[Music] This is Undaunted Life, a man's podcast. I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. Let's get into it. Well, saturated is happening. And I thought maybe we would the roof would, you know, not get torn off from the outside, but from the inside tonight. >> Yeah. Crazy. >> Yeah. Who says big churches don't sing? >> It's cranky. >> Okay, so this is true. >> I'm sitting there >> and I'm like, oh, something something's wrong. Something's wrong. So, I text one of our production guys. I'm like, dude, why does the PA sound quiet? He said, it's normal. Everyone's singing louder than the PA. >> Wow. Yeah. Let's give the drummer some love for tonight. If you were here at San Pablo, you know exactly what I'm talking about. I was worshiping right along with that dude going nuts. >> He had like a little bit of a shimmer thing going on. That was incredible. His name his name is Johnny Nail. >> So, of course, his name is he nailed it. >> Of course, his name is I talked to him afterwards. He said he does like he grew up in like the uh he said like Mexican Pentecostal and I was like I didn't know that produced that. Like that. Can we get some more of those? >> Best kind of Pentecostal. >> Yeah. >> A lot of spice. Uh, thank you, Pastor John. >> Thanks, mate. >> Um, you know, I was thinking as you were preaching that the idea of the hand of God being on a place or a person or a movement that that is, I mean, before you preached, I was like, that's kind of a nebulous idea. And what I loved was that you pointed out from this text like here's some things you could look at and say that's some signs, some evidences, some key indicators. And don't you think, Pastor Joby, you've said recently, don't you think that the hand of God Well, the hand of God's on this place, but but God's doing something in his church, >> and we're seeing things, we're seeing these things and more here and and other places. But wow. Yeah. The places that are preaching the gospel, lifting up Jesus, have a high view of scripture, that don't take themselves too seriously, that will confess and repent. >> Mhm. >> These are a bunch of our buddies. I mean, we all know, all of us kind of know each other. And you see the spirit of God pouring himself out in a way that we haven't seen in decades. >> Yeah. I mean, like, this isn't the only measurement, but tonight we can't get people to leave. I mean, how many songs we sing? You know what I'm saying? Cuz cuz the who wants to leave the presence of the king, >> right? >> I mean, that's what it is, you know? >> Um, yeah, there's something going on and I just I just want to be a part of it. >> That's right. And and I also just want to say we're standing on the shoulders of faithful men and women who've been begging God to move like this in this region of the world in this country for years and years and years and years. >> Mhm. >> And God does not owe us a thing, man. He does not owe us. And yet he is faithful to show up and move in those who would be postured and surrendered for him to do so. H Kyle, which of the five things stood out to you as, you know, like particularly like powerful? >> Yeah. So, >> even to dovtail off of that a little bit. So, John and I were outsiders um for Church 1122, but we're admirers from afar, right? And like I'll get messages from people that roll through here cuz they listen to the show or something like that. They roll through Jacksonville and go and they're like, "Dude, what was that?" And I'm like, "I know exactly what you're saying. Like, you didn't make any sense with what you just tried to tell me, but I get it. I get exactly cuz you you try to put it into words and it's hard to do." But the fifth thing you said was a new cultural identity >> because part of the thing with Christians being called Christians for the first time in Antioch is that was a derissive term, right? Oh, those followers of the way, those those Christians, those whatever. And we live in a country that is more post-Christian than it is Christian now in a lot of ways. But I think tonight you you you gave John you gave people permission like the biggest takeaway was tell people you love Jesus and then show up every day >> because what is what is show up, right? Like show up is show up in your relationships. Uh, you know, companies should want to hire Christians outright because they should be the hardest workers because if you're working as under the Lord, you were talking about being a butcher and you're like, "Lord, if no one else sees the cuts I'm making on this animal today, you see them." And the people that approach work that way, whether you got a shovel in your hand or, you know, a quill pin, like that, that is what changes a city when everyone's on mission. And I feel like, you know, in your description, you're giving people permission to live that way. >> Yeah. I uh, you know, I went through a pretty intense season there. It was very very hard because I started as a non-Christian, had a whole set of behaviors, became a Christian and had to change. Um, but I've if you can make your work your worship, and you know that's from the same Hebrew root word as work and worship, and if you can get men showing up, you get women showing up and they're saying, "Lord, I I don't need to be at church. I'm offering my whole life to you. It's not just the singing, which I love is mindboggling tonight, but my whole life is an act of worship. you're deploying I don't know how many folks are here 20,000 people to deploy 20,000 people on mission day in day out into the city is how the city will change >> and if people view themselves as sent if people view themselves as on mission like that there there's nothing that can stop that I mean it's kind of wild it's so interesting uh you talked about destiny releasing leadership Yeah. >> So, man, you know what it's like to pastor a church and a growing church and all the things. I don't get a lot of opportunities to like stop and think about it cuz I got Thursday comes with an amazing regularity around here, you know, and so and you're preaching and you and you and you talk about that super bloom and I actually asked you to preach that sermon because I've heard I heard that illustration where we were somewhere. I have no weal. Yeah. And uh and it was interesting because if you looked at the front of the church while you're preaching, it's just barren carpet. >> Yes. Yeah. Yeah. >> And then in the response, it's just praising people. Yeah. >> And I thought that's there's a bloom. >> Yeah. >> But this thing I got into it because my football coach that led me to Christ ma volen told me I was preaching. >> Really, >> bro. We're at this little camp that I got saved at. I'm 19 years old. I was like the grass cutter and the lifeguard, whatever. And he said, "Hey, when the singing's done, you're up. You're preaching." And we were up there singing I am a C. Like I was like, "Dude, it's a 90cond song. What are we doing?" >> And he just made me go. >> No, no prep. >> None. >> Wow. >> That's how that his disciplehip philosophy was, boy, get in a truck. >> And he just That's so I get up there. I preached John 3:16. Literally, I knew I could find it in my Bible. >> And I preached for I I'm sure it was terrible. And kids got saved. >> Wow. And when I got done, he put his finger in my chest and he said, "Boy, when you teach the Bible, I see two things happen. I see you come alive. I see them come alive." >> Wow. >> And I was like, "Coach, I'm never going I'm never working at church." >> And he just wouldn't he just wouldn't leave me alone, man. You know, >> and I have felt particularly the last few weeks. I preached our our student camp this summer. It was unbelievable. We took 2,000 kids to student camp and the spiritual intensity of the students around this place is on 10, man. And every time revival starts, it starts with that generation. >> And I've been banging the drum here to our people, we we have an enemy. Anytime God wants to do a major move that the devil tries to wipe out a generation, dude, that is what he is doing. >> The transgender craze, the attack on this generation, the confusion. Oh my gosh, it's epidemic, right? Mhm. >> And so a big part of what I'm calling our church to is to stand on that wall for the provision protection of these kids and not to speak down to them, to speak life into them and say, "Man, I what if the big thing of 11:22 is not even what we do, but who we raise." >> Y >> it's been rattling around in my head. So man, I hope it's not just me. I hope there's an army of adults >> going to students and college students and saying, "I sense God doing a great thing in you. That was powerful. I >> I wonder if you could say more about that because I thought of that scripture that that life and death's in the power of the tongue. And we talk a lot about how words cutting people down, you know, it's focus on the death part a lot. But I can look back on my own life and think if there's a few people that don't just say something to me like you got to go after you got to do that. You know >> that that was a lifegiving. It was People get weird about it, you know, like when they manifest or what, but there was a lifegiving thing that happened in me when they said some words, you know, and so can you say anything more about that? >> Yeah, I I I just wrote an email about this today. People are overwhelmed. They this sounds like a great idea. How do I do it? And Paul says in one Thessalonians 2, um he talks about being a spiritual father. And what did he actually do? He said, "I encouraged you. I comforted you. and I urged you >> to live lives worthy of the calling you've received. >> That's it. Put a ven diagram. Bingo right there. Encourage people. In Greek, it means to put courage people. Put courage in someone. I mean, it's not simple. It's like you see someone who's struggling and you speak into that. You can do this, man. I'm with you. You look, you know, I've got a famous story about running this marathon. I did one marathon. I'm dying. It's 100°. Nothing. Weak little just regular marathon. And uh mile 25, it's 100°. I'm going to I feel like I can't go on. And some guy yells out at me, you look strong today, John. Let's go on. And I just was like, that's And I just ran the rest of the thing. The power of words. Encourage comfort. People get beat up. They don't need when they're struggling. What they need is someone to go, hey, listen, man. I know that's hard. I understand that. They don't need to be told, lectured, >> judged. They just need someone to empathize with them. And then they need to be urged. that urging voice of like I want everything God has for you. I refuse to let you settle. You get those three things together, you got something ponent. If you only comfort, >> you're going to produce weak people. If you only urge, you're going to put too much pressure on them. And if you only encourage, it's going to be it's going to be like a participation award. You got to get those things together. Is that's what he calls >> spiritual uh parenting. I think there's something something good in that. So, >> how does that relate to your foxhole brother concept of like what men can do for each other? >> Yeah. So, um the foxhole concept or Matt Carriers, Matt Toders, or as Matt Chandler calls them a king's table is these are deputized men who have permission to grab you by the scruff of your shirt and be like, "That's not how we're going to do this, buddy." Whether it's how you talk to your wife and children, whether it's how you're handling your finances, whether it's how you are being the spiritual thermometer for your household and not the spiritual ther thermostat for your household. But guys, I've said this a billion different ways, but two ways have come out higher than anything else where guys will start to understand is I talk about a 3:00 a.m. friend and I talk about a guy that'll help you bury your dog. >> So a 3 a.m. friend, because people stay up until like 1 or two, like night, no one's up at 3:00 except for like insane people. And so if your life is falling apart at 3:00 in the morning and you don't have anyone that you could call to get you to the next hour, right, you're you're behind. You're like super far behind. >> Vulnerable. >> Yeah. It's vulnerable. That's exactly it. The number one thing men don't want to be, right? They're right there exposed, >> right? >> I talk about all the time how lone wolves die alone. Watch Animal Planet. Like they get they get kicked out of the pack and then they die alone, right? And the same thing with uh when you're getting into this entire concept is like a guy that will just show up cuz when my dog, my best friend, died, I had two buddies just show up because they figured I'd be in my backyard burying him myself and I was 100° August in Oklahoma and that's exactly what I was doing. They just showed up. One guy showed up with some scotch, another guy showed up with a boom box and a tent and we just got to digging, right? Didn't do a whole lot of talking. Right. But again, this this goes back to really everything that you're saying because when you're talking about unprecedented generosity and and category defining community, like that's what that is is category defining community because everyone's got fellas, >> right? Everyone's got buddies. Everyone's got guys that'll help them move a fridge or build a section of fence like if it's not too inconvenient, right? But when you have these guys that are deputized to be able to talk to you in a way, they don't mind interrupting you. they don't mind grabbing you because you need guys in your in your life that aren't too afraid of whether or not like you're going to throw a punch cuz if that's the worst case scenario of me trying to bring you to the feet of Jesus, I I'll take that long. >> Mhm. >> Another word you use that that just is rattling in my brain is you talk about the instinct was unleashed for generosity. Mhm. >> Talk to me about the about the word instinct. Cuz when you said it, I was like, "Oh my gosh, that's it, >> you know, like like there's something deep in us that wants to be a conduit of the grace of God. >> And then there's this other thing later after the instinct has kicked in that talks you out of doing the thing God has called you to do." Right? >> You know that lady that got that baseball, >> that lady went nagged. Here's this dad taking his son out, doing the right thing. >> He comes and hugs this son. It >> was sweet. It >> was a sweet moment. And then this lady comes over. >> That's not a generosity instinct. See, her instinct was to go seize stake. No one had to tell her. She was primed ready to do that. >> What happens when the gospel hits your heart? Is it you you're set free from self- concern. Mhm. >> And the reason most people aren't aren't generous is because they're afraid. >> No one's going to come through for me. That's the orphan spirit. Spirit of bondage and slavery again to fear. >> I'm not going to have enough. I'm not going to be enough. I'm not going to be able to provide. And so they're just clinging with closed fist. >> And Jesus comes along and he's like, I got you. Seek first the kingdom. It'll all be added unto you. You'll get a 100x in this life if you leave it all and you follow me. When that hits the heart, when you see those moments, instead of shrinking back in fear, like I need to preserve myself cuz there's not enough. Everything within you say there's an unlimited supply. I'm an old school Pentecostal. Our theology is so simple. It was like God's will, God's bill. If he can get it through you, he can get it to you. I mean, like all of this stuff, I'm running a church in New York on God's will, God's bill, and if he can get it through, he'll get it to you. So every time you see it, you're saying to God, there's an unlimited supply according to his riches in Christ Jesus in glory. So I can draw on the heavenly bank account. So you got to get that in you. And Jesus seemed to be at war with Mammon unlike anything else he was at war with in the Gospels cuz it's an umbrella thing. I just met with a guy that who's been in my life for quite a while. Very, very generous. I could tell you so many stories of how he's been kind, but he just he goes to a a a church somewhere else and he just gave his first sevenf figure gift. >> And uh I said, "Hey, what was that like, man?" He goes, "I just wish the whole world could understand how freeing and liberating it was." >> The most joyfilled thing I've ever done was sell my house and give the money for the church's building program cuz my heart's totally free. Look at all my friends are enslaved. I feel totally free. And they said, "I wish someone had preached this to me earlier. You will be free and you will love it. That's what the gospel does." >> You say, Pastor Joby, that generosity begets more generosity. And then you mentioned fear. I thought, so we're on vacation and there's we're on this lake and there's this these rocks that go right to the water. And we go up there and it's like 20 ft. And you get up there and you might be tough down there in the water, but you get up there, you're just like, "Woo! It's one of those things where when you jump you kind of like count a little bit before you hit the water >> and you're afraid >> and then when you jump the and my kids did this both of them when they jump first thing out of the water is I got to do that again. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> So the fear got flipped around to like I think that's why generosity begets more generosity because that that fear gets flipped around and all of a sudden you see the joy in it. >> Keller had this phrase which I loved. He said, "Money flows effortlessly to that which is its god." And what you worship, money will flow there. If someone in our culture came along and they said, "Hey, I want to go to Europe." And they said, "I'm going to take 10% of my income. I'm going to put it away for a little Europe trip." Everyone would be like, "Oh, that's amazing. Go, great idea." >> And if you said to everyone like, "I love I love the Lord Jesus and I love his church. I'm gonna take 10% of everything I've got and I'm going to put it away." Oh, what are you doing? All that you It's just crazy. Money effortlessly goes to that which you value most. >> Wow. Hey guys, real quick. Do you remember during the pandemic when you basically couldn't get anything shipped to your house? All this manufacturing that was supposed to be taking place in America had been shipped overseas and you just didn't notice it. And I remember a bunch of companies saying, "We're going to do everything we can to make sure that we bring manufacturing back to America." And almost none of them followed through on that promise. But for me and for all of us here at Undaunted Life, I wanted to make sure that I partnered with an American company that actually did want to prioritize American workers, their families, their communities, and a company that would keep their word. And that's why I want to remind you that we are partnered with Origin. 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Use the promo code undaunted to get 10% off your order. Again, that's originus.com. Promo code undaunted to get 10% off your order. There was something that you you said that brought this up earlier because I I used to live in New York and you were and I talking about earlier when you would run into a Christian in a city of millions and millions of people in the five burrows, you'd be like, "Where have you been hiding, man? That's awesome." Like, "There's another one here." Which when you're in Oklahoma, you like trip and fall and like land on seven churches as you're trying to regain your balance, right? But a lot there's a lot of power in a name and everyone's kind of said that a different derivative of that, but in Judges 6, this is the call of Gideon, right? Uh and so and the angel of the Lord, this is uh Judges 6:12, "And the angel of the Lord appeared to him and said to him,"The Lord is with you, oh mighty man of valor." Now before that, he's the threshing wheat in a wine press, like below ground. Cuz he was terrified that someone might see him, right? He was hiding. But the angel of the Lord, so potential christophony, the angel of the lord's like the like oh mighty man of valor like and there were some other names and some other translations and things like that. But when you give a name to somebody, I think it kind of goes back that was like a through point of your sermon tonight, John, is like it's permission. >> So Joby said after the sermon like every time he hears you preach, his faith is stretched. >> That's it. Part of it is you're getting permission to do that because most other people, you mentioned a plausability structure right there from the beginning. You know, Chandler talks about that a lot, but no one has seen something like this. When you were here earlier this week for church leader summit or something like that, you don't know church can be done this way. And so, you look at it as an aspirational identity, but when you have an aspirational identity, it becomes a destination. And then when you get there, you sit on your laurels, right? It's people that have goals but not standards, right? So you reach your goal, but then you don't have a standard that like keeps your discipline flowing for the rest of your life. And I mean, what you're doing is kind of putting the scaffolding around what the movement of God is currently doing here in Jacksonville and elsewhere. >> Yeah. Well, I was just like, "Hey, look, I everywhere I preach, I try and figure out what's God done in the past there. That stuff's still hanging around in the air somewhere. God knows that it happened there." So, I always just try and do a little research, see what's up. And I was like, "Wow, man. They had like this multi- uh ethnic denominational revival. They build a 6500. We got 3,000 back here. Imagine something twice this size for a service. I was like, most people would hear that and they would just go, that could never happen again. And I was like, I think these guys are probably ready for a little vision boost and they probably go, you know what? >> I could see Billy Graeme came here. You know, Billy Graeme came here. He got 760,000 people all up at his crusade. But it wasn't in one night. A lot of repeats, a lot of people flying in from around America. Billy's getting old. He's not a local guy. But when you say to a local, hey, you know, I mean, what's happening here, genuinely zero flattery is extraordinary. You got 1500 people flying in to learn from it. It would be very easy to go, let's just take it from here. Let's run the same plays. Let's keep it on. But to say what what if 115,000 people came to something that God did. I think you could take that challenge. You know, a lot of people don't take that challenge. >> I'll be thinking about it a lot, praying about it a lot. I mean, >> again, that's why I closed the way I did. Everybody loves, right, that God will do exceedingly more than we ever hope, dream, or imagine. Well, then maybe our hopes, dreams, and imaginations are too small. >> Yeah. Because if he's going to exceed it and we can hold God to his own promises, >> then you've helped me dream bigger about what God may want to do in us and through us and to us. >> People People say to me, you know, we're in a season God's really blessing what we do and I'm I'm I'm so grateful for it. >> I genuinely give God all the glory because if you have been New York, there's no illusion that this is me. Like I I have a profound awareness that it's God. But if you study New York's history, that a million people converted in the businessman's revival in 1857. >> Wow. >> And so we're we're seeing God move in powerful ways. But it's like, what is your standard of what God can do in your city? >> And if I just look at the best models of the recent years, I'm going to have a limited vision. If I study the Bible, who God is, what is possible, I'm going to be asking for a little more. So I'm always grateful, never content. You know, I'm always Thank you, Lord. But I am hungry for more. >> That's a good way to say it. Always grateful, never content. But John as well, you have you have Christians that are in the know, right? So they read Christian websites and Christian news and they keep up with Christian Twitter and whatever or whatever we're calling it now. And so they know where movements of God are taking place. So they're smart enough to know that, oh man, subsah here in Africa, man. That's where the church is really exploding. Oh man, you mentioned it tonight with Muslims in the Middle East where there can't be street preachers and things like that. It's all underground, right? You have people getting saved in their dreams cuz you know they have a vision like the Bill Careshi did where Jesus comes to them in a vision, right? Oh, you know, Southeast Asia, like those types of things, and we forget about our cubicle. >> Yeah. >> Like like we forget about where we are and the number of guys that send me these messages because maybe they heard, you know, one of y'all's sermons or read one of y'all's books or, you know, something from my show and they're like, I think I'm being called into ministry. So, I I think that means I'm supposed to be quitting my job. And I'm like, perhaps but perhaps the ex that you're over right now is your ex, right? 100%. Yeah. Yeah. Listen, I I think we do forget Paul made tense. >> Yep. We we we don't you got to stop rushing. We need to stop rushing past that. This is the apostle writing the New Testament, raising the dead, preaching the Aropagus, facilitating citywide riots, raising up discipling, who still was just get a little manual labor in the side. And so, he just did whatever it took wherever he was to be on mission wherever God had him. End of story. It's a posture of the heart, not a location. And if you're not on mission where you are, why do you think you'll be on mission somewhere later? You're not going to be. They say it's a sense of calling and mentality. I talk, you know, when I was a butcher, I I worked really really hard, a ton of long long hours. It was like when I hear people when I hear people in the workplace talk about HR standards today, I just want to laugh. I'm just like, what are you even talking about? >> It was so insane. And I graduated from I got a scholarship to come to the US at the end of it. And um as I was le I I won this award called apprentice of the year. It's a long story doesn't matter that much but I basically worked really hard and was recognized as the best apprentice butcher in my state. So I go to this big award at this this uh college thing and they give me the certificate and all this stuff. And as I'm leading it it wasn't audible but it was as close to audible as I've ever had. And the Lord said to me, "You wanted me in the butcher shop. I will honor the next season of your life. And it was one of those things that like if you can't figure out how to glorify God where you are, why do you think you'll glorify him later and you will look you will look back later with regret at that season. All you get is this season to glorify God today. And so don't think if the conditions change then I'll glorify God. If it was better, if I so much of my life I just spend saying what's the call? And I I have two categories called nice and necessary. like I've got a million things on my nice list and my necessary list is on mission right now with who's in front of me with whatever I've got. I don't need more money. I don't need more time. I don't need more I can do everything God's called me to now. That mentality will open the doors later. But if you don't live like that, >> you won't be the man you are needed to when you're ready. >> Because it's the guy that waits for January so that he can post new year, new me. It's like, no, bro, it's new year, same you. It's time to get after it. And so, guess what? the bill comes due every morning. So whether you're cultivating spiritual, mental or physical resilience or something like that, >> you're trying to become mature, you're trying to, you know, get tethered to your sanctification journey, you're trying to be discipled as you're discipling others and all that, the bill comes due every morning. You don't you don't get to spiritually uh invest in the Bible today for tomorrow, you don't get to work out today for next week. You get today >> for right now. But most guys don't have that perspective. M >> it's the con you've heard of the 20 mile march Almanson who was the explorer that's it to me man it's the 20-m march every day you can't be sporadic you got to be consistent you just stay on the thing that God's called you to every day if if people would take 10 minutes and just before they went into work just said Lord I offer you this day give me a heart for my co-workers let me be a pastor in this place Lord help me do my job to glorify you where it's unto you and if if you just start showing up like that you said it earlier Everyone will want Christians on their team because Christians will be the best workers there are. >> Yeah. If there was a way we could kind of I don't want to just get into a semantics thing and Jesus juke people with words, but words matter a lot. And in reality, those of us that feel called to full-time vocational work at a church are technically not in the ministry. According to Ephesians 4:20, our job is to equip the saints for the work of the ministry. So the football coach is way more frontline ministry than the youth pastor. >> Yeah. >> Way more because he's with lost kids all the time and with them all day every day. >> Yeah. >> And so if we could get that shift like, oh no, >> you have to work at church. You don't get to be in the ministry. >> You're behind the scenes now. Your job is to equip the saints for the work of the ministry. That is a better way to think about it. >> We we talk about the huddle and the game. >> Church is the huddle, man. Game's out there. Yeah, >> love the huddle. The goal is not to grow the huddle. The goal is to win the game and uh come in and enjoy the huddle, but understand what it's for. Out there is where you're playing. >> One of the things I love about your story, I just love being around you, man. The way you talk about God's call and plan in your life, it honestly the way you talk about it sounds like the book of Acts. So Willie last night, that's a big part of what he's talking about. He was like, >> "Okay, what if they wrote the book of Acts of your life? What would it look like? You went to work, you sat down, you watched TV. Repeat like what what would it sound like? Okay. >> When you talk it, that's what it sounds like. You sound like you could be the next chapter in the book of Acts. >> I I think a I think a problem these days is this. Okay. >> You've been grinding from the butcher shop until today. >> But then all of a sudden, you pop up on all the Christian social media world. Like in my world, you popped up a few years ago, you know, and I think you get a bunch of especially younger guys in the ministry that see the John Tyson today and they think, I want that. But what they've never done is dedicate their knives unto the Lord while they're chopping meat in utter obscurity >> in a place that most people won't even see with their eyes. >> Does that make sense? >> Yeah, of course. >> And it is a real danger. We just did that that church leaders conference and I can't tell you the number of 25 year old guys that sit in front of me and go, I want to change the world. I was like, "Dude, that's great. What do you do right now?" Like, "Well, I'm the young adult pastor at such and such church." I'm like, "Let me tell you how to change the world. You'd be the most devoted young adults pastor >> at that church. And if God wants you to change the world, he'll tell your pastor and your pastor will tell you >> and put his hands on you and commission you. >> But if you're not faithful, >> Yeah. >> like if you're trying to step over what God has trusted you with right now, why in the world do you think God would trust you with it anymore?" I I tell people all the time, people say, "Man, how do you do so much?" Like, "You're always cranking out stuff." I'm I was It's young leaders. I'm like, "How old are you?" Like, "I'm 28." I'm like, "You married?" "Yeah, you got a couple little kids." I was like, "When I was 28, you know what I was doing? Breathing through a straw under the crushing obligations of my life. I was tired. I was up at 4:00 in the morning so I could get some time with the Lord so I wouldn't be a jerk. I wanted to create the atmosphere of my home so my kids would wake up without stress and and I try to stay married and I was planting a church in New York. I I wasn't riding or mate I was living my life. >> Yeah. >> And so at 28 you know what you need to do live your life. >> Like all of these all of these false expectations and you know in many ways I'm just reaping fruit of that I've just sewed for many many years. And again, you've got to en enjoy the season. In many ways, I'd die to go back and be 28 and breathe through a straw. Man, that was a beautiful season of my life. >> So, yeah, you've got to be faithful where you are. Don't fast forward. I can tell you right now, you don't have the character at 25 for the kind of influence you want. Half of it is God just beating you up, humbling you, working out the cracks in your character so that at some point, even if he can trust you with it, God has no desire to elevate people with idols in their hearts who will dishonor him in ministry. And you will tear down with your life what you build with the pulpit if God doesn't get that stuff out of you. So, there's a lot of I think there's a lot you got to just eat some humble pie, bro. >> Eat some humble pie. Nobody ever thinks about it this way, but the Bible Jesus says he's a good dad. And what what dad among you if the kid asked for a fish would give him a snake. >> Some people are actually the ministry they're praying for would be a snake in their life because it would kill him. >> Yeah. >> And God would not be a good father to hand you something you're not ready for, you dummy. >> Mhm. >> The the problem is as well is that you don't need any more influence to have a beautiful fruitful lifegiving relationship with God. >> Amen. >> Okay. I there's nothing wrong with holy ambition. I I got a lot of ambition, but I'm my inner life is absolutely thrilled in Jesus and I'm living for eternal life. Like you know it at some point another thousand people in your church is not going to fix or change. There's got to be something in you in your relationship with Jesus that is connected to faithfulness to the call that you have. It's free from outcomes. a lot of, you know, if you if you're only as good as your last sermon, that's a terrible cycle to be in. >> So, just spend time getting your heart right with the Lord. >> And I can promise you by the time it shows up, you won't want the influence. You will be preaching from love. And I, as I was thinking tonight, I was think genuinely I was thinking, what am I even doing preaching here? What am I even doing preach here? There's about 50,000 people that would die to preach at this event. I I said I said to you, "Thanks for taking a risk on me." But I'm not here, your church can't give me anything. And I'm not here trying to take I'm literally thinking, "Lord, please pour your spirit out on this church. Lord, keep doing it." I have an orientation towards the people, not an orientation towards the platform. If you gave me this platform at 28, I'd be thinking about how well I'm doing. Now I'm just thinking about God, please help these people get seeds of your word that bear 100x fruit in the city. It's taken me 20 years of Jesus putting me in. >> Here's why you're preaching here. >> Cuz I love these people. >> Yeah. >> You are actually a gift from me to these people. >> Cuz I know I know the kind of things you say. >> Yeah. >> That's literally how I think about it. Um actually early on in saturated I had somebody ask me they're like do you not get nervous because you're because of who you're bringing in? >> They're like and they they actually pitch to me like if I'm a C minus shouldn't I just bring in D's. So then everybody would and I could I was like >> oh my gosh if that is how you think how sad you were not you're actually not a shepherd. >> You're not leading people beside green waters. I mean green pastures and still waters. This is >> I'm trying to bless our people. This is how I I I went through a season. I was in New York and God completely freed me from this. I went through a season and um I was getting mentored by Keller and I knew Hill Song were coming. >> Mhm. >> And up until that point I was like a pretty gifted kid having a little moment in the sun and I was like I got around Keller and I just realized this dude has just been deposited by God a stronger gift on his life than will ever be me on my best. He just has been distributed something different. And he was saying, "Worship's obviously insane." >> And I went through this like crisis. Why am I in New York? I need to go to another city. I'm going to be overshadowed. It was it was heavy. >> And then I I had this revelation praying on a bridge called the George Washington Bridge. The Lord said, "You're insecure because you're you're a tutor. A tutor, a tutor, and not a father. Tutors are competing for students." Oh, you took my student. And he says, "If fathers want the best tutors possible to raise their kids to be their best." >> He says, "If you become a father and stop being a tutor, insecurity will leave your life." It was like a spell broke off my life. >> And I just said, I wanted that's so the reason you can bring the best folks in is cuz you want them. You're not a you're not a tutor competing for people. You're a father trying to bring the best people possible to raise them to maturity. John, part of the reason you were even able to out of being able to come out of that season, because we all misunderstand Psalm 23. It's not about God delivering you from the valley. It's that whether you're about to go into the valley, you're in it, or coming out of it, God's there with you, >> but you were making deposits, right? So, how can you reap a harvest later on is because you were making a deposit when nobody else was paying any attention. And the dep the deposits are getting on your knees and praying, spending time in the word, like being in Christian community with with other brothers and sisters to encourage them and, you know, raising up your children in the nurture and admonition of the Lord and loving your wife in a sacrificial way, just like, you know, Jesus did for his bride. And most people forget about the deposits. Like, you know, we talk about that in a man context. Like, if you wait until the day, the 3:00 a.m. situation before you start investing in the lives of other dudes, it's too late. You're way too late. But you were ready for that next season because you had made the deposit. So when you needed to start taking withdrawals, there was something in there, right? You weren't just rattling around your your coffee can with a few nickels in there. >> Yeah. I mean, I I think the most important thing is you've you've got to love God for himself and separate that from outcomes. It's like number one, I'm building in my relationship with God. Period. I'm going to live forever in a new heaven and a new earth and rule and reign as a king and a priest where righteousness dwells in a new Jerusalem where you don't need lamps cuz Jesus is light. So that's that's where I'm headed next and I keep that in my mind. That's ultimately what I'm being prepared for is eternal life with Jesus. So part of that it frees it put it just that that infinite horizon changes how you approach temporary things. And so I'm living in light of that. And so if I if I want to get to heaven and really enjoy Jesus, I probably should spend some time getting to know him now. >> And if I if I I want to get on the day of judgment and not have all this stuff burned up and it become nothing, like one Corinthians 3, it's like, man, I need to work for stuff that's not going to perish. >> So a lot of it is is preparation to meet God. One Corinthians 4, judge nothing before the appointed time. Each one of us will stand before Jesus and give an account for our lives. It says the motive of our hearts will be revealed >> and each of us will receive our praise from God. So I'm I'm working on standing before Jesus and him just going, you did that for me or he did that one for you. I hope you enjoyed that. That but you did that one for me. Good stuff, mate. You know, and so all of that is freeing me up from the frenetic energy of having to be someone or accomplish something. >> I I didn't start there, but but I got there. And so then what I'm doing is I'm trying to figure out, okay, what pleases you out of who you called me to be. And then you just, yeah, you just sew into that every day. And as the Bible says, God rewards those who diligently seek him. We say at our church all the time, such a lukewarm culture that diligence is rejected as legalism. This is not legalism. This is hunger. This is vision. This is a reward that is promised to me for this a diligent pursuit. So yeah, get your eyes on that stuff and God will God will honor you in due time. He He's the Lord of the harvest. He's in charge of the timing, the rising, the falling, and I just try to get that off your back. Get the pressure off. >> Love people. Enjoy God. Be in the season. >> I think God will take care of the rest. The other thing is you have no idea the part that you're playing in God's redemptive narrative. >> Yeah. >> Mhm. >> I mean, think about it. A a high school football coach led me to Christ. >> Yeah. and died before I planted this church. >> Wow. He's probably having a good time right now. >> You know what I'm saying? >> Like, bro, this is fruit on his tree, man. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Uh we were talking about it the other day. The the little church that my wife grew up in that was pastored by and founded by her grandfather. >> We would all judge that as not necessarily like the most fruitful church. It's about 125, 150 people in a little rural community. It's a faithful church. It's a great church. Well, guess what? They raised this godly woman that I married. >> Yeah. >> And at a time in my life 25 years ago, I was this close from walking away from ministry cuz I thought I was done. Kind of an Elijah moment under the broom tree going, I think it's over for me. And God sent him an angel to speak some truth. And God sent me one. I just happened to be to be married to her. >> Yeah. >> And that girl that that Lonear church >> Yeah. >> raised without her there's no 11:22. Dude, that's that is fruit on the tree of the faithfulness of that little rural church in Rowan Oak, Virginia, that that area. >> Mhm. >> So, you have no idea. I do think a part of what Corinthians is talking about when it says, "Now we see in part, then we will see in full." >> Yeah. I'm believing a part of the way that we worship God eternally is that he gets we talk about this sometimes. He lets us see the dots connected and how he like why did he put us together to know each other and be be cheering for one another and you know it's we're going to get to see this full picture like tonight there's somebody here that got called into ministry. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> You know what I mean? Amen. >> And it's not even going to come to fruition for a long and you're not even going to know it until heaven. >> Yeah. And then somehow that, you know, jewel and the crown gets laid at the feet of Christ. You get to pile it up with the elders around the throne saying, "Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty who was and is and is to come." >> Mhm. >> What a reward. >> Well, we have to end sadly. Um, but I want to before we close, imagine a person >> is in the butcher shop and they're facing that person who's just saying the just cuss them out every day. >> You know what? How would you encourage them to keep going? >> I one of the things I have right now is objective perspective. I've got distance. And I've read the lives of many godly people. And I would just say to them, you got to trust the providence of God. You will get through this. This will work for your good. >> And you can't, you know, I my my hero of heroes is William Kerry. So I can plot. It's like I'm not good at much, man. He discipled India. He touched 26 areas of Indian life and culture through plotting. And when you go back through his life, many of those moments that seem like the darkest moments become the brightest moments. Many of those things that you never thought would >> have any kind of hope, these are just seeds that God's going to activate later. So, I'd just say zoom out. Don't collapse in the m zoom out. >> Look into your future. Know he's been good in your past. Look into the future. know he's going to meet you here and ask him for grace to endure >> because James 1, that's how you are formed. >> That's how your capacity grows. >> And I I can almost promise you what you're being tested with is a key for what you go through next. I can't tell people enough how much people say like, "Dude, there's so much stuff in New York. You just blah blah." I'm like, "This was formed in me at 17 years old. I am still I have the mentality of a manual worker doing 15-hour days cuz the truck came in and we're not leaving till it's done. >> And I I had no idea that was perfect training for a Manhattan lifestyle. >> Even have that in my head. So all of that stuff just got me ready to work with secular people who resist what we're building >> and I'm just going to out grind and outlast them because Jesus formed those gifts in me. So I just say keep going. >> Ask for God's grace. have some community to come and show up at work every now and then and give you buy you lunch and give you some hope >> and realize this will pass. Don't miss the lessons in the pain >> because this will pass. >> And Tim Keller say something like God's doing everything in your life that you would do for yourself if he saw if you saw what he sees and loved you perfectly. Right? Something like that. I think I messed >> Listen, before we let him go, >> I think we need like an official like expert opinion. What is the best steak? Like what is the best available steak from an actual butcher? >> Bun and ribball. >> Of course it is. Okay. I just needed to make sure that we were all on the same page there. One are southern. >> You want to pray, pastor? >> I do. First, but I do want to say thanks man. >> Thank you for having me. >> You know how we're all parents. You know how you really love people that bless your kids? >> Mhm. >> That's what I feel like with you being here. >> Thanks, man. Thanks. It was an honor. Really. I mean, it was I I loved it. >> Well, you'll be back. >> Yeah. >> Actually, soon for the men's conference. >> That's right. >> Let's pray. Father in heaven, Lord, we thank you for your faithfulness. >> We thank you for your sovereign hand. God, we can't get over the gospel that you would even redeem us. >> And then to call us to be a part of your team. And so, God, I pray that that your hand of blessing would continue to move not just on us, but through us. >> And God, we expand our hopes. we expand our dreams, our imaginations of what you can do for your glory and your glory alone. >> Absolutely. >> We pray it in Jesus name. Amen. >> Amen. >> Thank you for listening to this podcast. Wherever you're listening to this, please subscribe, rate, and leave us a positive five-star review. If you want me to come speak live at your event or on your podcast, just shoot me an email to info@unton.life. That's info@unton.life. Follow us on Instagram and like us on Facebook and check out our website for everything else, including how to donate to keep more content like this coming your way. Just go to www.undauntton.life. And as always, we want to thank the band Holy Name for allowing us to use their music for our content. The music on this podcast is their song Perpetual, which is off their self-titled debut album on Faceown Records. The links are in the description. I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. Remember, keep pushing back darkness. Keep forging spiritual, mental, and physical resilience. Keep seeking the Lion of Judah. [Music]