how I respond and how I react, how my attitude is and how I deal with my
26:28
wife and I when we're in conflicts or how I deal with people.
26:30
And so that's caught, not just by my kids, but employees and those things.
26:35
And so I think it's just, that's kind of been hardwired for me.
26:38
Now, more on a personal thing, like, sometimes we can be just too flat on everything, right?
26:45
Like, we don't get wound up about things.
26:47
And so that's a balance in life too.
26:49
And so I have to find like, where's the righteous anger and those things.
26:52
And so that was a point in my life.
26:55
You know, I did some family counseling and that's the thing, right?
26:57
There's time to, and you're called to have anger and called to be for justice.
27:01
And so it's a good balance of both of those things.
27:04
Well, I think I don't think we have a lot of problems in modernity.
27:07
I don't think a lot of our problems culturally come from men caring too much, right?
27:11
It's from men completely advocating their responsibility and caring like not at all, right?
27:16
Why do we have fatherlessness because the men are very okay with siring, you know, children,
27:23
but not with fathering them, right?
27:25
And that becomes something that's, that's really harmful.
27:27
Zach, if you would go ahead, we need to keep this ball rolling.
27:30
Genesis 13, read 14 through the end of the chapter, which is verse 18.
27:34
The Lord said to Abram, after a lot had separated from him, lift up your eyes and look from
27:39
the place where you are northward and southward and eastward and westward for all the land
27:43
that you see I will give to you to your office and to your offspring forever.
27:47
I will make your offspring as the dust of the earth so that if one can count the dust
27:51
of the earth, your offspring also can be counted arise.
27:55
Walk through the length and the breadth of the land for I will give it to you.
27:59
So Abram moved his tent and came and settled by the oaks of Howard.
28:06
Mamre.
28:07
Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre, Mamre.
28:13
Which are at Hebron and there he built an altar to the Lord.
28:16
This next section is going to get awful, but, all right.
28:18
We need to give it to you.
28:20
That's okay.
28:21
Me and when to you.
28:22
Why do you think that happened?
28:23
Why do you think that happened?
28:24
Hey, I do look ahead, guys.
28:25
But look, when you get into verse 18, regardless of if this is Mamre or Mamre or whatever, ooh,
28:30
that's a gland.
28:31
Okay, we don't need to talk about that.
28:32
Don't worry about it.
28:33
It's a mention.
28:34
Yeah, we got a little biological there for a second.
28:36
But basically there was a renewed promise from God to Abram, and so that required a fresh
28:41
tribute of gratitude.
28:43
And so I think that's a good message for men, and I don't feel like I'm stretching the text
28:46
much here.
28:47
Some men will be like, well, I already said it, right?
28:50
So if they said it once before, whether that's, I love you or you did a good job or I'm proud
28:55
of you, they'll be like, hey, I said that like three or four months ago, right?
28:59
Why do you need to hear it again?
29:00
It's like, bro, we need to hear it often because what?
29:03
God could have very easily been like, Abram, I told you this once.
29:07
Do you not remember?
29:09
But God and his patience and his foreknowledge and all the things is like, hey, man, just
29:13
let you know.
29:14
Yeah.
29:15
Like, I know things seem weird.
29:16
You're old.
29:17
She's old.
29:18
None of this stuff has happened in all this.
29:19
We're years away from me fulfilling what I'm saying I'm going to do, but just a reminder,
29:23
this is what's going to happen.
29:25
And so in that moment, Abram actually, like he could read the room a little bit.
29:28
It's like, all right, it's time for some fresh tribute here.
29:30
Yep.
29:31
All right.
29:32
It's about that in the text where he says he's like, um, walk around in it.
29:37
In other words, I just wrote in there and check it out.
29:40
And I think, I mean, I think all of us are kind of outdoors guys like to be in nature.
29:44
Yeah.
29:45
Ryan, you're a big outdoors guy, right?
29:46
With a shirt.
29:47
Anyway, go ahead.
29:48
This shirt.
29:49
I like to be outdoors.
29:50
It's like a hip.
29:51
Al Borland.
29:52
Yeah.
29:53
That's what I was going for.
29:54
Let's not get too far behind.
29:55
That was my fault.
29:56
That was, that was my fault.
29:57
It was just in to the reaching manager.
30:00
To the point, it's like, when people buy land, they love to go be on their land.
30:04
And God's telling like, this is a gift I'm giving you.
30:06
Go, go and be in it.
30:08
Walk around in it and take it in.
30:10
And to me, when I'm in nature, you praise him more.
30:14
And so I think that's the piece that just stood out to me.
30:16
God's saying, go enjoy this gift I'm giving you.
30:19
The reason I took a shot at Ryan there is because I think a few months ago, I don't even
30:22
remember what we were talking about, but I was trying to get everybody to come up with
30:25
their like, in nature, experiencing God, where's that place where you most experienced and
30:30
people are like, yeah, I was in this, you know, I was in the mountains or was all that.
30:33
You were like, I was at a coffee shop in Italy, right?
30:35
So you were like in town.
30:37
I was like, but I see that just because you were outdoors, that doesn't count, right?
30:42
It's got to be outdoors away from civilization.
30:44
And we just couldn't bring you to a place where you're like, oh, you know, I saw the
30:48
architecture of like old Italy around God's creation, which is people in a, in a city
30:56
that was.
30:57
Which wasn't the setup, Ryan, like I was the one that gave the set up.
31:00
It's like whenever I come up with these great scenarios, these alternate universe scenarios,
31:03
everybody wants to change the scenario.
31:05
It's like jerks.
31:06
I'm the one creating the scenario.
31:07
You just have to operate inside of it.
31:08
Quick creating scenarios.
31:09
They're trying to make a point.
31:10
Like, what if this happened?
31:11
All right.
31:12
Here.
31:13
Check this out.
31:14
What if this happened?
31:15
What if you were in this piazza, right?
31:16
And you're sitting there and you're having coffee and then all of a sudden someone just
31:19
black bagged you, right?
31:20
Throw black bag over at you and they kind of, they take you out in the middle of nowhere.
31:24
Do you think you could like find yourself, find your way back to civilization or live
31:27
off the land?
31:28
Here's what's going to happen.
31:29
I'll be on the phone with you.
31:30
You'll hear it.
31:31
They'll pick up the phone.
31:32
You'll be like, I got a certain.
31:33
I got a certain.
31:34
Excuse me.
31:35
Mechanical.
31:36
My entire life will have led to that moment and I'm just like, you have no idea how much
31:39
I've been training for this.
31:40
Yes.
31:41
Like that dude buried my dog.
31:42
I'm coming after you.
31:43
Hey, hey, which by the way, this will get the audience a hint as to whether or not y'all
31:48
are well-adjusted people.
31:49
Do y'all and just be honest here, like don't, don't perform.
31:52
I literally sit in my house and I'm like, come on, today's got to be the day.
31:57
Someone's got to break in.
31:58
Like someone's got to break in while I'm here to where it's like, this is completely justified
32:03
righteous violence where I like, because you don't want to slip on your hardwood floors
32:06
and that's how you get taken out by the burglar.
32:08
I'm like, I will slowly peel my socks off and then like he doesn't know where I'm going
32:12
and then I'm just going to turn the lights off and then I'm just going to meander my
32:14
way around.
32:15
And then it's just like, oh my gosh, this is the best.
32:17
This is the best.
32:18
This is a violent Kevin McCouser.
32:19
Right.
32:20
Dude.
32:21
Yeah.
32:22
Okay.
32:23
Yeah.
32:24
The whole Malone scenario where he's like torturing people.
32:25
That don't kid hurt those guys.
32:26
No, you kill them.
32:27
They're in your house.
32:28
Kevin.
32:29
So am I the only one at the table that actually sits there hoping for this to happen?
32:31
Yeah.
32:32
It'll hope.
32:33
But I think about like, okay, what am I going to do?
32:34
You think about what you would do, but you don't hope for.
32:35
All I say is like, and I've talked to my kids about this because we have guns in the
32:38
house and they're like, well, if somebody breaks in the house, you're going to shoot
32:41
them.
32:42
I'm like, they're walking towards your room.
32:43
Yes.
32:44
I'm going to shoot them.
32:45
No, I'm going to shoot them.
32:46
If they're walking towards the pantry here, if they hear my gun and they run out the door
32:48
with my DVD player, my DVD player isn't worth somebody's life.
32:52
People still have DVD players.
32:53
Well, Blu Ray player or whatever, but go back at which is just trying to make a player.
32:57
I'm just saying, man, like just like, I don't want them to hear the fire.
33:01
I don't want to.
33:02
I don't want to know.
33:03
I'm there.
33:04
I don't even know.
33:05
I mean, I think there's strategies.
33:06
I think it was a comedian that said if somebody breaks into my house, they're going to
33:08
find me standing at the top of the stairs naked.
33:10
Look at that.
33:11
Dude, I'm going to Buffalo.
33:12
Oh, man.
33:13
It's psychological.
33:14
I'm going to screw with these guys.
33:15
Oh, my God.
33:16
You tucked it under there is a funny part of the fearless book.
33:22
So again, fearless, the story about him around my favorite book ever.
33:24
So he's, he's, I think, soaking in a tub or something like that.
33:28
And then somebody like is breaking into the house and he like gets out of the tub naked
33:32
and is like chasing this guy out of the house naked.
33:35
I'm like, that is the most manly thing.
33:38
No loin cloth, like no pants, just like, I will kill you and I'm naked.
33:42
And imagine you, you're killing the guys like breathing his last breath and he looks up
33:45
and he sees your junk and he's just like, Oh, man, I got killed by a naked guy.
33:48
Probably had an aunt by its on it.
33:51
He probably had what?
33:52
Oh, yeah.
33:53
That's another good story.
33:54
Guys, you got to read that book.
33:55
It's a fantastic book, but now I feel like this entire thing is going to be culminating
34:00
in this moment, which is Ryan, uh, you were going to read the first 16 verses of Genesis
34:07
14.
34:08
But we need to go right back to this.
34:10
Again, Ryan, just look at me.
34:11
Look at me.
34:12
Connect with me right here.
34:13
If you don't know how to pronounce it, look to you don't even have to look out.
34:16
You just stopped talking and Howard knows Howard knows the assignment.
34:19
How are you have to confidently confidently say whatever we're seeing here?
34:23
Okay.
34:24
Cause that's the thing.
34:25
All these pastors with their fancy degrees and their Bible colleges and stuff like that,
34:28
they don't know how any of this crap is pronounced either.
34:30
Right?
34:31
They're just saying it confidently.
34:32
Right?
34:33
Okay.
34:34
So Ryan, if you run into any problems in these first 16 verses, Howard's here for you.
34:37
Ready?
34:38
Set.
34:39
Go.
34:40
In the days of anthral, King of Shinar, Ariak, King of Elsar and Chudalar.
34:45
All right.
34:46
And the coward.
34:47
Chalorium.
34:48
Chalorium.
34:49
Yeah.
34:50
All right.
34:51
Chalorium, King of Alhamd.
34:52
And Tidal, King of Goem.
34:53
These kings made.
34:54
Why do you guys start?
34:55
You're mind pronouncing them wrong?
34:57
It doesn't.
34:58
Dude.
34:59
No one knows.
35:00
That's the point.
35:01
But again, you don't even have to tee Howard up.
35:02
You just stopped talking, but keep going.
35:03
You're good.
35:04
You're doing great.
35:05
You're doing great.
35:06
Vere, King of Sodom, Biersha, King of Gomorrah, Chinab, King of Admah, and Shembar, King of
35:12
Zaboyam.
35:13
I think it's good.
35:14
That's good.
35:15
Those are good.
35:16
That's good.
35:17
And the King of Belia, that is Zor, Zor, and all these joint forces in the Valley of
35:23
Sidon.
35:24
That is the Salty.
35:25
12 years, they had served Chudorium.
35:28
I'm going to go with you.
35:31
Yeah, dude, I feel like that's like Jay Shandsharker for Mike.
35:36
Just start saying that.
35:38
I want to call him Cheeto.
35:41
But in the 13th year, they were Beld in the 14th year, Cheddar, and the King Sewers with
35:51
him came and defeated Rapham in a Howard, Ashton, Astrath, Carniam, Azuzium, and Ham.
36:01
And M.M., Tinshanevah, Kierka-rathom, and the Hill Country of Sarah.
36:08
As far as El Peran and the border of the wilderness, then they turned back and came to end Mishpot,
36:15
that is Kadesh, and defeated all the country of Amakolites and also the Amorites who were
36:20
dwelling in Hazan Tamar.
36:22
Then the King of Sodom, the King of Gomorrah, and the King of Admah, and the King of Zaboyam,
36:26
and the King of Bea.
36:28
That is Zor, went out and they joined battle in the valley of Sidom with the Cheddar King
36:33
of Elam.
36:34
Title King of Gom, I'm from all King of Shannar.
36:37
Ariat King of El Sar, I am so sorry, Joby.
36:40
No, this is gone.
36:41
This is good.
36:42
Four Kings against five.
36:43
Now the valley of Sidom and full of bitumen pits and the Kings of Sodom and Gomorrah fled.
36:49
Some fell into them and the rest fled into the Hill Country.
36:53
So the enemy took all the possessions in Sodom and Gomorrah and their provisions and went
36:57
away.
36:58
They also took a lot in the son of Abram's brother, the son of Abram's brother who was
37:04
dwelling in Sodom in his possessions and went their way.
37:07
Then one who escaped came and told Abram the Hebrew who was living by the oaks of Mamre,
37:13
the Amorite, brother of Eskel and of Anir.
37:17
These were allies of Abram.
37:18
When Abram heard that his kinsmen had been taken captive, he led forth his trainmen born
37:23
in his house, 318 of them and went in pursuit as far as Dan and he divided the forces against
37:31
them by night.
37:32
He and his servants and defeated them pursued them to Hoba, north of Damascus.
37:40
Then he brought back all the possessions and also brought back his kinsmen a lot with his
37:46
possessions and the women and the people.
37:49
We don't normally do this, but I think that deserves a round of applause.
37:52
That was, man, that could have been one of the roughest experiences of your life.
37:55
You just leaned right into it.
37:57
But I feel like some of that maybe gets lost in all this is that, okay, this is war going
38:01
on between petty princes.
38:04
We see this even till today.
38:06
I was looking through some notes and it's like, we see skirmishes to this day in Arab
38:10
countries between rival chiefs and it's kind of like this.
38:13
It's not even technically warfare, but it's kind of the skirmish warfare, which is a different
38:17
kind of thing.
38:19
But the whole time I'm reading that section, I'm doing my best.
38:22
I can't even pronounce these right in my head, much less if I had to say them out of my
38:25
face hole.
38:26
But what gets lost here is that a lot, I bet he's wishing that he had separated from Abram
38:30
at this point, right?
38:32
Like Uncle Abram would have been a great person to have at his side right now, but it just
38:36
didn't work out that way.
38:37
Yeah.
38:38
Well, I think this also shows it affirms like this is what Moody said.
38:40
It affirms Abram's might and his prosperity.
38:43
So not only like, that's what I talked about when, when Lot was leaving, you know, like,
38:48
hey, my, his numbers just went down.
38:50
Well, we got to look at it in lots, you know, way he just got kidnapped because he didn't
38:54
have the numbers, but Abram still had the numbers along with his other buddies that came and
38:59
helped out to go after these kings and save them.
39:01
So it's, it's, it's, it just shows that, you know, you know, Abram's, Abraham's got it
39:07
all, you know.
39:08
Well, the thing is, is when you have money, because again, the, the trope is, you know,
39:12
money can't buy you happiness, but it can provide a buffer between you and anxiety.
39:16
Yeah.
39:17
So it's like, because we've all been there at different points of our lives, because
39:19
I don't think any of us come from like, you know, mountains of wealth or anything like
39:23
that.
39:24
But when someone goes wrong on the car and you don't have a lot of money in the bank,
39:27
it's like, that is, that's a real situation.
39:29
But yeah, I mean, if you, if you've done well and if God has blessed you well financially
39:33
and the transmission goes out, that sucks.
39:35
You wish it wouldn't have happened, but it's not going to like cripple your family.
39:38
And so, you know, in this type of situation, it's like, Abram's money isn't going to protect
39:42
him completely, but it does provide a buffer between him and, you know, it's like, kind
39:47
of like, if you're going to come at the king, you best not miss.
39:49
This is like, he's kind of the king in this scenario.
39:51
Well, I think the thing I took out of that is that, you know, as soon as Abram heard that
39:56
blot was in trouble, he came to the rescue.
40:00
And there was no like, Hey, I mean, I think you talked about it a couple, I mean, this
40:04
week or last week on the blade, you talked about, are we ready when we're called?
40:09
When Abram had prepared his men to be able to come to the rescue when they needed, right?
40:14
They were, most of them were herdsmen, but they knew how to go into battle.
40:19
And so Abram knew that he needed to protect his flock and he needed to protect his home.
40:24
And when he was called, he was ready.
40:27
And I think that's the thing for us as men, are we ready when we're called, whether that's
40:32
to go bury your dog at 3 a.m., whether it's to go help your, you know, help your friend
40:37
that has a car broke down, is it, you know, to go help when your daughter's heard or somebody's
40:42
threatening?
40:43
I mean, all of those scenarios that come up.
40:45
And then I think I was reading one of the commentaries that talks about second Timothy,
40:49
are we ready to preach the word when it's in front of us?
40:52
And so I think that was the piece that I took from this.
40:55
Are we ready night or day to do what we're called to do and trained to do what we need
40:59
to do as men?
41:00
That's awesome.
41:01
I think what really got me here was, like, just reading this, like, what did that battle
41:09
look like?
41:10
You know, like, how did it go in?
41:11
Like, there's not a lot of details.
41:12
It's almost like watching Gladiator 2 again, like you're missing a lot of details.
41:16
Why, you know, why are you hitting so bad on Gladiator 2?
41:19
Why are we going to do it to, like, there's like so many details in this that I'd really
41:23
want to know.
41:24
It's like, oh, man, you know, your problem, Ryan Horn, you walked into that theater expecting
41:28
Gladiator 1.
41:29
And it wasn't Gladiator 1, you can't redo the best movie of all time.
41:33
It was a sequel, and guess what?
41:35
There's multiple sequels coming.
41:36
So they didn't tie up all the loose ends because they have to leave loose ends or you don't
41:39
need another movie.
41:40
I feel like it was the ancient Rome sequel of Training Day or prequel.
41:45
I haven't seen it.
41:47
No, no, no, no, no, here's how I was waiting for them to be like King Kong ain't got nothing
41:51
on me.
41:52
Okay, no, you weren't actually waiting on that because here's the thing, Zach, when you
41:55
go and you watch, because by the time this comes out, you will have watched Gladiator 2.
41:59
Don't expect Gladiator 1, because if you go in thinking, oh, it's going to, it's going
42:03
to be a big task, but I wonder if they're going to outdo the first one.
42:06
You go in knowing there's no way they can outdo the first one, not every plot point is going
42:11
to be taken care of.
42:12
Now, there are issues with Gladiator 2.
42:14
There are certain scenes that were long, like longer than needed to be.
42:17
There are certain narratives that didn't really matter that much, but it's one of the most
42:20
visually impressive movies that I've ever seen in my entire life.
42:23
And there's more to come.
42:25
So stop being a hater, Ryan.
42:26
You agree with what he just said?
42:27
I don't, visually, it's great.
42:29
I don't think it's visually the greatest movie.
42:30
Because at this point, it's like off my list, I'm not going to watch it at all from what
42:33
I'm hearing.
42:34
Oh, no, you should watch.
42:35
You should watch it.
42:36
Because of this doof?
42:37
Like you're going to not watch it?
42:38
I'm not going to say don't watch it.
42:40
Okay.
42:41
I'm just saying like, when you create, when you create Gladiator and I get it, not all
42:45
sequels are going to be like Godfather Part 2.
42:48
You know?
42:49
Also a terrible movie.
42:50
Talking about Gladiator 2.
42:51
It took the guys six hours to make a point that Christopher Nolan made in one line in
42:56
The Dark Knight, which is basically, if you live long enough, you become like the greatest
43:00
probably sequel of all time.
43:02
But it took them six hours to realize like, Hey, at some point, you're the one that becomes
43:06
the bad guy.
43:07
It took them six hours to basically say that.
43:09
You really want to know why I'm really like sad about Gladiator 2.
43:13
You know who was written by the writer of the town?
43:16
I thought really Scott wrote it.
43:18
I know he directed it.
43:19
Is the writer, the guy who wrote the town, which this guy's a prolific writer, like he's
43:24
a great writer.
43:25
I was a little let down because I just felt like there was so many extra narratives in
43:29
there that they could have expounded upon rather than that they were underdeveloped.
43:33
Yeah, they're underdeveloped.
43:34
You had too many characters that weren't developed.
43:37
You didn't have a, you know, and have very many developed characters.
43:39
And so that's where I was just like, like, I like the story.
43:43
Dude, the story of the first Gladiator was awesome.
43:46
And that's where I'm looking at this.
43:47
Like this is like an interesting story like Abraham's cousin or nephew just got kidnapped.
43:54
He takes a bunch of guys like a, like, I don't know, like a gangster, you know, and just
43:59
like goes and gets him back.
44:00
Like what did that battle look like?
44:01
I mean, he had archers, he had people like how many people died, you know, like what
44:06
went down, you know, like I watched a movie.
44:09
There's a, there's like the story of the Bible.
44:11
It's like on TNT was back in the 90s.
44:13
I think like Richard Harris plays Abraham and they show this scene and like Abraham like
44:17
shows up with all these archers and like, but there's like no battle.
44:20
It's like Abraham's like, why should we fight?
44:22
Oh my gosh.
44:23
Like let's like, you know, it's just like there is like, I was just like, oh man, dude,
44:28
you know a battle went down right there, you know, and so, but that's what made me like
44:33
when I'm reading this, you know, I'm like, man, I wonder what really happened 318 guys.
44:37
Moral of the story.
44:38
Watch Gladiator to come up with the cool thing about in the reason why, yeah, we had some
44:43
fun with you reading that Ryan, things like that.
44:46
This is real history.
44:47
No, it is.
44:48
Like these are real people that actually existed in history, but there is one word that I want
44:52
to key on because Howard, you kind of brought this up in verse 14, when Abram heard that
44:56
his kinsman had been taken captive, he let he led forth his trained men born in his house.
45:03
So this is my commercial that I say all the time to people that if you are not equipped
45:09
to fight, if you are not trained for the fight and the fight comes to you, you will not be
45:14
prepared.
45:15
And some people think to themselves, Oh, I live where there's police.
45:18
I don't need to.
45:19
I don't need to know how to fight.
45:20
I don't need to know how to shoot because I can just call the police.
45:22
So guess what?
45:23
When seconds count and help his minutes away, that's a terrible idea, but let's use this
45:26
in a biblical context.
45:28
That's why I love the first four chapters in EMI so much.
45:31
If God is calling you to do our particular work and that work requires protection and
45:36
physical preparedness and you are neither prepared physically or don't have the mindset
45:41
of a protector, you're at a deficit.
45:44
And so that's the thing that I don't understand is people will just read right this.
45:46
Oh, yeah, these are trained men.
45:47
And that's just kind of what it was like in those days.
45:49
Well, yes, like there, there were no slovenly, like, you know, people sitting around watching
45:55
Netflix in those days, everybody was working, right?
45:57
They weren't eating, you know, microplastics and all those types of things.
46:00
And so like these are, these were people that are pretty virile, but these men were trained.
46:04
There was no.
46:05
All right.
46:06
We see that lots been taken.
46:08
Okay.
46:09
Let's get some guys together.
46:10
Let's do P90X.
46:11
Let's take the next three months to really get in shape.
46:13
Let's start working with our spears and working with our bows and things like that.
46:16
They were ready to go and there are so many men that are just not physically ready and
46:22
they're also not mentally ready to pull the trigger.
46:24
I know a lot of people that can still carry that when the time comes to shoot, they're
46:27
probably going to leave their pistol in their pants because they've not made the decision
46:30
that I'm going to take life.
46:31
I'm going to act.
46:32
I'm going to put myself in harm's way to protect someone else.
46:34
So there's my commercial again.
46:36
No one has to like necessarily dunk on that.
46:38
But Ryan.
46:39
I'm not trying to dunk on it.
46:40
Like just kind of foreshadows next in the chapter, but Abraham's son, Ishmael, like if you go
46:47
back and look at the histrion, he's known as a expert archer.
46:51
That's what he's known for.
46:52
So you know that in this camp, there was training to militarize these guys to any type of battle
46:58
if it needed to go down.
47:00
That's right.
47:01
And again, there are going to be varying degrees of preparedness and things like that.
47:06
And we don't need to worship at the altar of preparedness, right?
47:09
There are certain guys that are worshiping at the altar of being a prepper and having
47:12
their, you know, their cans of beans in the basement and like shooting all the time and
47:15
all those types of things.
47:16
I think there's a way where you can go over the top, but being a man and not knowing how
47:20
to fight and not knowing how to protect the people around you, there's simply no excuse
47:24
for it.
47:25
There's another element of this too, I think, just reading through some of the notes, which
47:28
is when I first read it, I'm thinking, well, he's going to rescue his kin, right?
47:34
It's like a natural response.
47:36
But some of these notes say, you know, in reality, they had strife.
47:40
They separated.
47:41
Their relationship may not have been great.
47:44
But despite that, Abraham took action, or Abram at this point took action and went in
47:50
and basically practiced what Jesus said, which is sacrificial service, showing the love of
47:55
Christ.
47:57
So Abram was practicing brotherly love and overcame evil with good, and he had to risk
48:02
his own life to do that.
48:03
So if you're in a situation, I know I've been in situations like this where you're called
48:08
to do something for someone that maybe you don't have a great relationship with, it's
48:13
something to think about.
48:14
That may be exactly what God's calling you to do at that moment.
48:17
When I think in that moment, I feel like in modernity, we don't really have as much of
48:22
that natural protective mechanism of kin.
48:25
As it were, perhaps I'm speaking out of turn, but I do think that there's not as much of
48:29
that because in modernity, we're seeing a lot of people that are super isolated.
48:33
So this has been talked about a lot, but people aren't going to movie theaters anymore.
48:37
They're just staying home restaurants, right?
48:40
You walk in, there's nobody eating there, but there's like a bunch of brown bags on
48:43
the bar because people are ordering out and they're going and picking it up and the only
48:47
interaction they're having is with nobody because they've already paid for it.
48:50
They don't need to ask the person, "Yes, this is my name.
48:52
Can you grab my food?"
48:54
But I feel like we've lost a little bit of that natural instinct to want to protect people
48:58
that are our kin, but then also it's kind of the point I made in the episode about burying
49:03
your dog is when you find out certain guys are closer than blood.
49:07
When you, Ryan and Russ showed up, it's like, "I don't have a brother," but in that moment
49:13
I did in those types of things, but I didn't have a blood brother that I needed to go in
49:17
a venge, but I feel that same way about all you guys at this table and my extended foxhole.
49:22
I just feel like we've lost a little bit of that.
49:24
I can't exactly put my finger on one thing that would explain it.
49:28
It certainly feels that way.
49:29
Well, the Bible has a blueprint for that too, Ryan.
49:31
It says in many cases, "Don't go to your brother who's in a faraway place, but go to
49:36
your neighbor or go to your Christian brotherhood."
49:38
I mean, it's explicit, and so I think that's why it works.
49:41
That's one of our walk together, and that's why if somebody sticks a black bag over my
49:44
head and if he outside, I'm not going to worry.
49:47
You call me your brother right there.
49:48
You hear me?
49:49
You hear me?
49:50
You hear me?
49:51
You hear me?
49:52
Call Kyle Thompson.
49:53
He's been trained for this.
49:54
All right, guys, let's go and wrap up Genesis 14.
49:55
We will take a volunteer because it has been an absolute mass reading and I've been skipping
49:57
around, so we'll volunteer to read 17 through 24.
49:59
I'll do it through 17 through.
50:03
Just read the end of the chapter.
50:06
After his return from the defeat of Chedor Leomer and the kings who were with him, Don
50:13
Phonics, let's go.
50:14
The king of Sodom went out to meet him at the valley of Shaba, that is the king's valley.
50:19
And Malachizedek, king of Salem, brought out bread and wine.
50:22
He was priest of God most high and he blessed him and said, "Blessed be Abram by God most
50:28
high, possessor of heaven and earth, and blessed be God most high, who has delivered your enemies
50:33
into your hand."
50:34
And Abram gave him a tenth of everything and the king of Sodom said to Abram, "Give me
50:39
the persons, but take the goods for yourself."
50:42
But Abram said to the king of Sodom, "I have lifted my hand to the Lord, God most high,
50:47
possessor of heaven and earth, that I would not take a thread or a sandal strap or anything
50:52
that is yours.
50:53
Lest you should say, I have made Abram rich.
50:57
I will take nothing but what the young men have eaten and the share of the men who went
51:01
with me.
51:03
Let Aynor and Eschol and Mamre take their share."
51:09
So some very interesting things about this part here.
51:12
So we see this king that's described here.
51:14
This is one of the only kings that we see listed that seems to be a servant of God as
51:18
well.
51:19
And so that's very interesting.
51:20
But David Brown has a commentary, he had an interesting thing about verse 20.
51:25
So this is evidence of Abram's piety and valor for it was a priest that he offered the
51:30
tenth of the spoil, which is a token of his gratitude and an honor of a divine ordinance.
51:36
Because he didn't need to do this because it was customary for Arab tribes to take the
51:41
recovered goods, to take the spoils of war and of conquest.
51:45
And so Abram's actions here seem completely counter to what is customary.
51:50
And so again, if you're just reading through this without any understanding of history,
51:53
that's why some people are like, don't read commentaries, only read the words.
51:55
It's like, well, you would just completely flat out miss this because we're living in
51:59
our current context where we're downstream of all these cultural revolutions.
52:03
But at that time and still to this day, it's like, no, you keep your spoils.
52:07
Like there is no need to give away any of it, much less a tenth.
52:10
Well, I wonder if he like to test the king of Sodom so much because it's such a wicked
52:14
city that he doesn't want any part of the spoils.
52:17
And he just takes the men that came with him, the sodomites who came with him to help get
52:22
lot back and then gave them freedom.
52:23
Yeah.
52:24
I thought the same thing in this, I'm like, man, I wouldn't, that's what I want to separate
52:26
myself as much as I can from that guy.
52:28
But Mezzlet.
52:29
Melchizedek.
52:30
Melchizedek.
52:31
Like he's like, and that's the other thing about Melchizedek is that he's also a believer
52:36
in Yahweh and like, how does that, like, how would that make, you know, Abram feel, you
52:41
know, it's like he's finally like, this is a God who he's been talking to.
52:45
Who knows of other people, you know, hear God.
52:48
And so he's trying to get other people to believe, but he knows that Melchizedek.
52:52
Here's God.
52:53
And so there's almost like a priestly duty there and that's where he kind of gives the
52:56
tenth not out of like having to, but as a out of worship, you know, towards God.
53:02
So that's, that's where I got from the moody when I was looking at the moody commentary.
53:06
And a lot of, you know, as I read this and him dealing with Sodom, the king of Sodom,
53:10
it's a lot of proverbs coming out, being wise, not dealing with, you know, an evil king
53:16
or an evil person and not letting them become part of your life, not letting them have anything
53:20
over you.
53:21
And he says this much.
53:22
Yep.
53:23
Any last thoughts on Genesis 13 or 14?
53:26
Boys, we did good work today.
53:29
That was very, very good.
53:30
Well, guys, we're going to leave it there, but make sure you come back here next week
53:33
where we are going to dig into Genesis 15 and 16.
53:36
So Genesis 15 and 16, but before that you go, we are going to do a quick resilience boost
53:40
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53:45
Don't forget that we have a cross way.
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53:49
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53:51
And then also the best Bible software on planet earth is the Logos Bible software.
53:55
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54:36
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Remember, keep pushing back darkness, keep forging spiritual, mental and physical resilience.
55:05
You're seeking the Lion of Judah.
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