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0:48
This is undaunted life a man's podcast. I'm your host Kyle Thompson. Let's get into it.
0:54
All right, guys. Welcome back to the forging table. The mission of undaunted life is
0:58
equipping men to push back darkness with content that forges spiritual mental and physical resilience.
1:02
So at the forging table, you'll see a group of regular guys forging spiritual resilience
1:06
by digging into God's word. And we're welcoming all of you to come along on that journey with us.
1:10
So that's Matt, that's Zach. That's Derek guys. We're going to be getting into first Timothy
1:14
four. And I just got to tell you from the very from the very beginning from the jump, the first
1:18
like three verses of first Timothy four. There's so much there like I feel like and there's so much
1:26
throughout the rest of it. But like we could probably spend the entire time talking about the first
1:29
couple of verses. So I just want to read verses one through two. And that is like in the middle
1:34
of the sentence. So like verse three kind of keeps going. So I just want to read verses one through
1:38
two because there's a lot there. Now the spirit expressly says that in later or latter times,
1:44
some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teaching of
1:49
demons through the sincerity or insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared. Okay.
1:55
So a few things I want to point out until you guys up to talk about in latter times. Okay.
2:00
Everyone likes to say we're in the end times. But my goodness, like the things that are talked
2:05
about in this chapter, I can't think of a time that was this decaying in terms of society, right?
2:12
Because people like to talk about, oh, this is the craziest time in the history of whatever.
2:15
Okay, go back to World War II. Like that's that's pretty crazy stuff. But there wasn't a degradation
2:20
of culture. There was just slaughter happening. So latter times, the word depart there, the Greek
2:25
word used there is the same one for apostasize, where we're seeing people deconstructing,
2:30
we're seeing people moving away from the faith, like seeing people presenting their own version
2:35
of Christianity. And then specifically, I wanted to speak on deceitful spirits and teachings of
2:41
demons. I always describe that. I look at postmodernism. I look at Marxism. I look at the LGBTQ
2:49
revolution. I look at communism. I look at secular humanism. Those are the deceitful spirits and
2:53
teachings of demons, because in a lot of those worldviews, they sprinkle in a little bit of a
2:58
Judeo-Christian ethic. So it tastes enough like ice cream that you don't notice the diarrhea inside
3:04
of it kind of a thing. But I mean, guys, y'all can go wherever you want to there. Because,
3:08
again, just in those first two verses, there is a bunch to talk about before we get into the
3:13
rest of the chapter. Well, I'll say where I'm going to go. I'm going to go a different place to buy
3:17
ice cream than you go to buy ice cream. You know, you got enough enough in there to where they
3:23
don't notice. I was going to speak to the colorful language that comes out as well. What I was going
3:28
to say about the Bible. It all comes back to that tried and true narrative that was started in
3:36
Genesis 3, right? Did God really say? Does God say this? And so all of those things can be wrapped
3:43
up into the enemy, the devil, the demons, and his cohorts are going to come in and try to
3:51
get us to think like, did God really say that? Or does God's word really say, and like, if you
3:59
go back to last week and we're talking, does God really say it's got to be a man? Like,
4:04
is that really what's there? And so like, that's nothing is new under the sun. Like,
4:09
that's, that's, that's been something that Satan has been doing since the dawn of creation.
4:14
Absolutely, Matt. Okay. So Kyle, I'm glad you started there and paused us there because there's
4:20
so much in that first, in those first two verses one. Now the spirit expressly says, I found that
4:28
really interesting, right? Because he's saying spirit, capitalist, he's talking about the Holy
4:33
Spirit, like, hey, the Holy Spirit has revealed these things to us, which the Spirit still lives
4:37
and moves. And, and we have to be sensitive to the spirit and, and that we will depart by
4:44
devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teaching. Well, first, that's a bad idea. I mean,
4:48
that seems like a bad idea. But secondly, through the insincerity of liars, I tell my kids, so I,
4:54
I've got a 14 year old daughter and a 13 year old son, and I teach my kids, we watch movies and,
4:59
and always the good guy makes a deal with a bad guy. And I ask them, hey, is that a good idea?
5:05
No, because bad guys lie. They're not held to the same standards. And here, it, Matt, I'm so
5:10
glad you brought up Genesis because we know God's word says that the, the native language of the
5:18
devil is lies. That's what he speaks. And so he's very familiar with that. And it was either John
5:24
Eldridge or Mark Griskell that I was listening to a book and they talked about. That is the enemy's
5:28
native language. And we don't speak that. So when we're trying to communicate with him, we're behind.
5:33
Like he's lying. We don't hear it as lying. We assume everything's truth. And, and therefore,
5:38
we're not on guard. We're not prepared. And so Kyle, I think you're absolutely right is this
5:43
is the deconstruction of the way that we think. And it is lie with enough truth to be believable.
5:49
And so we don't always perceive it and we drink it down. Yeah. And I think the more exposure you
5:54
get to that, they talk about being your, your conscious is seared, which is like being cauterized.
5:59
It takes some time, but, you know, as you're exposed to it more and more, it becomes a dead
6:04
part of you. It's difficult to detach from and understand. And I think come back from. So you've
6:09
got to protect yourself in terms of who you're with and how you're interacting at all times.
6:14
Okay. So good point. So Zach, how do we do that? How do we, how do we stay sensitive and not get
6:19
cauterized or seared? It's a great, it's a big question. I think, yeah, go ahead.
6:26
I was just going to say, I think it's, I think it's getting into the word constantly. And I think
6:29
it's preaching to the gospel to ourselves. Alistair Begg talks a lot about like the gospel is not
6:35
something that we hear. And then we go, cool, got it. I'm a Christian. That should be something that
6:39
is so central to our belief that we are preaching that unto ourselves before we're preaching it to
6:47
anybody else on a daily basis because we are in constant need of the gospel and we do nothing.
6:52
We do nothing to gain any of our own salvation. And so we should always be preaching that to
7:00
ourselves. I think that's, those are two of the things that I would say. Well, no, on the preach,
7:04
real quick, Zach, on the preaching the gospel to ourselves part, we have to make sure we're
7:08
preaching the, the whole of the gospel because we've gotten in modernity. True. And I think this
7:12
potentially comes from the seeful spirits and the teachings of demons and people's whose
7:16
consciousness is consciousness is our seared is you're getting the gospel of God loves you.
7:22
That's it. But that's not that's not the gospel though. You don't understand
7:27
what a sacrifice Jesus made is if you don't understand your own depravity. Now, the opposite
7:33
side of the pendulum is you only talk about how depraved you are and how horrible you are and
7:37
how you're just a wretched sinner and all that. And that that's all you talk about. It's like,
7:40
no, God loves you in such an extreme way that he did something very extreme so that you could
7:44
be in his presence. But he had to do that because you suck so bad. Like you, you, and you didn't
7:50
suck so bad because you're a mistakeer, right? People talk about, Oh, I had some unhealth in my
7:54
life or I made some mistakes. It's like, no, no, I think the word you're looking for is sin.
7:57
I get some sin in your life and you were born into that you didn't have, you basically didn't
8:00
have an option. Right from the get go. But we get this kind of bastardized version of the
8:05
of the gospel. So if you're going to do what Alice Rebecca says, you should do, which I think in
8:08
general is pretty good advice. Like you, you've got to make sure that you are preaching the whole
8:13
gospel to yourself. I think the bastardized gospel would fall right into what Paul is talking about
8:18
here, about from liars. And like that, like, if we can say that the gospel is only God loves you,
8:26
like, that's a really inviting message to hear. And but that I think that falls right into that.
8:34
What he's what he's telling us to avoid there. I think what's the verse where it talks about,
8:41
you know, you look at yourself in the mirror, and then you walk away and you forget your image. I
8:45
mean, that to me is convicting. So how can you read this? How can you absorb it? And how can you
8:49
take it with you at all times in a way that you internalize it so that you're not putting yourself
8:55
in a situation where you're becoming cauterized? I mean, that's a question I'd throw back to you.
8:59
I mean, how how can you do that? I agree. I think you guys are spot on with the same way that I'm
9:04
thinking too, right? Like openly, foundationally read the gospel, understand it, apply it to your
9:09
lives. Oftentimes, right, if something really good happens in life, we like to look in the mirror,
9:16
but if something bad happens, we look out the window, right? And that that's the natural tendency
9:21
of self, which I think it should be the opposite, right, of saying something bad happens. Let's first
9:26
start in the mirror and say, all right, where is this on my shoulders? Did I fall short on this?
9:30
And I think that that's that's my desire that God's word does for people who are listening. And that's
9:37
my desire that God's word does for all of us, myself included. I think the other part to that Zach is,
9:45
I think you talked about this last week being in community and the desire of the church or the
9:49
design of the church is to be in community some way because nobody can read your nobody can read
9:55
their own label because they're inside the bottle. But you have people around you that can read your
10:00
label and say, Hey, look, I know that this might be a blind spot for you, but I see this behavior,
10:06
I see this activity, I see this perspective, I see this pride and I'm bringing it to you and I'm
10:10
pushing right what that requires is we have to push our relationship equity chips to the middle of
10:15
the table, say, Hey, I'm I'm pushing in and I'm betting, but I'm telling you this is what's
10:21
going to happen. And it takes a level of humility to receive that on the other side,
10:24
which again, happens as a result of God's word. Yes, 100%. It's it's effort. You've got to put
10:30
yourself out there, you've got to be in the word and you've got to be around people that are
10:33
challenging. Yep. When I would do want to spend a little bit more time talking about
10:38
Zach, kind of what you're talking about in terms of the consciousnesses, I can't say that word
10:41
out loud. Can somebody say that word, right? Conscience. Now it's it's the plural of conscience.
10:45
Conscience is is, conscience is God bless America. This is what I do for a living and I can't talk
10:50
but like the through the insincerity, the insincerity of liars, whose consciences are seared.
10:56
It's almost implied there. And again, I want to be careful when you use the word implied and then
11:02
you start talking about scripture guy because then you're getting into ice of Jesus territory.
11:05
But what you're implying there is that they they almost don't know how insincere their lies are
11:12
because they have a seared conscience. And so it's easy to talk about the conscience being seared
11:19
when you're looking in culture and how how a woman can walk into an abortion clinic to get her
11:24
fifth abortion and walk out and make a giggly TikTok video. You only get there if you have a seared
11:29
conscience. But specifically in these verses, they're talking about people that are devoting
11:34
themselves to the spirits and teachings of demons. And I just I think of so many cultural examples
11:42
of the teachings of demons, like how do you get drag queen story hour? Like, how does that happen?
11:47
Because nobody cared to talk about drag queens until you started bringing our kids into it.
11:51
And then it's like, wait, no, no, no, no, no, like you could do your depraved little crap over there
11:56
by yourself. But now you want to indoctrinate our children into it. You can look at it with
12:01
critical theory, you're bringing in critical race theory, you're telling the children of color in
12:05
the classroom that because of the level of melanin, or in their skin that they are lesser than and
12:09
they're oppressed. And you're telling all the white people in the class that regardless of how
12:13
you acted or what you do, or even your family history, that you are the oppressor. And it's like
12:18
these things are being taken in hook line and sinker and culture. And I believe in the last
12:22
episode, we talked about, you know, sub-Saharan Africa and Southeast Asia and all these other
12:25
places that don't buy into critical theory at all. Like, they don't buy into the trans ideology
12:30
and trans agenda that they're not having problems here, because they can lean on what the scripture
12:35
is saying, because they're not pretending as if these seared conscious ideologies of everybody
12:41
else like that actually makes sense. It's like, no, no, we're not going to go in that morality.
12:45
We're going to go on something else. Yeah, think about your conversation recently with
12:50
Sean McDowell and compelled speech at the end. Oh, yeah, at the end of last year. Yeah.
12:55
Yeah. So to me, it's, you know, you've got a group of individuals that have put themselves
13:00
in a position where they buy into a pronoun situation as an example. And you can sit there and hold
13:05
that at bay and it's out there. But as soon as they come to you and require that you have to say
13:10
something that's contradictory to what you believe, it's in your front doorstep. Yeah. And I think
13:15
now that's what we're dealing with. Because it used to be here are the words you can't say.
13:18
Now it's here are the words you must say, right? Like it's compelled speech versus here's the
13:22
speech that we would like to control. Yes. Right. Right. Okay. So one more thing on this and then
13:27
we'll cruise on maybe here to three and four is what I see about this is now the spirit
13:33
expressly says that in later times, some will depart from the faith by devoting himself. Okay.
13:37
Paul was talking, he's writing a letter to Timothy talking about something specific,
13:41
referring to something specific that was happening in the church in Ephesus at the time, right?
13:47
Yet here we are 2000 years later, referring to stuff that's happening in our church and society.
13:54
And so there's this underlying theme. And I think we can't be oblivious to the fact that
13:58
there is a constant battle, a real battle going on between good and evil, light and dark and a
14:05
constant overthrow or appeal usurp of trying to usurp authority from a real enemy against a real
14:13
God, a hundred percent agree with that. And some of it looks like vertical theory, some of it looks
14:18
like word of faith, God wants you to be rich. Like, so some of it, you can go, Oh man, yeah,
14:24
I would never believe that. But if I give enough money to my church, God's going to bless me with
14:28
millions of dollars. And so that like, there are so many avenues that Satan can take to try to divide
14:35
the body of Christ. And I think that's why always going by what standard, by what standard are we
14:41
going on? Always goes back to the Bible. Yeah, if you don't believe it's real, go back to Lewis's
14:45
challenge, right? Can you can you spend five minutes and not send according to the standard?
14:50
And almost nobody can, almost literally nobody can. So if you don't think it's real, try it.
14:55
It's real to real battle. Yeah, light and dark. Okay, cruising on. All right, let's let's go
14:59
here. Verse three, I think is interesting for there are liars who forbid marriage and require
15:05
abstinence from foods that God created to be received with Thanksgiving by those who believe
15:09
and know the truth. From what I read, I, I believe Paul was referring to a specific group of people
15:16
inside the church of Ephesus who were forbidding, you know, calling people to abstinence and
15:21
forbidding marriage and calling certain foods, unclean, even though they had been called clean.
15:28
Is that what you guys saw as well? I do. And I think you can, you can,
15:31
carry that out a few thousand years later to the Catholic church. Like he's, he's literally
15:37
preaching against some of the practices of the Catholic church before, before what we know is
15:41
a modern day Catholic church existed with priests being called to celibacy and not marrying. And
15:48
like, I thought that was interesting. I've never, I've never really thought about it that way. But
15:52
then, you know, what I'm looking at is like, Oh man, don't like, don't be married. Interesting.
15:58
That's an interesting thing to say. So I, there's some interesting correlations to me.
16:03
I agree. I do find it interesting, you know, he's saying, Hey, it's not wrong to, it's wrong to
16:07
forbid marriage yet in one letter, Paul appeals saying, Hey, it's better if you aren't married,
16:12
right? Be like me. So that way, we're all married men. You understand the challenge, right? If
16:17
sometimes choosing your wife or choosing a passion or the church or serving or something like there,
16:21
it's constant. There's attention to be managed there. Okay, cruising on for verse four, for
16:28
everything is created by God is good. Everything created by God is good. And nothing is to be
16:33
rejected if it is received with Thanksgiving, for it is made holy by the word of God and prayer.
16:39
There's a lot there. Yeah, that's a big, that's a big statement sentence in the Bible. What do you
16:45
think? Well, and even even in the first part, for everything created by God is good, most people
16:49
think that's referring to what was talked about in verse three, which is referring to marriage
16:53
and referring to food and all those different things. But that can be extrapolated out even
16:56
further to just talk about like, if God created something, he created it for good. I got a message
17:01
the other day about the intro out from music of this podcast. And people were talking about,
17:06
well, there are demon notes. And I was like, what is that? And then it was like, Oh, no,
17:11
there are certain notes in music and there are certain tones and certain things that are demonic
17:16
by their very nature. And I said, what I didn't really get into along back and forth with this
17:20
person, because it's like, Hey, if you don't like the intro out your music, like you can easily
17:23
skip it like I know it's not everyone's cup of tea. It's what I like, you know, it's my show,
17:26
like if you want to create your own show and have, you know, different music, go for it.
17:30
But this idea that there are tones that God can't use for his glory, because there are
17:37
gospel centered brutal bands that when you're listening to them with an untrained ear, you're
17:43
like, Oh my gosh, this is clearly satanic. And it's like, these are all Bible believing Christians
17:47
that are playing chords on their guitar and they're singing things. And like, they're singing the
17:51
verse, but in your ears, it's like, but wait a minute, it's like God created everything for good.
17:56
And you're thinking he can't redeem it. You think that he can't, like there are categories of things
18:00
that he can't work in. And you can get it as minute as particular notes and songs.
18:04
Yeah, I think that Paul has something to say about that in Romans, the sovereignty of God,
18:09
who are we as the as the clay to tell the potter? Like, why did you make me this way? Like can God,
18:15
I mean, God, he literally says, God said to Moses, I'll have mercy on whom I've had mercy on. I will,
18:23
I don't remember the rest of the verse. I'm not in there, but like basically he's talking about his
18:27
sovereignty. Like there are things that he created for for evil that will be that will go to destruction.
18:34
And there are things that he has has made for good. And we don't get to question that.
18:39
I think he talks about Job two in there, like God is sovereign.
18:43
That's a really, I don't know, deep hold. I mean, there's so many things in that,
18:48
but bring it back to this for just a second. When you think about that, in that same sense,
18:52
he also, I believe references Pharaoh and he references that he hardened his heart eventually
18:56
after so many. And at that point, it kind of goes to the same thing where Pharaoh was essentially
19:01
cauterizing himself against unbelievable evidence. And then eventually he just, he hardened his heart
19:07
and that was the situation. So I think that's another warning for why we want to be extremely
19:12
careful about what environments we put ourselves in. I agree. I mean, for me, it's like, okay,
19:18
for everything created by God is good. How far does that go? Yeah, because Kyle,
19:23
I have never heard of demon notes ever. That was news to me. That's a brand new concept.
19:28
And I go back to really surface level things like think about diet fads. You know, one day
19:33
you're just supposed to be eating meat and the next day you're supposed to be avoiding carbs and
19:36
all this stuff. Well, Jesus ate bread and all that sort of thing. Everything's good. And the
19:40
Bible says that, you know, essentially, you should have everything in moderation to an extent. You
19:43
should enjoy it, not puts one thing on a pedestal. So one to the to the moderation piece as well,
19:49
like everything that's outside of moderation or outside of God's like intent for that thing
19:55
becomes sinful. And so it's like food in and of itself is not a sinful thing. That's how we
20:00
nurse ourselves is how we move on. God gave us taste buds, which is a mind blowing thing,
20:05
because he could have just given us the ability to digest food. But no, he gave us the ability to
20:09
enjoy it. Like, that's a good thing. But also sex is a very, very good thing. There are parts of
20:13
our bodies that their only purpose is to make us feel good. They serve no other physiological
20:18
purpose, right? And kids, if you're listening to this, ask your parents. But like, that's the
20:22
thing that's very interesting about about that is like, but then if that becomes your idol. And
20:26
if you have that outside of the covenant of one woman for life, under under the covenant of of
20:32
marriage before God, then it becomes sinful. So the same thing with all of this is it's like,
20:36
okay, are there bands out there that will use the same notes or the same whatever? I don't know
20:42
anything about music, but they'll play the same guitar riffs. And yet, as opposed to having a gospel
20:48
centered lyrics and music and trying to praise God through that, they're trying to bring people
20:53
towards darkness. Well, yeah, it's like, there's nothing wrong with the note. Like, it's how it's
20:58
being used in who it's serving. Well, I think that's to the point, right? Like, and nothing is to be
21:04
rejected. So I looked up rejected and it means despised or abominated. It means twisted to become
21:09
sinful and outside of God's intended purpose. I think so my mind, so I did. I think I think God's
21:19
word has layers, right? I mean, there is the surface layer and then God can also have two or
21:24
three different meanings with the same statement. And so when I read that, I almost think everything
21:29
created by God created in the image of God is good. What about people, right? People who have been
21:37
abominated, despised, who have been twisted or become sinful. They're not, they're not outside
21:44
of God's redemptive power. But when something gets twisted, despised or abominated, yeah, that's,
21:51
it becomes not good at that point. It becomes not good. But they're not outside of redemption.
21:55
They're not too far for God to reach and to pull back. What almost feels like as well, when you go
21:59
back where it's talking about forbidding a marriage and abstinence of foods, it goes back to when
22:04
we were talking in Galatians about, okay, yeah, yeah, you know, grace your faith and all that, but
22:08
gospel plus, right? You know, grace your faith and like that kind of thing. And so it's like, okay,
22:15
people had to almost like, I think all of us have worked in an office at some point,
22:20
where somebody who was not good at their job was doing a really good job of pretending
22:24
by just being really busy. And so they're just moving stuff like they would move their cup
22:28
of pins from this part of their desk or that part of their desk because they read, you know,
22:32
half an article about six Sigma and, you know, making things, you know, even more efficient and
22:36
that kind of thing. It's like, but they're not doing anything. They're not producing anything.
22:40
But it makes them feel like they're doing something. It's like they're whether they're shuffling
22:44
the deck chairs on Titanic. It's like, it seems like work, but it's actually useless. I feel like
22:49
there's a little bit of that as well to where it's just like, it's this creation of confusion. Like
22:54
you're almost giving this ideology like I'm doing something here by adding standards that God would
22:59
not say as a standard. Yep. Think about how practical the Bible is. I mean, going back to your point
23:04
on sex, it basically says, make sure that you and your wife are taking care of each other and
23:09
not neglecting each other because I've essentially created you to where this is necessary. It's not
23:14
putting it on a pedestal and glorifying it like culture does, but it's very practically saying,
23:18
make sure that you're taking care of each other. And to me, that's just one other reason why I
23:23
think the Bible is so true. He's talking about sex, ladies and gentlemen, in case you were wondering,
23:26
you know, we were you didn't want to say the word because he's a nice guy, but you know,
23:30
it just kind of is what it is. But like, guys, that's another thing that I'm struck by whenever
23:34
you're reading the Bible is if you read through it and you're busy and you're distracted mentally,
23:39
how easily could you buzz through these first four or five verses and not even think about it?
23:43
Yep. And it's like, there's so much here. I mean, we spent a little over 20 minutes just
23:47
talking about those first few verses and we got to move on. But that's that's the reality of
23:50
scripture guys is allow the Holy Spirit to help you understand. And what you need to do, what you
23:57
need to bring to the table is concentration and quiet. And so there are times, and I'm the worst
24:02
about this. Like, I can't stand silence. I need this podcast is over. Need to go to the next one,
24:06
where it's going to be a two time speed, because we got to get things done. We got to listen to
24:09
the thing. And then oh, now it's time to read the book. Okay, blah, blah, blah. And then now I'm
24:12
trying to go to sleep. Well, I got to take, you know, melatonin, because otherwise my brain's
24:15
been moving too fast. It's like, no, no, bring yourself quietly to the scripture.
24:18
If you need to turn on brown noise or white noise maker or something like that, that's great.
24:22
But bring your attention to what? What do you shake? What is brown? What is brown? Okay,
24:26
all you you racist go to YouTube right now and type in brown noise. It's different than white
24:31
noise. Okay. I don't know what the difference is. But when I searched for white noise at one point,
24:36
I got brown noise that popped up. Y'all can look at me like I'm crazy. I don't give a crap.
24:40
I don't know how many thousands of people just just paused what they were doing. Pause this to
24:47
just go to YouTube to see if brown noise was a thing. Probably as many that pause to go look
24:51
up demon notes a little while ago, probably I was making a good point. And you jack waggers
24:56
decide to get we derailed it. But I do want to get I do want to get to verse eight here because I
25:01
know people are going to be like, okay, God, you know, you know, please make sure that these guys
25:05
cover that because I do spend a lot of time on the show talking about making sure you're physically
25:09
resilient, making sure that you work out. I get asked about workouts all the time. Maybe that's
25:13
something that we'll do in the future. So guys can can get squared away. But verse eight here,
25:17
for a while bodily training is of some value. Godliness is a value in every way as it holds
25:23
promise for the present life and also for the life to come. So here's the thing about verse eight.
25:30
I feel like a lot of people want to focus on one part of that verse and not the entire verse.
25:35
Okay, people need to focus on both part because because they just they typically fat people.
25:40
They want to dismiss the first part shut up there. But they it's like for a while bodily training is
25:45
of some value. So what they say is like, Oh, I don't need to exercise at all because that's
25:50
just of some value. Now I'm going to pretend I'm going to spend all that time I would have spent
25:55
taking care of my body. And I'm going to put that into godliness and how that's of major value.
26:01
That's part of the reason why we talk about spiritual, mental and physical resilience.
26:05
If you only focus on physical resilience, it will be to the detriment of the other two areas.
26:10
If you only focus on spiritual resilience of all the categories, that's the best one. But you still
26:16
have the mandate to focus on mental and physical resilience. And so that's the thing for me there.
26:21
I think people, especially pastors, they've used this scripture and scriptures like this to say,
26:27
Hey, I'm so busy with the word. I'm so busy with prayer and I'm so busy with ministering.
26:33
I just don't have time to take care of myself. And I've heard literally heard people tell me,
26:36
yeah, hey, you know, Kyle, I, you know, I would work out and I would buy a diet and all that. But
26:40
man, I'm just too busy with my kids. And it's like, okay, well, you're deleting about 10 years of
26:44
experience with your grandkids because you're going to die early, assuming all things are created
26:48
equal. And so I want y'all to kind of talk about that because I know I'm like the extreme got to
26:52
work out guy. But you know, it's just, well, I think, I mean, I think certainly that God has gifted us
26:56
a body, an earthly body that we should steward appropriately. And we should train our body. And
27:03
like you're saying, like we shouldn't, we shouldn't just not work out and then miss out on, you know,
27:08
gifts of spending time with our grandkids. But I think that can become people's idols too.
27:14
Because like, what's more important? Like, it is, it is good to a certain extent. But at the end of
27:21
the day, it is still only our earthly body. But I think there's balance. There's got to be a balance
27:29
like you can't just say, add a heck with it. I'm not going to work out ever. But you also can't just
27:33
that. This is my worship because then it's then it's an idol. So well, to me, it's another practical
27:38
element. I mean, I'm not an expert in historical writing. But the fact that this was written several
27:42
thousand years ago by Paul and he acknowledges very plainly that, you know, bodily training is of
27:48
value was was a big thing for me to say, yeah, that that aligns with what all of the science is
27:52
saying today. And he you know, he says that we should be doing it. So don't put it on a pedestal.
27:56
Yeah, really good point. Well, even at that time, like I've always wondered like, what if we were
28:00
able to be plopped down 2000 years ago into these areas? Like, I think like, what if I had been
28:05
born in like 1902? And then like, would I have been a major league baseball player? Because
28:10
were these people like, because you look at these old videos, it's like, these aren't athletes.
28:14
Like, I remember Matt, like, because you when I first started getting into soccer in college,
28:18
like you were like the best soccer player that I knew. And you did think so so easily. And then
28:22
you look at these old videos of these soccer matches, and it's like, all these people are slow,
28:27
all of them are terrible. And so if you think about 2000 years ago, there's no keto diet,
28:32
there's no like, tabata, things that people are working out and doing like, did they even know
28:37
what pushups were? Like, they weren't bench pressing and squatting and deadlifting and those
28:41
types of things. They were just living their life. But even in that culture, there's acknowledgement
28:46
that you do need to take care of your body. Now, what I see has happened as we see just about
28:52
everything, everything bends towards idolatry. And we live in a culture now, and it's really
28:57
especially weird with with women now. And maybe, maybe this isn't the time to talk about it. But
29:01
yeah, people that are just absolutely obsessed with their bodies, and their own Instagram,
29:05
and they're, you know, on YouTube and all that. And you have these bodybuilders that are pretending to
29:09
not be on, you know, trainable and all these other like steroids and all that. And you're comparing
29:15
yourself to these people. And you know, they've got the perfect triceps and the perfect ab and,
29:19
you know, they make the make the V and then you've got these women, you know, they're attracted to
29:23
guys with dadbods, but then they have boulder shoulders. And it's just like, I feel like we've
29:28
bent towards the idolatry of the body as if the temple is what saves us, right? The temple of the
29:34
body. We're made to worship. We're made to worship. We either worship God or we worship
29:39
something else. And that like, that's it. Like if you break it down, it's pretty, it's pretty
29:44
simple. So we're either worshiping God or we're worshiping, whatever. And for some people, yeah,
29:48
that's working out. Well, and I think Kyle to your point there and that to your point as well is,
29:52
go back and look at verse seven, have nothing to do with irreverent, silly myths, rather train
30:00
yourself for godliness. That's the over. I mean, first, godliness is the overarching goal, right?
30:05
You look up godliness and it talks about reverence and respect and piety towards God. Like having
30:10
this rep, we talked about it in verse Timothy three about godliness and how that is the goal.
30:17
But I do, I do think it's funny, have nothing to do with irreverent, silly myths. I looked up
30:22
silly there. I was reading it and it, did you look it up? It's fit only for old women is the actual
30:28
translation there. Why they hate no, no, I don't get it. Like, I don't, I don't know anything that's
30:32
he set himself up for some later chapters here in this letter, which I think is hilarious. Like
30:39
just Paul's kind of passive aggressive nigs there are pretty funny, but the goal here is godliness.
30:45
The goal is godliness in words of faith and good doctrine in reverence, respect,
30:49
piety towards God. And we will, we will worship. I do think Kyle to your point. And that's why I love
30:55
undaunted dot life of man's podcast is because we you push not just one area of resilience. Like,
31:04
hey, we're not just going to push back darkness in one area of life. We're going to push it back
31:08
in three areas of life because discipline in one area of life lends itself towards discipline
31:14
in other areas of life. But in part of it, Derek, to that is preparedness. So I had something that
31:20
happened literally yesterday. So yesterday I had was first time in my life where I thought I was
31:27
going to have to actually pull my pistol. It was a very intense moment. I'll try to be brief for
31:32
the story just so we can, you know, say the point and make the point. But I always typically position
31:37
myself to where I can see the door just kind of out of habit so I can kind of scan and see what's
31:41
going on in a very, very small restaurant in Oakland City. So everyone's kind of on top of each other.
31:45
And I see a man walking the sidewalk outside the, you know, the front windows and he's just kind of
31:52
pacing back and forth. And he's just something off about him because he had like really nice
31:56
sunglasses on, but he was wearing like coveralls like he was working, but then he had a nice jacket
32:00
over his cover. Also, it was just something was off about him. He's carrying a backpack.
32:03
And then he walks to the window slowly. He's peaking in the window, looking at everybody,
32:08
getting really, really close to the window. And so my buddy's talking, but I'm not really paying
32:11
attention to it. I'm paying attention to this guy. And then he, he pulls out, he doesn't pull out
32:15
anything, but he turns his hand into like what, whenever you make like a finger gun, and then he
32:20
starts shooting through the window with his fake, you know, finger gun at the people that are inside.
32:25
And at this point, I'm like, Oh, okay. This is it. It's going down. Then he walks in. So at this point,
32:32
I've got my hand on my pistol. It's on the safety. It's like, I have no idea what's about to happen,
32:35
but it's about to happen quickly. He's about 15 feet away from me, like really, really close to me.
32:39
And this is one of those places where they don't really have like a lobby area. You're just kind
32:42
of standing around until someone notices you and then tries to seat you. And so he picks up a menu,
32:46
and he's pretending to look at the menu, but he's looking through his glasses at everybody else in
32:50
there. And it was, it was just one of those moments where it's like, I could feel, you know, from
32:55
Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman's book, you know, I could feel my body preparing for violence,
33:01
preparing for something. Because at this point, I'm so tuned up. I'm like, if he reaches in his,
33:07
his coveralls, something has to happen. If he reaches into his backpack, something has to happen.
33:12
And I'm going because I'm the only one paying attention. Like everyone else that's in the
33:16
restaurant is oblivious to this guy. And then he starts like kind of talking and like saying
33:21
things to people at different tables, and they don't even notice that he's saying things. And then,
33:24
you know, luckily, he walks out. Okay. And, you know, he walks down the sidewalk. One of the
33:30
servers went out like a moron and was like trying to, you know, engage the guy in a conversation,
33:34
then he started coming back. And, you know, then around that time, that's when people started to
33:38
tune in and be like, Oh, what's going on? And like, you know, what was wrong with that guy?
33:42
But in that moment, there's no time for training. There's no time for a lot of internal dialogue.
33:48
If he had pulled a pistol or a knife or something like that, I was the first line of defense for
33:55
everybody, every image bearer of Christ in that room. Luckily, nothing happened. Nothing had to
34:02
happen. But there was a level of preparedness that I had made well before that happened. So,
34:09
physically, I was prepared, because like, if you can stop something from happening without
34:15
killing someone or maiming them, then that's what you do. So years and years of wrestling,
34:19
years and years of jujitsu, but also mindset, because there are wrestlers and jujitsu fighters
34:24
that would never get into a fight in public, because there's no mats. You're not wearing a
34:27
ghee and there's no timer or something like that. But that's why I always get down to people to
34:32
where it's like, you know, they're spiritual warriors, right, that they've got that nailed.
34:36
But physically, if God required them to do something that required their physicality, would they be
34:40
ready? Because imagine a prayer warrior in that room. What are you going to have a Bible study?
34:46
The guy pulls out a gun and starts shooting people, image bearers of Christ. How are you
34:50
going to push back that level of darkness in that exact moment? If you, you know, we saw this where
34:56
there's several examples and culture of people seeing like there was a story, you know, Loudon
35:02
County that happened, you know, a few years ago, where, you know, this transgender student is
35:08
raping a girl in the stall, ain't only raping a girl in the stall in the school. And months and
35:13
months and months after this story broke, it was found out that there was a school teacher that
35:19
walked into the bathroom and saw two sets of feet underneath the stalls. And if you're being
35:24
annually raped, I'm assuming you're not exclaiming joy in that moment. And they didn't do anything.
35:29
They walked out, reminded me of the Sandusky at Penn State. He's raping a boy in the bathroom.
35:36
And one of the graduate assistants, who's a big guy, like, yeah, he was a big guy. Yeah, big guy
35:41
sees Jerry Sandusky raping a child and leaves and my calls his dad and asks him what he should do.
35:46
And so I guess that's part of, I know this is kind of a long soliloquy here, but that's
35:50
one of those things where like people when I'm, I'm talking about the practicality of pushing
35:55
back darkness in the moment. And so when men only want to read books and they only want to go to
36:00
church and they only want to do those things, those things, obviously, we see here from verse 8,
36:04
are of the utmost importance to prepare yourself spiritually and to lean towards godliness.
36:11
But if you were incapable of protecting the sheep of image bearers of Christ,
36:16
like, is that good? And I'm not saying everyone has to be an MMA fighter. I'm not saying that
36:21
everybody needs a concealed carry. But like, in that moment, like in that restaurant or in that
36:26
bathroom or something like that, that's not the time for exegetically explaining to somebody why
36:31
what they're doing is wrong. You have to stop it. I agree. You look at a guy like Dietrich Bonhoeffer,
36:35
like he's no slouch when it comes to intellect, right? He was physically fit. He played sports and
36:40
did things with his students because he was physically fit. So he was very short and stature,
36:47
and one of the greatest minds of the early 20th century, but was also physically fit. But no
36:56
one would say Dietrich Bonhoeffer was a gargantuan wrestler type guy who could knock somebody out
37:02
with one punch, but he was physically fit because that was important. And he wasn't afraid to take
37:06
action. Exactly. And I think that's a great point, Kyle. Not being afraid to take action to protect
37:11
the image of God is, in my opinion, a form of a that is an aspiration of godliness because I want
37:19
to protect others. And I want to use my God given strength, physical strength, mental strength,
37:23
emotional spiritual, all of those strengths to protect or pursue God's other creation.
37:29
Yeah, I'd add one thing to that because I think everything you just said is exactly right. And
37:33
I'll make this really short, but I've got an experience that I had a couple months ago, took
37:36
my family on a cruise won't say the cruise line, etc. I found myself sitting by the pool and I have
37:41
two kids, one's a small girl, and she was out playing. And I noticed that she gets out of the pool,
37:46
and there's about a 20 year old man talking with her in a way that seems really inappropriate.
37:52
I asked her to come and see me and she comes and she's upset because she wants to continue to talk
37:57
to this guy. And I say, Hey, what are you doing? And what was he saying and all that? Well, he was
38:01
telling me that he doesn't live with his parents. He lives by himself and he works at Disney World
38:06
and he wants to end things just got strange. So my wife came back, I explained to her what was
38:11
happening. I watched what was happening a little bit more. And then through a series of events,
38:16
we figured out that this kid was or this boy, whatever, was essentially following these children
38:21
around and he would go to the hot tub with only the small kids, not the adults. And it was very
38:26
strange. I made eye contact with him. I felt some things I never felt before. But what I did
38:33
is I had my family stay there and as opposed to us just leaving, you know, see something, say
38:38
something, something you hear a lot, went down to security, went and found the people, all that
38:42
stuff. They took me to the little bitty room and they, you know, let me know that I was on camera
38:46
and they asked me all these questions. And I said, look, it's probably nothing. But we need to be
38:51
having a conversation about this. They followed me up and they instructed me what they were going
38:55
to do. The whole security force came by. And from a distance, they watched him. We were able to
38:59
identify him and he went, he got rack up and he went into the hot tub with the kids and all that
39:03
sort of thing. Have no idea how it evolved. But what I do know is that if he didn't do anything bad,
39:08
nothing, nothing would have happened to him. But I think many people probably would not have taken
39:12
the time right to make sure they did something. So even if you're not physically able to do something
39:18
right in that moment for people that are listening, you can do something. And I think it's important
39:24
for everybody that the overwhelming ethic is the protection of those that are in the flock.
39:30
Now there are some people that are like, well, this is just my earthly body. If I lose this earthly
39:34
body, like I shouldn't be afraid of death and all those different things. Like that is not
39:40
a cue to you to make yourself more appealing to a potential predator, regardless of what the
39:46
predator's intent is. Because if you want to say that, that's not just a fight against just war
39:52
theory. That's an argument against police. That's an argument against anybody that would protect
39:58
anybody for any reason at any point, right? And you know, people even say, Hey, you know, that's,
40:03
that's like you're trying to, you know, play God to a degree by like trying to
40:07
intercede in these exact situations. But I think it's a lot of people that are more cowardly in
40:12
their countenance and in their personalities. They don't want to get in a fight. They don't want
40:16
to be physical. They're not trained to do so. And so they build this philosophy around, you know,
40:21
not doing those things. And then they backfill it with some scripture. And they pretend that,
40:26
you know, when Jesus told Peter in the garden, like to, you know, put a sword away, that that was
40:31
somehow Jesus saying, Hey, we shouldn't be violent for any reason whatsoever. Like no matter what.
40:36
But I would love for those people to make the argument to me about when you're violent to protect
40:41
image bearers of Christ, when you're violent for good, that that is a bad thing that we should
40:47
keep ourselves from doing. It doesn't make sense to me. We could probably talk about that forever.
40:52
I think so too. I think so too. Okay, let's dial back in. Okay, we are, we were on verse eight,
40:58
verse 10, for to this end, we toil and strive this being godliness, right? Reverance, respect,
41:04
piety towards God, because we have our hopes set on the living God who is the savior for all people.
41:09
I found this really interesting, especially of those who believe. I found the especially
41:17
because it wasn't only for those who believe, but it was especially for those who believe.
41:23
This is a really packed couple sentences, because like if you go back to verse nine,
41:28
Paul again says, the saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance. That's about,
41:35
I think that's a third or fourth time he's done that just in first Timothy, where he's saying,
41:40
okay, this is a point that I really want to hammer home. Timothy, like if you haven't been
41:44
paying attention, like read and pay attention here, because I want you to get this, right?
41:49
If you've stopped paying attention, listen now, if you hear only one thing I say, here this,
41:54
right? Yeah, exactly. When some people would read verse 10, Derek and think universalism.
41:59
Exactly. Right. So he's a savior of all people, but he's like super duper savior for those who
42:05
believe, right? It's like, but again, this is this is where we get into if you're a mature
42:10
studier of the Bible. And again, Matt, you've said this a bunch and some people would say that
42:14
this is circular reasoning, but you let the Bible explain the Bible. You let the Bible read the Bible,
42:18
those types of things. So if you build your entire theology based on first Timothy for 10,
42:23
you're going to say, everyone goes to hell. I'm sorry. Everyone goes to heaven. Sorry, guys.
42:29
Everyone gets to go to heaven, but you know that maybe there's a special part of heaven
42:34
for the especially, right? You know, the believers in those types of things.
42:39
But I mean, really what you're seeing there is Jesus and again, this kind of gets into Calvinist
42:44
theology, which, you know, we don't have our resident Calvinists here to argue with, but it's like,
42:48
you know, he's the savior to all people to the ones that would believe in him. So it's like,
42:54
his grace is available to everyone, but it's, it's going to save the believers, right? Because
43:01
it's the same thing as like, if you are drowning and someone throws out a life vest or, you know,
43:06
a floaty of some kind, like that is available to everyone in that situation that's drowning,
43:12
but only the people that hop on board or grab it are going to be able to float and save themselves.
43:16
Well, I think how we talked about that when we went through first Timothy two, right? Because
43:23
first Timothy two four says, I'll get part of three here. God, our savior who desires all people
43:31
to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. Now, the truth is Jesus died on the cross
43:37
for our sins and only those that claim him as their savior are saved and come into relationship
43:43
with him. But it, you're right. If you build your entire theology on that right there,
43:50
it's, it's broken. It's absolutely broken. So yes, does he have a desire for all to come to him?
43:54
Yes, will all come to him? No, not everybody that Jesus talked to believed in him and his,
44:00
the, you know what I mean? And his mission. So there are some going into that your deep Calvinist
44:07
dive of Romans that we could go into here. Well, yeah, I didn't mean to derail there. But like,
44:16
I think for me, it's like, there's, there's a thing called common grace to where the goodness of God
44:22
can show up for people who aren't in the faith. Like they're like, like a common grace or common
44:27
goodness of God would be taste buds. Like everybody has taste buds, even if you're not a believer.
44:32
So God, so the goodness of God shows, shows there, like that, oh my gosh, this food tastes so good.
44:39
Is it ice cream?
44:40
Now we're coming.
44:43
It's ice cream for sure. But I think, I think it's, I think it, to me, it kind of speaks to like,
44:50
like we strive for these things because the goodness of God shows up to all people,
44:56
especially those who, but like the all people is not, it's yeah, he's definitely not
45:01
preaching universalism. Like I think we'd be foolish. Like Kyle said, to just take that one
45:08
verse and say, that's it. That's what we do. Well, of course we do, but I mean, this, this verse,
45:14
this verse kind of goes to Romans. It also goes to Titus of like, this is not,
45:18
this is not universalism, but there are goodnesses of God that, that everyone experiences. That's
45:24
kind of some of the things I took on it. Well, here's what I throw at you. I don't know what
45:28
your opinion is on this, but this is Warren Wierzby commentary. And he says, the words translated
45:34
suffer reproach are an athletic term from which we get our English word agonize. It is the picture
45:40
of an athlete straining and giving his best to win. A Christian who wants to excel must really work
45:46
at it by the grace of God and to the glory of God, which goes back to what we talked about in the
45:51
very beginning that you've got to put yourself in there. You've got to be reading. You've got to be
45:55
participating in this experience. It's not a free ride. I kind of feel like a lot of Christians
46:00
think that they'll become more sanctified via osmosis. Right. Yeah, exactly. Almost like they can just
46:06
hang out at church and passively do go ahead. Eric, I know you want to happen on that. No, no, no,
46:10
you're I think you're absolutely right. And the reason I believe that is one, we're Westerners.
46:16
So we just believe we deserve it. We're entitled to goodness. And if, hey, good people, if good
46:21
people go to heaven, which I don't believe is true, but any if good people go to heaven, well,
46:26
obviously we're good people. We're Westerners. Yeah. And we go to church and we're educated.
46:31
And we know words. Yeah. So therefore, yeah, I fit in that bucket when it's not true. And it is
46:36
exactly what you're talking about, Zach, it is striving and pushing and training and developing.
46:41
And that comes from understanding God's word, living out God's word and growing closer to Christ
46:46
through the pursuit of toil and strive towards godliness and knowing you have a problem in the
46:51
first place. Right. Yeah. There's an apologetic that goes back to verse eight, where you're
46:55
talking about physically developing the body, whether you're an athlete or not, whether you've
46:59
been a bodybuilder or not, whether you've seen, you know, extreme performance and bodily changes
47:05
based on your, you know, background prowess of exercising. Everybody knows that if you want
47:12
to have a better body to get stronger to do all those things, it requires hard work in the gym.
47:17
Okay. That doesn't mean everybody does it. But intellectually, everybody knows that that if
47:21
I were to run, I would likely be less people. Right. I would have less things on my body.
47:27
And I would be better at running. Like, if I want a strong chest, I need to binge press.
47:31
If I want strong legs, I need to squat. Like everybody knows that. But then we don't act that
47:36
way when it comes to spiritual strength and spiritual resilience. Because I guess in school,
47:42
it's like you don't read Lord of the flies, you know, five times to understand the context.
47:47
You read it once you take a test and then you move on to kill mockingbird or I guess that's
47:51
been canceled. You move on to something else, another book. And so we don't really reckon
47:56
with the scripture and we don't really struggle with the scripture. We don't struggle via prayer.
48:00
We don't do sets, you know, of prayers or something like that. It's like, I'm going to do three sets
48:04
of 10 of Romans two, you know, like we don't, we don't do that. And so it's almost like a lot of
48:09
us just say like, okay, well, I'll just, I'll go into church is fine. Listening to Caleb is fine.
48:15
Listening to Donna life man's podcast or listening to John MacArthur sermons, like that's enough
48:20
for me to grow. And it's like, imagine if once a week for an hour, you exercised. And then you
48:27
expected to be in elite level shape. I got that's not how it works. I guess not how it works
48:31
by any stretch of the imagination. But the thing about it is though, is your gas tank for godliness
48:37
in spiritual development is vastly bigger than your gas tank for exercise. Because even if you're a
48:44
Ironman triathlete that has to work out three or four hours a day to get ready for, you know,
48:49
the bike and the swim in the run, like at the end of the day, that's that's a few hours a day,
48:55
whereas most people are working out between 45 minutes to 60 minutes, a few times a week.
48:59
But how much more gas tank do you have for reading the scripture for praying? Because that's
49:05
not going to take it out of you in the same way that extreme physical exertion would, you know,
49:10
I agree. I think where our treasure is, that's where our heart lies. And Jesus is talking about
49:18
that. He's talking about like what's like, I think one of the things is what is important to us.
49:22
And if godliness and striving to be sanctified is important to us, we're going to get into the
49:28
word. Like everybody, everybody says, I don't have time to read the Bible as they're scrolling
49:33
Facebook out of any time. Or they just they just binge watched, you know, 12 episodes of their favorite
49:41
show. But I don't have time to read the Bible. And I say that coming from a place where I've
49:45
felt that I've been there. And I got to have time to read the wait. Wait, oh, I do. You have time.
49:52
To make time for what is important to you. And I struggle with that for sure. But I think that's
49:58
that's a point that we should all take home.
50:00
Yeah, trying to tie this together. I've been through some situations physically where I've been put
50:07
in put in places where I can't physically deal with the scenario I'm in. And I recognize that I
50:12
needed to have the training. Right. When we tie this back to the spirit and having control and
50:17
all that sort of thing, think about when you're dealing with an interpersonal situation, whether
50:21
it's family or somewhere else, and this concept of emotional intelligence, can you control yourself
50:27
inside modern science is saying that emotional intelligence is critical. And the way that that
50:31
comes out is with self control and gentleness and all of these things. So if you're thinking
50:36
about a way that you can have the discipline that you bring to the exercise world, and something
50:42
that's very practical, it's can you are you really able to exhibit these things? And as you're starting
50:48
to have interactions with people, I think you have opportunities to work on that and to pray
50:53
about it. And it's something that is is very practical in your life that you can start to see
50:59
change with it's different from I'm gonna read this thing. And hopefully osmosis is gonna allow
51:02
me to just behave like this. You have to make a decision to become that person. And once you do
51:07
your relationships get better. Well, I think a lot of people don't understand like when you see
51:11
these guys are in their 40s and 50s and even in their 60s, and they can do a bunch of pullups,
51:15
they can do a plank for everything, do all these things. They didn't start training in their 40s,
51:18
50s and 60s. These guys have been doing this since they were teenagers, and their body is
51:22
grisled for that their body understands that like one of the things is when you get because you know,
51:28
doing Jiu Jitsu starting Jiu Jitsu in my 30s, there's a difference between getting grabbed by a guy
51:34
who's strong physically that has started training in his 30s and getting grabbed by somebody who has
51:40
been squeezing things since they were a child, like squeezing necks and grabbing legs and lifting
51:47
people off the ground. Like there's it's something different when a kid starts wrestling or doing
51:51
Jiu Jitsu at four or five and now they're an adult, their body is built around being able to do that
51:57
thing. Think about how much gristle you create spiritually. If you are constantly putting in the
52:03
in the work Dale Partridge who came on the show last year, he's like it's not how many years you've
52:07
been a Christian so many hours. Like and you think like it's not how many years you've been working
52:11
out. It's how many hours you've been working out. And like that that's a really, really big thing,
52:14
which I do think kind of lends itself to a discussion about about gifting because some people
52:19
are physically gifted, they're athletically gifted. Like they're really, really smooth. Like I remember,
52:24
you know, Matt, I think I've mentioned your soccer stuff already, but you're a very you were a very
52:28
smooth soccer player that had power. Then I played with guys that only had power and I had guys that
52:33
only were smooth, like they weren't capable of both. That was a gift that you cultivated. That
52:38
was a sharp knife you were given by God that you cultivated over time. And that became your soccer
52:42
style. You know, whether you do Jiu Jitsu or whether you're a runner, like everyone kind of has a style
52:48
of things that they do in terms of exertion. And then you get into verse 14 where Paul is basically
52:53
telling Timothy again, his people do not neglect the gift you have. Okay. There's there's no,
53:00
there's nothing he's imploring him here to say like, Hey, developed this gift, this gift and this
53:04
gift because you're, you know, you're you're kind of struggling in these areas. Hey, you have some
53:08
weaknesses in these areas. So let's kind of bring those up from bad to decent. And then, you know,
53:13
we'll kind of go from there. It's like, do not neglect the gift you have. And he's specifically
53:16
talking about his gift of speaking and prophesying and in those types of things. And I feel like for
53:21
a lot of us, we think our gifts inside the body of Christ are somehow different than the gifts that
53:26
we have inside of our families are inside of our businesses or any of those types of things. And so
53:29
like, you know, I remember, you know, Kelsey and I were going to a church boy back in the day and
53:33
Kelsey's a great organizer. She's a great like, Hey, let's take all these things together. And
53:37
whether it's thoughts or like, you know, desks, like she can organize everything. And she lent
53:43
that skill set to the church and said, ring me out for your purposes, because I was given
53:48
organization as a gift. It just makes sense to me. For me, I can read a 500 page book and to still
53:54
that down into two or three minutes and explain to you what you need to use to where that can
53:58
practically work. That's a skill set that I can make better over time with. That was a skill set
54:02
that I was given. But man, guys, I feel like most of us neglect our gifts, specifically as it
54:09
pertains to the work of the gospel. Am I wrong? You agree with that? Well, you're absolutely right.
54:14
Yeah, I agree with that. Sure. Yeah, I'll dive in first. I think how you talked about it in First
54:17
Timothy three of a typically maybe an alpha male outside of the church is a killer in the business
54:24
world because he's a great leader in order. And then he goes inside the church doors and he shuts
54:27
it off. Like this is, no, this is my place to receive. This is my place to just get and do nothing
54:33
and be talked at for an hour so that I can turn around and go be a killer outside. I think I believe
54:39
no, God has given us gifts. And we should be able to use that gift towards the glory and
54:46
magnification of God through his local church. I mean, I that let's reach more people for Christ.
54:53
Through the serving of his body. I don't think you're saying you shouldn't go fill up because
54:57
like that is about what I know. Like you should definitely go to church to receive. Like that's
55:03
why we go because we want to be we want to continue to be tethered to God. We want to we want to be
55:08
filling up our spiritual cup as it were. But yeah, I think we have been gifted things
55:16
that can be used to serve the body of Christ. Right. Is there a difference between talents
55:22
and gifts? Yes. I think question. I'm just asking big question guys. Exactly. We've got like
55:32
two minutes. Everybody pause and we don't know. Nobody wants to say it wrong. Right. So the
55:38
okay. No, the only reason I bring it up is because I know in the Bible that it's it's very specific
55:41
about what biblical gifts might be spiritual gifts. Spiritual gifts. Yeah. Right. And that's
55:45
where I think to me, the delineation goes between talent is a talent. Hey, it could be a personality.
55:50
It could be us. It could be I don't think that there's a spiritual gift of jujitsu. There could be.
55:55
Right. But it could be a talent that you grow and develop over years when you start squeezing
55:58
things at five years old. But here, do not neglect the gift you have, which was given to you by
56:05
prophecy when the council of elders laid their hands on you. So that's a spiritual gift that's
56:09
imparted by the Holy Spirit once you received it and people pray for you. I think Eric Eric Lydell
56:15
is a is a great example of the difference between talents and spiritual gifts. Like he was really
56:21
fast. And that was a God given talent. And he put off missionary to do what what God had crafted
56:32
him to do in a sense. He he said, when I run, I feel God's pleasure. Right. And he had some
56:37
arguments with his sister like, Hey, why are you not going into mission? This is important to our
56:41
family. This is what we there's what we've been called by the Bible to do. And he said, I will do
56:45
that. But I had literally been made to run fast. I am not going to take God's glory away by not
56:54
doing that. But then after I'm done with that, I'm going to use a spiritual gift of evangelism
56:58
and take that to the world, which builds a platform, right? Exactly. Well, as soon as you said,
57:02
Lydell, first, first of all, I thought you're talking about the my pillow guy. And so I was like,
57:06
because I couldn't remember the my pillow guy's first name. So so that's a cherry to fire. Yeah.
57:11
So that's how my brain works. But you're exactly right. Because you know, Derek, you mentioned like,
57:15
you know, jujitsu in and of itself is not a spiritual gift. Yes. Athletic ability, explosiveness,
57:20
ability, body control, those are all things that go into being a good jujitsu fighter.
57:26
And there are guys that can do that incredibly well. And jujitsu is just something that speaks
57:32
to them. They enjoy it. It's something in their personality that is more appealing to them than
57:36
maybe golf or volleyball or football or some other sport. But now you have opportunities to
57:42
share the gospel with people because of your competence in a sport. So I mean, growing up again,
57:50
I'm just going back to the soccer example. Like you were typically the best guy on your team,
57:54
no matter what team you're on. And you don't have to say anything because it's the truth.
57:58
You're the most talented, you're the most skilled, you scored the most,
58:01
you played midfield, but you scored like a like a striker. And so just by virtue of how you're
58:08
able to perform on the field, you're going to be able to get people to listen to you. So everyone
58:13
talks about this like when you're around somebody that's really, really competent. So like, if you're
58:16
hanging out with someone that's famous, you'll laugh at their jokes even when they're not funny.
58:20
Like you'll listen to them as if they have something special to say when they're just kind of a regular
58:23
person. And but the reality is, is God gave you these gifts so that he could use them that they're
58:30
not for you only, right? He granted them to you temporarily because here you are on this earth for,
58:36
you know, the extent of a blink of an eye. And again, we keep bringing this back to something
58:40
athletic, but maybe you're a great reader. Like you read quickly, you absorb content,
58:46
you remember it, maybe you have an idetic memory. Like when you read something, it's in your brain
58:50
for the rest of your life. Imagine what type of value that can provide for you as you're trying
58:55
to catacize your children. Or as you're trying to, you know, do something volunteer based at your
58:59
local library or something like that, you have these skill sets that God has given you for his glory.
59:04
But we neglect to remember that we are not the point. Right. And so we think I'm a great athlete.
59:11
I'm really smart. I'm really good at recall. I'm a good test taker. That's for me. No,
59:16
that's not for you. He gave that to you so you could use it for somebody else. It goes back to
59:20
for everything created by God is good in verse four. And then we leave that there with verse 14. So
59:25
guys, again, this is just kind of my call to all of you. Just think about the stuff in chapter four.
59:30
Like again, the first four chapters of first Timothy have been absolutely incredible.
59:33
But how many times did all of us recognize in the fourth chapter? Like crap, we could spend the
59:39
entire time talking about these couple of dozen words here because there's so much here. And so
59:44
guys, again, we keep being implored by everybody here to let the Bible read the Bible. Understand
59:51
that you can't just pull out a singular verse and make that your life's verse and only look at that
59:57
as it pertains to the rest of the Bible. But man, there's so much more we can get into, but we're
1:00:01
going to have to leave it there. Come back next Sunday, guys, where we will dig into first Timothy
1:00:05
five, we're coming towards the end of first Timothy. Make sure you read that during the week so that
1:00:09
you are prepared. All right, guys, we're going to do a quick resilience boost before we let you go
1:00:13
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