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This is Undaunted Life, a man's podcast.
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I'm your host Kyle Thompson.
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Let's get into it.
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Jesus heard that they had cast him out and having found him, he said, "Do you believe
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in the son of man?"
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That is John 935.
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Guys, we're so glad to have you here on today's show.
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If you've not left us a five star review, wherever you're listening to this, please leave
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us five stars.
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That's how the show will continue to get out to more people.
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Show us some love there.
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Also just a reminder, we are partnered with Origin.
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They're bringing manufacturing back to America.
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So if you do jujitsu, they have geese.
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They've got boots.
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They've got work boots, steel toe boots.
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That will be in the show notes and need to go in and dress the elephant in the room.
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For those of you that watch us on YouTube, okay, so I know most of you listened to it.
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But for those of you that watch us, the last two, the forging table episodes didn't have
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video.
1:26
Okay.
1:27
This is a video I meant, no video of me and the three other people at the table actually
1:30
talking.
1:31
Well, when you're running a show and when you do things and when you're basically doing
1:34
everything by yourself, you make mistakes.
1:37
And so on one of those, I forgot to hit record.
1:39
I think that was this past weeks.
1:41
And then the one before that, I have no idea where the video file is.
1:44
I looked for the little micro SD card.
1:46
I looked to my computer.
1:47
No idea.
1:48
So I just made like a little cool graphic.
1:50
But for those of you that are wondering, okay, is it just going to be this graphic every
1:52
time?
1:53
No, as long as I can, you know, remove my head from my rear end long enough to hit the
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record button, we shouldn't have that problem as we move forward.
2:00
But as I've teed up for long enough, if you guys are listening to this on time, this is
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February the 23rd and this is the last day.
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This is a very end of our knife raffle.
2:09
So again, guys, we did a giveaway of a custom made Stevenson knife that was going to be
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a fundraiser, not only front daunted life, but also the Hope pregnancy center here in
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Edmond, Oklahoma.
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And just earlier, we did a video.
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This is going to be the same video that is posted on Instagram or whatever.
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We have a winner, so let's go to the video here.
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All right, guys, if you're wondering what this crazy color wheel is, it's because we
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are on wheel of names.com.
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And what this is, this is everybody that donated to try to win this custom Stevenson
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knife.
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Half of the money is going to support on Don't Life and the other half is going to help
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the Hope pregnancy center here in Edmond, Oklahoma.
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Guys, every single one of these is a different person that donated.
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And if you donate it, you know, above $20, you know, every 20 bucks got your name on
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this list.
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And guys, we raised about $5,000.
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Again, half is going to on Don't To Life.
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The other half is a Hope pregnancy center, but guys, without further ado, let's see who's
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going to win this knife.
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Here we go.
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Do you feel the drama, do you feel the drama?
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Steven Addison.
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All right, guys, Steven Addison is our winner.
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Thank you again to you.
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This is a nice for providing us this custom knife and also to all of you that have donated.
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We really, really appreciate you guys.
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Keep seeking the line of Judah.
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All right.
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There you go, guys.
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So Steven Addison, thank you so much for being one of the donors and just congratulations.
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Obviously we'll connect with you to make sure that knife gets out to you as quickly as possible.
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But I just want to give my literal heartfelt and sincere thank you to every single one
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of you that donated.
3:41
We had people that donated everything from $20 up to $1,000.
3:45
And I think the big deal for this is it's not just supporting on Don't To Life, but it
3:48
is directly going to the Hope Pregnancy Center.
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It's going directly to help protect kids from murder to, you know, these just these
3:55
beautiful little babies in the womb, protecting them from potentially being murdered by their
3:59
parents and by the doctor and supporting a ministry that is taking care of these babies,
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not even before they're not just before they're born rather, but even well after making sure
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that the moms and dads and everybody is well taking care of.
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You guys did that around $5,000 was the final total and we're going to be running a check
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over there just as soon as we can get out of the studio and get over there.
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So big, big thank you to you guys.
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We really, really appreciate it.
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Now, I want to tell you, I know there's a lot of you guys out there that like our quick
4:55
hitter segment and we haven't really done that on the last several solo episodes and
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we've had a lot of interviews to release recently, but we're not going to be doing a
5:01
normal quick hitter here, but I just want to do something for the very, very beginning.
5:05
I want to give you my very quick thoughts on the so-called revival that was going on
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at Asbury University.
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So everybody's talked about this, a lot of people have asked me for my opinion on this.
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And here's the deal.
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There's been a lot of iterations of my feelings on this.
5:20
At first, I was like, it's not really a story.
5:22
Like it's just, you know, kind of an interesting thing happening and then it continued to grow
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and grow and grow and grow.
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And then people are going and visiting visiting it.
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There's people coming from all over the world to visit Asbury University there in Kentucky
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and to kind of do all these different things.
5:34
But I had some questions that came to mind as I was thinking through the situation at
5:38
Asbury.
5:39
But early on, I was going to ask, is it a revival or is it just like an annoyingly long worship
5:46
service?
5:47
Okay.
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So that was like kind of my first question in my mind that I didn't pose to anybody because
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it's kind of a mean question.
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But also it's like, okay, these are students.
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Is this really a revival or did they just not want to go to class?
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But then I had to kind of get a handle on my cynical side and a lot of people helped
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me with that.
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And I listened to John Cooper's podcast and listened to his thoughts on that.
6:05
It's like, okay, Kyle, like chill out.
6:06
Just relax.
6:07
Just put the cynicism aside for just a second.
6:10
So then the question morphed to shouldn't we want the revival to be real?
6:15
Because I saw a lot of people online that are, you know, a lot of people that kind of come
6:19
from the reformed Calvin aside that they've never seen a church service that they've liked
6:22
unless it's, you know, one that John MacArthur is doing or someone that just literally reads
6:26
the words of Calvin the entire time.
6:28
And so yeah, these people are like, well, it's not a, it's not a revival because of this,
6:31
this and this.
6:32
And did you hear about this?
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And did you hear about that?
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I think was, I couldn't substantiate a lot of the claims that were happening and it wasn't
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just coming from reformed guys.
6:39
So guys don't get your, you know, get your IPAs in a water, whatever.
6:42
But like at this point, I was like, okay, there's some weird stuff happening.
6:47
There's some weird people there.
6:48
There's some weird things being said, but we should really hope that revival is happening.
6:53
We should really, really hope that it is happening.
6:55
And for a few days, it's like, okay, this thing's like expanding and there's so many
6:59
people coming in and people that just want to be there and they're, they're turning these
7:03
big-time pastors away because they don't want what's happening there to be overturned
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and kind of the focus to be off of what's happening.
7:09
But now the question is, is it actually a revival if it ends when the president of the
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university declares that it's over?
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Because for those of you that haven't been paying attention in the last couple of days,
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the president of Asbury University, I don't have his name here in front of me, but he
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actually said that, hey, there's been about 50,000 people that have showed up to our small
7:29
town, this town just does not have the, the things in place to take care of these people
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to house them, to feed them, to do all these different things like, you know, we're just
7:38
shutting down the revival or we're moving it to several other different places.
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So I'm going out on my skis a little bit because I may change my mind later and I reserve the
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right to do so.
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I don't think you can call it a revival if one man can say because of logistical problems
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and struggles, we're going to have to stop this.
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I don't think if it's a real movement of God that you're going to let the lack of sufficient
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hotel rooms and restaurants and lawn chairs really keep you from keeping this thing going.
8:10
And so as much as I was really wanting this to kind of be this big, huge movement of God,
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I just don't really see it.
8:16
You've already seen advertisements for where the quote unquote revival is being moved to
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these offsite places.
8:23
They're doing advertisements like, hey, the first 600 people to show up will get, you
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know, Chick-fil-A and a T-shirt or something like that, it's like, okay, if it's, if it's
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a revival, if it's a real movement of God, do you need to incentivize people showing
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up to it?
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Again, I was cynical at the beginning and I really had to kind of check myself and say,
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hey, if this is a real movement of God, I don't want to be the one of the ones wagging
8:44
my finger at it saying, oh, well, you're not doing it properly.
8:46
But then we get to the end here and it's like, okay, it looks like it was just a really,
8:50
really long service that just kind of kept going.
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And then the students got excited and the people in the community got excited and the
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people from outside the community came into the community to keep the excitement going.
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But I don't think that we can actually call this a revival.
9:03
Now, I got a couple of other things and guys, don't worry.
9:06
I'm definitely going to get to the Jordan Peterson thing, but I don't know when the next
9:09
time is I'm going to be talking to you, you know, live like on the same week that I'm
9:11
actually recording.
9:13
So I do want to give you a couple of updates.
9:15
One update is on my throat and all my voice.
9:17
And I'll tell you just from the jump here, my throat is terrible right now.
9:20
I literally have like a double batch right here, I don't know if you guys watching this,
9:23
I literally have like two T bags in here.
9:25
So I got a double batch of throat coat tea going on right now.
9:27
I got water.
9:28
I got lozenges a whole deal.
9:30
But I have received a diagnosis on the problem with my throat.
9:34
And so without getting into all of that and without getting into all the details, I went
9:38
to a very renowned ear nose and throat doctor here in my area that has had a lot of success
9:43
with helping people with major voice issues, even voice issues that are way worse than mine.
9:48
And this is an issue that I've been dealing with for about 20 years.
9:51
And now that I do professional speaking on a podcast and live and all that, it's obviously
9:54
a very detrimental thing.
9:56
It got to the point, I think I mentioned this the last time I talked about my voice where
9:59
I'm avoiding seeing people that I know like at the grocery store or walking the dogs in
10:03
the neighborhood because I'm like, man, they're going to make me talk.
10:07
Like I'm going to have to talk for two or three minutes and I just don't want to do that.
10:09
You know, I'm sitting here right now looking at some speaking gigs that I have coming up
10:13
and some different things that I have going on here that I need to talk, you know, just
10:16
diatically with people across the table or up on a stage in front of a bunch of people
10:19
and I'm like, man, you know, this is going to really, really suck.
10:21
I have to do a lot of preparation.
10:22
It's a terrible place to be where you're not confident in your instrument.
10:25
And for me, my instrument is my voice.
10:28
But I do have a diagnosis and I have a plan of action.
10:30
And so in the beginning of April, I am going to be getting surgery.
10:34
So they are going to be cutting me open and putting some, you know, stuff up in my vocal
10:39
cord area and some different things like that, again, not getting into all the details.
10:43
But there's going to be a recovery process after that.
10:45
And the thing is, is while I'm hopeful about this, it's not a guarantee because my voice
10:50
could be fixed.
10:52
My voice could be the exact same or my voice could actually get significantly worse from
10:57
this particular surgery.
10:59
And so I'm hopeful, but I do still need your guys as prayers.
11:04
What we are going to do, and I'll talk about this again before the time comes, but for
11:07
April and May, don't be shocked if we go down to two episodes a week, just the forging
11:13
table on Sunday in the interview on Tuesday because I'm going to have a whole bunch of
11:17
interviews in the can.
11:18
I'm doing a lot of interviews in March to make sure that I can have stuff to release in April
11:22
and May.
11:23
If there are things that go wrong, the worst case scenario is if there's significant damage
11:27
to my voice and vocal cords that where I can't continue talking, I will have someone else
11:32
come on this podcast feed, read something or give an update to you guys, because that
11:37
would stretch maybe into June and July and obviously we want to avoid any other issues
11:40
like that.
11:41
I don't want to say that to like scare anybody because, believe me, I'm scared that, you
11:45
know, my voice could possibly get worse than it is right now, but I know a lot of you guys
11:48
were praying for me.
11:49
I got a lot of messages, a lot of emails from you guys saying that you're praying for me
11:53
and that, you know, if there's anything I can do and here's some suggestions and all that.
11:56
I appreciate all that, but that is the update April, second week of April, I will be getting
12:00
vocal cord surgery.
12:02
There will be no interruption in the show aside from if you're used to the three episodes,
12:05
it'll go down to two for a short period of time.
12:08
Again, if all things go well, I'll go right back into the normal cadence and things.
12:11
You'll just, you know, hear a slightly stronger voice.
12:13
So there's the update on that.
12:15
So before I get to the next thing, taking a quick sip, one quick thing again, before
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I get to the door in Peterson stuff, on episode four, four twenty six of this podcast, I talked
12:25
about my concerns with some of the things that I've heard pastor JD Greer say, okay.
12:30
So guys, if you have not listened to episode four, twenty six of this podcast, at least
12:34
go back and listen to the intro, you don't have to listen to the entire thing, but go
12:36
back and listen to the intro where I talk about JD Greer so that you can be caught up
12:40
and up to speed.
12:42
And so there were a lot of responses that I got.
12:44
So the responses I got from a lot of people were anything from, hey, he's a good dude.
12:49
He's one of the good guys like, you know, you maybe should have thought about that a
12:52
little bit more all the way up to your horrible person, JD Greer is the best.
12:55
Why in the world are you trying to create schism within the church and all this kind
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of stuff?
12:59
So the responses were literally all over the place.
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But many people shared with me this article that JD Greer published on the gospel coalition's
13:07
website called downplaying the sin of homosexuality won't win the next generation.
13:12
So the link to that is in the show notes guys.
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I would highly suggest you go read that.
13:16
But I want to cover one thing right from the jump to everyone that got so offended again,
13:20
not everyone that reached out to me was like, you know, clutching their pearls as they were
13:23
typing the email.
13:24
But there were a lot of people that were offended that I would dare talk about their favorite
13:27
pastor JD Greer.
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My episode again, this just logistics here.
13:32
My episode came out at three AM central standard time on February the 9th.
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That episode was written and recorded a couple of days, even before that.
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So like on February the 7th, the gospel coalition article from Greer also came out on February
13:48
the 9th, but it came out after my episode.
13:52
So obviously had I been able to tell the future, I would have waited and read the article before
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making my commentary, okay?
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So I can't be judged on the information I didn't have.
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I can only be judged on the information that I did have.
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But let's talk a little bit about the actual article to, you know, cause some of you think
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I made a fool of myself because I released this podcast before this article even came
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out.
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And you know, essentially you were so offended because I was like, Hey, we need to keep a
14:17
very close eye on pastor JD Greer again.
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I think I was very, very fair in my initial commentary and I gave him several out saying,
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Hey, he could probably clarify.
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But in the article again, it's in the show notes.
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Other addresses all the hubbub created by Andy Stanley.
14:30
Again, I go into a ton of detail about that on episode 423 of this podcast.
14:35
And that's where I lay out my argument that Andy Stanley is actually a heretic.
14:38
So go back and listen to 423 if you haven't listened to that.
14:41
But there are some key quotes from JD Greer's article in the gospel coalition website.
14:45
One of them is up to this point.
14:47
You might be thinking I support Stanley's approach or at least sympathize with it, but
14:51
I don't.
14:52
Okay.
14:53
So this is on the tail end of his introduction where it actually does seem like, Oh, he's
14:56
going to be coming to any Stanley's defense here, but then he says, but I don't.
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Okay.
15:00
So it's like, all right.
15:01
Buckle up.
15:02
He's going to start making his arguments.
15:03
Another quote from there that is very key is the call to repentance isn't just offensive
15:07
to gay people.
15:09
It's offensive to us all.
15:10
Okay.
15:11
So that's one thing in this whole space where there's a lot of people that try to separate
15:14
centers.
15:15
So you have the sin of homosexuality and acting out homosexuality.
15:18
And then there's all the other sins.
15:20
Okay.
15:21
But he's making the correct point that the call to repentance, you know, that comes from
15:24
the gospel and the need for the propitiation of sins before you can become in the presence
15:29
of a holy and just God.
15:30
It's offensive to everybody.
15:32
But when we pretend that it's especially offensive to gay people, but that's actually
15:36
wrong.
15:37
And another quick quote from there is this he said, ambiguity on this issue isn't kindness,
15:43
kindness, clarity is so ambiguity on this issue isn't kindness, clarity is.
15:48
And so throughout the article, again, I'll let you go ahead and read it.
15:51
He's trying to make very, very clear arguments as to kind of why he's saying things in the
15:55
way that he is and the arguments he's making.
15:57
And if I were to summarize the article, I would do so in this way, pastors should not shrink
16:01
away from the tough topics, but we must present the gospel message with grace and truth.
16:08
So again, I'm nothing.
16:09
If not fair, that is how I would summarize J.D.
16:11
Greer's thoughts.
16:12
I think that's a fair assessment.
16:14
Again, I would encourage you to go read it for yourself to determine what you think to see
16:17
if I'm being fair and how I'm, you know, summarizing that.
16:20
But as I was preparing this episode today, I came across another video and believe me,
16:27
I wasn't seeking it out.
16:29
These videos are like finding me, but this is another video that should be very concerning.
16:34
So in this clip, it's a clip from a conversation between Debbie Causey, who I mentioned on the
16:40
Andy Stanley podcast, who is a pastor, quote unquote, at North Point, which is Andy Stanley's
16:44
church and his conversation with her and Greg and Lynn McDonald.
16:49
So Greg and Lynn McDonald both serve as counselors for North Point.
16:53
The McDonald's also work with a gay affirming so-called Christian ministry called the Reformation
16:58
Project.
16:59
Okay.
17:00
So let's hear what Greg McDonald had to say in this interaction between him, his wife,
17:04
and Debbie Causey.
17:05
Yeah.
17:06
I think for me that the thing that I hear parents most concerned about is their child
17:12
going to hell.
17:14
And that's the thing that it's universal, everybody is very, very concerned about that.
17:22
You know, recently I heard, I read an article where JD Greer was speaking and I love what
17:29
he said.
17:30
He said, "Homosexuality doesn't send you to hell."
17:34
He said, "I know that because being heterosexual doesn't send you to heaven.
17:39
What sends you to hell is refusing to allow Jesus to be the Lord and center of your life,
17:44
regardless of how it manifests."
17:46
Right?
17:47
And I just, when I heard that, I was like, "Oh man, that just really sums it up."
17:54
And again, for most parents, you know, they don't get that.
18:00
And so that's part of our ministry is helping parents and understanding that journey.
18:07
That's the thing that can keep parents hemmed up for a long time.
18:11
And just so you don't think that Greg McDonald is actually misquoting JD Greer here, here's
18:15
the clip of JD Greer actually saying that.
18:19
Homosexuality does not send you to hell.
18:21
You know how I know that?
18:23
Because heterosexuality does not send you to heaven.
18:26
Now, I don't know if that specific quote is attributable to Greer in its origin because
18:32
I literally saw several other videos.
18:34
One of Tim Keller and another one of another guy didn't recognize where they either said
18:38
that exact quote verbatim or almost verbatim.
18:41
Okay.
18:42
Now, a couple of things with that clip with Greg McDonald.
18:44
One thing Greg McDonald said is that, you know, every parent is concerned about their
18:48
child going to hell.
18:49
That's universal.
18:50
He's not talking about that's universal with all parents everywhere with any type of
18:54
child.
18:55
He's talking specifically about gay and lesbian children.
18:58
That's specifically what he's talking about.
19:00
So he's being performative and saying that somehow it's different.
19:03
Because the level of concern of the souls of your children is different if they align
19:07
or identify as LGBTQ plus.
19:09
Okay.
19:10
So to not belabor this any further because I definitely don't want to this to turn into
19:14
the JD Greer update podcast where every week I come on here, I have to talk about this.
19:19
But a few things.
19:20
Number one, I'm glad he wrote the article because again, if you go back to my initial
19:23
comments on JD Greer, I said, Hey, if I were sitting down with him, I would want clarification
19:27
on dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, and I laid it all out there.
19:30
So he gave some clarifying thoughts in this, so I'm really glad that he wrote the article.
19:33
I'm glad for every single one of you that texted me this emailed me this DM me this believe
19:38
me.
19:39
I was covered up in this article.
19:40
Guys, I get it.
19:41
Another thought is there are only a few options for what's happening here.
19:45
Okay.
19:46
With this whole situation, a the McDonald's and others are using this Greer quote incorrectly
19:54
and applying it to their situation to substantiate themselves and their work be JD Greer is accidentally
20:02
speaking out of both sides of his mouth or see JD Greer is deliberately speaking out of
20:09
both sides of his mouth.
20:10
Okay.
20:11
Now, if I were to venture a guess, I would say that A and B are both true that A and B
20:16
are the case.
20:17
Now, I don't know that to be true, but that's my guess.
20:20
But I think the McDonald's are using this JD group quote incorrectly and applying it
20:25
to their situation.
20:26
And I also think that JD Greer is accidentally speaking out of both sides of his mouth.
20:31
My point is, is that JD Greer isn't speaking and writing with as much clarity as he thinks
20:37
he is because here's the thing I want to be very, very, very specific here.
20:43
You are not responsible for how somebody uses your quotes or uses your words.
20:48
You're only responsible for the words that you say and what you meant for them, the,
20:53
I guess the, the meaning that you wanted to get across.
20:56
So if somebody twists the words that you said or twists what you meant, that's not your fault.
21:00
Again, I've got 400 something episodes out there right now and a bunch of other interviews
21:04
that I've been on.
21:05
There are plenty of clippable, clippable things where you could take me out of context and
21:09
make me look as horrible as possible.
21:11
But those are my words.
21:13
I'm responsible for my words and how I meant for them to come across.
21:18
But again, his quote from the article is ambiguity on this issue isn't kindness, clarity is.
21:25
So this is what I would say.
21:27
Again, I laid out, you know, my arguments on the last time I talked about JD Greer on some
21:32
of the things that are concerning to me on this whole array of kind of woke topics and
21:36
LGBTQ stuff and Ray stuff and all that.
21:38
And this is where I land.
21:39
Okay.
21:40
So we can put this JD Greer stuff to bed for a little bit.
21:42
I think that we should still keep an eye on him.
21:46
Is that so crazy for somebody that has a huge platform, an enormous multi site church that
21:52
we should keep an eye on him and hold his feet to the fire?
21:55
That if he says something or does something that is awkward or poorly worded or poorly
22:01
delivered, that we should say something about that, that we should raise a red flag.
22:07
That if you go to one of his churches and I know there are people from his church that
22:10
listen to this podcast, I know for a fact, like shouldn't you make sure that you get
22:15
him on the record saying this, that or the other thing is one of the things that I very
22:18
much so appreciated from JD Greer's article with the gospel coalition is how he was basically
22:22
encouraging North Point to come out and give clarification on the LGBTQ issue on whether
22:27
or not they're gay affirming.
22:29
Now he did it in a sentence.
22:30
And I know he probably wrote that thinking this isn't going to happen in a million years.
22:34
Of course, they're not going to do this, but he did call for that.
22:37
I think you should do the same with him.
22:39
Now what I'm not saying you should do is that every pastor on the planet, you're just falling
22:43
them around and you got your notebook out and you're just ready for him to mess up so
22:46
you can jot it down and tell the local news or tell the podcast or you like the most or
22:49
something like that.
22:50
No, it's not what I'm saying.
22:52
But these pastors deserve to be respected, but they also deserve to be held account.
22:59
And if they break that trust, if they break a covenant, if they break from scripture, we
23:04
should call them out.
23:05
That's such a big deal.
23:06
All right.
23:07
Let's move on from that.
23:08
So I need to talk about my time with Jordan Peterson and I just got to tell you as I take
23:13
another sip here, I am so thankful that this happened.
23:20
And I'll get into the whole story.
23:21
I'll just go and get into it now.
23:22
So there's a mutual friend of Jordan Peterson and me that is, hey, he was like, basically,
23:28
I know that Jordan Peterson is really important to you, like it makes perfect sense.
23:32
And so he goes, tell you what, check out his tour dates.
23:35
If his tours come in anywhere close to you in the next several months, let me know.
23:39
I'll get you connected with his team and then we'll get you guys together.
23:42
Now, the thing about it is is like that's one thing to say that, but then it's just like,
23:45
man, you know, he's been touring literally all over the world.
23:49
But I go to Jordan Peterson's website and wouldn't you know it, he was going to be in Tulsa, Oklahoma,
23:53
about an hour and a half away from my house, like two weeks from that moment.
23:57
And so I was like, Oh, crap, yeah, let's do this.
24:00
And so I got introduced to his team and it's funny enough.
24:02
It's the same team I've been working with since 2019 to get him on the show.
24:07
But we get everything coordinated and it's like, okay, I'm going to go up to Tulsa and
24:11
I'm going to see his show.
24:13
But from there, I didn't really know what to expect.
24:16
So it's very excited.
24:17
My wife and I were going to go.
24:18
She likes Jordan Peterson, you know, not nearly as much as me.
24:20
She hasn't, you know, engaged with his content as much as I have.
24:23
But we're both very, very excited.
24:25
And the thing about it is leading up to it.
24:27
I was thinking, okay, there's a chance I'm going to get to meet him.
24:30
I don't really know if it's just going to be a handshake and a picture and, you know,
24:33
get the heck out of here or if I'm going to be able to sit down with him.
24:36
But Jordan Peterson gets asked four things all the time.
24:40
He gets asked for a picture.
24:41
Hey, can you sign my book?
24:42
Hey, can you, you know, talk to my mom on the phone real quick?
24:45
I wanted to get him something.
24:47
So I wanted to give him something as a gift for me to basically show him, Hey, this is,
24:51
you've had a big impact on me and the stuff that I do.
24:53
I just want to kind of, you know, say thank you.
24:55
So what I decided to do, the very first idea that came to mind was to get him a Bible,
24:59
right?
25:00
But more than that.
25:02
So he has talked about a lot on his podcast and his public appearances in his books about
25:08
how interesting and important the Bible is.
25:11
And he specifically says that the Bible is the number one, most hyperlinked document
25:17
in history, meaning that this verse relates to this verse, which relates to these two
25:23
verses, which relates to these verses or something like that.
25:26
So it's very hyperlinked.
25:27
And it's very cross reference.
25:29
He has that image that he's shown sometimes where it's this big image from Genesis to
25:32
Revelation and it has all the different lines where, you know, this attaches this and attaches
25:37
to that.
25:38
So I go to my local bookstore here in Edmond, Oklahoma and I go and I get him an ESV English
25:43
standard version verse by verse reference Bible.
25:46
So what that is, is that is basically a hyperlinked paper Bible.
25:51
So on the page, every single scripture that has a corollary to another scripture within,
25:58
you know, within that, it shows it right there in the footnotes.
26:03
So it's footnoted.
26:04
So you can know exactly where this attaches to this and this attaches to that and all
26:08
that.
26:09
And then I went to the front and I was going to get his name put on it.
26:10
So Dr. Jordan B. Peterson.
26:11
And so it was actually kind of funny.
26:13
I'm interacting with the guy and you know, you have to write it in those little block letters
26:16
and they have to check the spelling and all that.
26:18
And the guy looks at my paper and he goes, Jordan B. Peterson, I mean, not the Jordan
26:22
B. Peterson.
26:23
And then I just kind of look at him and I'm like, no, it's, it's for the Jordan B.
26:27
Peterson.
26:28
And then his eyes got real big.
26:29
He's like, wait, wait a minute.
26:30
Wait a minute.
26:31
This Bible is going to be given to Jordan Peterson, the Jordan Peterson.
26:35
And I was like, that's the idea.
26:37
And all of a sudden he gets like really nervous and he's like, okay, he's like check in to
26:41
make sure he's got the right thing.
26:42
And okay, are you sure this is spelled right?
26:44
Okay.
26:45
I'm sure you want to in script letters and not block letters or are you sure you want to,
26:48
you know, in gold and all that.
26:49
So it's kind of a funny interaction, but here we go.
26:51
I got it.
26:52
And so the day comes where he's coming to Tulsa.
26:54
So my wife and I, we get a babysitter to watch the boys and then we go in and head up to
26:57
Tulsa and we're going to have ourselves a nice dinner.
27:01
So we go to the Hemingway, a really, really nice restaurant in Tulsa.
27:04
And so it's kind of like we hadn't had a nice dinner like that basically since our first
27:07
child was born, you know, almost three years ago.
27:10
And so we got to have a good time with that.
27:12
We get over to the convention center and there's people everywhere, just like so many people.
27:17
So I drop her off so she doesn't have to walk in her heels and I go park somewhere often.
27:21
Who knows where.
27:22
And then I come to the front as she's going through security and security is holding up
27:25
like this note card with, you know, hey, you can't bring anything in.
27:28
That's bigger than this and her purse or a little person, she was carrying was bigger
27:32
than that.
27:33
And the thing about this purse, this was like her great ants, like antique purse.
27:37
And so it's like, okay, we, we can't not bring that in, but then they also weren't going
27:40
to let me bring in the Bible because it was bigger than that little note card as well.
27:43
And so I call Jordan Peterson's tour manager, his tour manager comes over, just literally
27:48
walks us right through security.
27:49
So that was cool.
27:50
Again, there's a huge crowd.
27:51
There's a ton of excitement.
27:52
And at this point, I'm like, I'm like, giddy, because it's like, you know, without sounding
27:57
to [inaudible], like I've been around a lot of celebrities and quote unquote, important people
28:00
in my life.
28:01
I used to work for Major League Baseball.
28:02
And that was a huge part of my job was hanging out with these so called important famous
28:05
people.
28:06
And I've had, you know, some big people with big followings on this podcast and all that.
28:10
But like, I was like, Oh man.
28:13
We're here.
28:14
Like, I don't remember the last time I've been that excited for like a concert or a speech
28:16
or really anything.
28:17
I was so, so excited.
28:20
So we go in there.
28:21
There's about 3000 people that are in this convention center that there was an opening
28:24
musician, a guy named David Carter, I think is how you say his last name, C O T T E R.
28:28
He plays like classical guitar, he played some Rodrigo, he Gabriela and he played some
28:32
Eagles and everything's like that just as people were coming in.
28:33
So that was cool.
28:34
And then the opening story, I guess the opening act you could say was actually Jordan's wife,
28:39
Amy Peterson, so she comes out and tells a little story about her and Jordan and about
28:44
how it attaches to one of the specific rules.
28:46
That was probably 10 minutes.
28:47
And then Jordan Peterson comes out.
28:49
And so he gets a standing ovation right from the beginning, which was cool.
28:52
And when he gets into his speech, it was actually the first time speaking publicly where he spoke
28:58
in specific detail about him putting together a rival to the world economic forum.
29:03
So on the Joe Rogan experience here, however many weeks back, he talked about how he was
29:08
going to create this thing and some of the questions that they were going to be going
29:10
into.
29:11
But at ours, at our presentation in Tulsa, he's like, hey, yeah, we've actually decided
29:15
some things and it's going to be called arc ARC.
29:18
And so I literally forgot to jot it down.
29:19
But I think it's association of reasonable citizens.
29:22
I think is what arc stands for.
29:23
That's when it's going to be called.
29:24
He went into detail as to all the questions that arc is going to try to take on why he's
29:30
presenting that as an alternative to the world economic forum.
29:33
And I just thought it was an absolutely fantastic thing.
29:35
And it was so interesting.
29:36
And again, he was just like, hey, this is the first time because we literally just got
29:39
some of the stuff solidified.
29:40
So here's kind of how we're going to be working through.
29:43
And then he started getting into some other points and I won't give give away obviously
29:46
the entire thing.
29:47
But there are some very memorable points from his talk.
29:50
One he talked about after the dragon was slayed in sleeping beauty, Prince Charming didn't
29:57
just walk right up and kiss sleeping beauty and you know, they lived happily ever after.
30:02
After he slayed the dragon, Prince Charming had to go through a bunch of thorns that were
30:06
surrounding the castle that were put there by a Maleficent and all that.
30:09
And before he could get to sleeping beauty and he was basically talking about, you know,
30:14
basically in your life, if you have that dragon, whatever that dragon is, once you slay that
30:19
dragon and move beyond it, this assumption that that's just going to be easy smooth sailing
30:23
from there is not really true because there will always be things that come up and you
30:27
have to be ready for that.
30:28
Like that such is life as it were.
30:31
Another thing that he said is he talked about how because a lot of you that have daily wire
30:34
subscriptions, you're watching his Exodus series, which is fantastic, by the way.
30:39
But it's him and like seven other guys around the table that are talking through the book
30:43
of Exodus.
30:44
And so they did eight episodes that have already been released.
30:46
And then they've done the the back half and on the back half there's eight more episodes
30:49
and on some of those episodes, Ben Shapiro is a part of that, but he said that he learned
30:53
from Ben Shapiro and Dennis Prager that the translation of the name Eve, again, of Adam
30:58
and Eve fame is beneficial adversary.
31:02
And what's funny is there was kind of a giggle in the audience because most of us don't really
31:06
know what the, you know, Hebrew of of Eve and what that means and everything, but beneficial
31:10
adversary.
31:11
So for any of you guys out there that have a wife and, you know, if she's got a strong
31:14
personality or got a lot of things going for herself and you feel like you're butting heads
31:18
a lot.
31:19
I know that from personal experience, I never really thought about it like she's a beneficial
31:23
adversary.
31:24
Like there's there's a reason why she's here in our life, you know, everyone hears about
31:27
opposites attract and yeah, if you're introverted and your wife extroverted, like that's a good
31:30
thing because you don't want to just both be sitting home and never do anything or both
31:34
being outside being obnoxious all the time in public.
31:37
And so you kind of are able to play off of each other, but you're also learning how you
31:39
can compliment one another.
31:41
So that was a memorable thing from a speech.
31:43
And then after he did his speech, he did a little Q and A with his wife, where his wife
31:47
had the questions because you could ask questions as you were coming in there and then you could
31:51
upvote them or downvote them.
31:52
And so he did a couple of those, but he talked about how, you know, every couple, every married
31:56
couple needs to do, you know, 90 minutes of romance, one to three times per week.
32:02
And so what he's talking about, they talk about that in a lot of ways.
32:05
So in 90 minutes of talking and interacting with one another and, you know, taking care
32:09
of some of the business things that are part of your relationship.
32:11
And he also talked about basically coming together romantically, sexually, physically,
32:16
one to three times per week and kind of what that looks like.
32:19
He also did something kind of cool.
32:20
He stood up and he was showing the audience something that he learned at a dance class
32:24
with his wife.
32:25
Or a Nashville or something like that.
32:26
But typically when you're holding, you're doing slow dancing or something like that.
32:29
So you've got the hand around the waist and then you typically hold hands, right?
32:32
So you're either holding the hand or you're interlocking the fingers, but professional
32:36
dancers, they don't do that.
32:37
What they will do is they will put their palms together.
32:41
And so basically you're pushing back and forth.
32:43
And so if you're the man and you're leading the dance, you're basically, basically signaling
32:48
to the woman by the pressure and the movement of your hand, again, that she has to press
32:52
back on so that you don't lose connection, you're showing her where you want her to go
32:57
and how you want her to go there and in what speed and all of that.
32:59
And so he actually did that with Tammy a little bit.
33:01
So that was kind of interesting.
33:02
Again, beneficial adversary.
33:04
You have to have pushing from both sides.
33:06
But probably the most memorable thing for me from the talk was he talked about when you're
33:11
going through peaks and valleys in your life, that the goal should not be to operate efficiently
33:18
and effectively in the moment as you try to return to stasis.
33:23
That shouldn't be the goal.
33:25
Your goal should be to operate optimally across the entire bevy of peaks and valleys combined
33:31
over time to get to the end goal.
33:35
And I remember that being like earth shattering for me and my wife and I talked about on the
33:39
way home and she really liked that as well, because as you're looking at your life, you're
33:43
either in a peak or in a valley, you're not going to be in stasis for very long and you're
33:46
certainly not going to live there, right?
33:48
So you're either on the way up and you're kind of waiting to see when the bomb is going
33:52
to fall out or you're in the valley and you're trying to just scrape and claw to get back
33:57
to stasis or get back to the good side.
34:00
And so your perspective is stuck in that moment.
34:05
Your perspective is stuck in trying to get to stasis or get to positive or to avoid negative
34:09
to avoid the valleys, right?
34:12
But that shouldn't be the goal.
34:13
The goal should be to look at your life as like, okay, I'm going to have a ton of these.
34:17
And if I were to be able to begin with the end in mind, if you will, seven habits of
34:21
a highly effective people, look at it as a line of demarcation from here to the end.
34:26
And you operate optimally across all of those circumstances.
34:31
As opposed to, yeah, you know, I did good in that valley and not so good in that valley
34:34
or, yeah, when I was peaked here, I was really cocky about it.
34:37
And then the next time I was really humble, no, no, it's operating optimally across all
34:41
of that.
34:42
That's made sense.
34:43
But then the show is over, okay?
34:46
Gets a standing ovation.
34:47
Everybody starts to leave, but then there's a gathering of people that got the VIP tickets.
34:51
They're kind of hanging out at the front of the stage because that's where, you know,
34:53
the line's going to be where you basically go through the line, shake his hand.
34:56
Hey, you know, you're important to me and then you take a picture and then you get out there.
34:59
But his tour manager said, Hey, Kyle, after the show is over, just come to this side of
35:04
the stage and we'll just go from there again, I don't know what that means.
35:08
But basically it's just my wife and I standing there and then his tour manager comes out from
35:12
behind the curtain and says, All right, guys, come on back.
35:14
And so here we are walking through, I guess, the catacombs of this convention center and
35:19
his, uh, his tour manager just walks us into the green room.
35:23
So in the green room, there's a few of his staff members, but it's just him and his wife.
35:27
And then we should cut to hang out.
35:29
So I'm sitting there with Jordan Peterson, introduce himself, he introduces our, his wife
35:34
to us.
35:35
I introduce my wife to him.
35:36
And then we sit down and then we're just chatting on the couches and we're talking about
35:39
the Exodus series and we're talking about the speech that he gave, we're talking about
35:43
the tour and all those different things.
35:45
And then Cody Jinx, who's a, who's a country singer, he came in with his wife, you know,
35:49
five, 10 minutes later.
35:50
And I was like, you know, I didn't want to hog him and I knew he needed to go out and
35:53
do his VIP meet and greet as well.
35:55
And so then I explained to him, Hey, I got you this.
35:58
I pulled the Bible out.
35:59
I explained what I explained earlier about how he says it's hyperlinked and how this is
36:02
verse by verse reference and how it's got his name on it.
36:04
And he seemed genuinely very appreciative that I'd done that for him.
36:08
So he opens it up, he starts looking through, he's like, Oh, wow, like this is actually
36:11
really awesome.
36:12
And then, you know, he goes and meets with some other people.
36:14
We hang out for a little bit longer.
36:16
And then he went up and did his meet and greet.
36:18
And so the, you know, there were probably 200 people, 150 200 people in the line for
36:22
the meet and greet.
36:23
And so my wife and I were almost sheepishly, we were just like walking past all these
36:26
people.
36:27
It's like, yeah, we just got to hang out with them for like 10 minutes and have a nice conversation.
36:29
Here they are just waiting for their one chance to be in line.
36:32
And you know, we got in the car and took off and, and went home.
36:35
And I just got to tell you guys, like for, for days after, so that was on a Monday, like
36:39
I felt like I was floating until like Thursday.
36:41
And just to be honest, I was in such a good mood, I felt like it was such a blessing from
36:46
God that that was able to work that, you know, he and I kind of started having a little bit
36:50
of relationship and a dialogue and how that will, you know, help out in the future.
36:54
But what that kind of led to whenever I posted the picture, the picture is online on social
36:57
media.
36:58
The big question was, did you do an interview with him?
37:00
When's it coming out?
37:01
Like some of you guys thought it was coming out, but I, you know, I really see an interview
37:04
with you on me park, which, you know, has done incredibly well.
37:07
But the, the answer to that question is no, we didn't do an interview, not yet.
37:11
But you know, I've, I've talked with his team and you guys do not even, you can't even fathom
37:16
how busy he is, the things he's doing for himself, for his multiple businesses, for the
37:21
daily wire, for writing, he's got a lot of things going on.
37:25
But it's going to happen eventually.
37:26
I have full faith that it's going to happen eventually, but it may be a while.
37:30
Okay, but that is something that we certainly will get down.
37:34
But one thing I want to do before I let you guys go is I actually want to talk about why
37:37
Jordan Peterson is so important to me and, and so many others, especially men, and actually
37:42
through that out there on social media, you know, hey, why is Jordan Peterson so important
37:46
to you?
37:47
And the answers were everything from he's not, he's stupid, which it's like, okay, great.
37:51
Thank you for feeling the need to post that to guys that are like, Hey, I was addicted
37:54
to meth.
37:55
And then I started listening to his lectures and I started to clean my life up, or hey,
37:59
my life is in shambles.
38:00
I was thinking about committing suicide.
38:01
And then I started reading his books and it really kind of took care of things for me.
38:04
And so people have a deep level of appreciation for Jordan Peterson.
38:08
But one of the reasons why it's so important to me is that he wrote one of the greatest
38:12
books ever, 12 rules for life.
38:14
So on our book list on our website, undonta.life/book list, we have the 100 books every modern Christian
38:19
man should read list.
38:20
12 rules for life is like a top five, maybe top three book for me ever.
38:25
Which is such an important book that it can be put into the self help space, but it doesn't
38:29
feel like all these other vapid self help books where it's just like, believe and achieve
38:33
and you can do it.
38:34
And you know, sit down and visualize.
38:35
And all of a sudden the world will, you know, open up to you or something like that.
38:38
He really digs down into a lot of very, very important subjects matters in that book.
38:43
And so just by virtue of that, I mean, that book, I own that book in physical copy, digital
38:47
copy and audio, right?
38:49
Like it's a very, very important book.
38:51
And I've listened to it several times.
38:52
It's just, it's an incredible thing.
38:53
It's very important.
38:54
The reason he's so important to me is his demeanor during contentious interviews or debates.
39:00
So if you've been following Jordan Peterson for any length of time, you know, he's been
39:03
a part of some very contentious debates.
39:05
He's been in these gotcha interviews that he knew were going to be gotcha interviews
39:08
before he went in.
39:09
He's been a part of gotcha interviews that he didn't know were going to be like that
39:12
before he got in.
39:14
But the way he handles himself is very, very honorable during these because you got to think
39:18
of it.
39:19
These people are trying to get him to say something that could get him canceled.
39:21
They're trying to put him in a corner or something like that.
39:24
He's just very, very calm.
39:27
There was the one that he did just like the week before the 12 rules for life release.
39:31
I forgot the lady's name.
39:32
It's that blonde lady from the UK.
39:34
And it was just a master class and how to set a hook and wait because this gal just kept
39:41
like, you know, changing his words around saying, so what you actually mean is is, so
39:45
what you're saying is, and then she would change his meaning.
39:48
And then finally he nailed her.
39:50
Finally, and got her, but he's done that so many times with these people where he's like,
39:53
he lets them talk, lets them talk.
39:55
But then when he needs to turn up the heat a little bit in these interviews or debates,
39:58
he does so.
39:59
But he's very rarely gets out over his skis or allows his anger or his negative feelings
40:05
or malice or any of that kind of come into what he's doing.
40:08
And so for me, with a very strong personality and I like to fight and I like to get into
40:12
these debates, it's good for me to understand that there's a time and place to be calm and
40:16
to let them, you know, come into the trap, and then there's a time and place to smack
40:19
him.
40:20
He's also important to me because he has a tremendous knack to talk just beyond your
40:26
intellect while still allowing you to follow along with what he's saying.
40:30
I think that was actually my wife's comment when we went home to where it's just like,
40:33
okay, you know, she hasn't spent a lot of time with his his materials, but it's just
40:37
like, you know, he has this ability to kind of just be just beyond your intellectual capacity,
40:41
but he's kind of bringing you along with him because, you know, to be honest, some of his
40:44
interviews he has on his podcast is just like, what in the world are these people talking
40:48
about?
40:49
I have no freaking idea what these people are even even talking about right now.
40:52
I'm 45 minutes in, but again, specifically when he's talking just by himself, like he'll
40:56
nerd out when he's talking to another clinical psychologist or a researcher or something
41:00
like that.
41:01
When it's just him, he's not going to insult you.
41:04
He's not going to insult your intelligence.
41:05
He's going to almost pull you along to something a little bit higher.
41:09
Another reason that he's important to me and so many other people is that he calls all
41:13
men to a higher version of themselves and does so passionately.
41:19
Part of the reason why he's persona non grata in the world of academia, part of the reason
41:23
why he's hated by many people on the left is because those are institutions and groups
41:28
of people that hate men.
41:30
And so they want men to be weak.
41:32
They want them to have no foundation.
41:34
They want them to be just these limp fish that just kind of move their way through life
41:38
and they can just be easily, you know, pushed to this side or that side.
41:43
But Jordan Peterson says, no, he calls all men to be a higher version of themselves.
41:47
And he talks about strength and how men should be strong.
41:49
They should be monstrous, but in positive ways, right?
41:53
Because he talks about all the time and he's mentioned it before that if you think a strong
41:56
man is dangerous, wait till you see what a weak man can do.
42:00
And then again, this, this is a guy that is very much so a expert on what happened in
42:05
the 20th century and all these different regimes.
42:07
And like Hitler was in a strong man, he was a weak man that ended up making some strong
42:12
moves and getting strong people around him, which eventually led to the murder and slaughter
42:16
of tens of millions of people overall.
42:18
If you talk about the Holocaust and the World War, the people that died in World War II.
42:22
So I just love that he calls these men unapologetically to be a higher version of themselves.
42:27
But he also shepherds young men that don't have a pastor or a father figure that's integrally
42:34
involved in their lives.
42:35
That's where people start to get a little bit uncomfortable because it's like, well,
42:38
he's not a Christian pastor and he didn't go to, you know, this seminary and he didn't
42:41
do this and didn't know all those different things.
42:43
But there are men, young men in Christendom that don't have a pastor, a father, or a father
42:48
figure, any of those types of people that are discipling them, shepherding them towards
42:53
these beneficial things for themselves and for society and to a higher morality overall.
42:58
But Jordan Peterson is that for them.
43:01
And I don't think that's a bad thing at all because of the type of morality he's pushing
43:04
them towards.
43:05
And I talked about that on the last point.
43:07
Another thing is that he has taught a whole new generation of Christians, especially men,
43:12
what the original meaning of the word meek is because again, a lot of pastors didn't
43:16
talk about this.
43:17
Maybe they didn't even know this.
43:18
But when you look at the word meek as it's written in the Old Testament and the New Testament,
43:23
what we understand that now in our modern parlance is somebody that's weak, right?
43:27
They navel gays are constantly looking down.
43:29
They're going along to get along.
43:30
They're, you know, I want to be known for what I'm for, not what I'm against or just
43:33
me, I'm kind of demure, right?
43:36
But meekness in its original context and original definition is, you're fully in charge of your
43:43
power that you have full power, but it's under voluntary control.
43:47
It's a night that knows how to use the sword, but leaves it she'd until the last moment.
43:52
In a Christian context, it's, okay, I have the fullness of my abilities that God has given
43:58
me and I am tethering them to him to direct whenever he wants me to unleash them.
44:05
And he taught, you know, he talked about like a meeked war horse, that war horse would be
44:09
worthless if it wasn't strong anymore.
44:11
And so you keep its strength there, but you put it under the voluntary control of the
44:16
rider.
44:17
Okay.
44:18
Jordan Peterson basically taught that to, to modern Christians because I don't remember
44:23
ever hearing in my 20 years of being a Christian before that ever hear anyone talk about something
44:28
even vaguely close to that.
44:30
So he's done that.
44:32
Another thing is that Jordan Peterson has a reverence for the Bible for the word of God
44:37
that rivals many people that would identify as Christians.
44:42
So he really came to prominence early on before 12 rules for live before his first experience
44:47
which I wrote an experience by doing a psychological breakdown of the Genesis, the book of Genesis.
44:54
And again, he was coming out as a secular clinical psychologist, but he has a reverence
44:59
for the stories and the archetypal characters that are a part of the Genesis account.
45:05
And he has spent more time in the Bible going into Exodus, going into looking at the archetype
45:11
of Christ and things like that than many Christians would ever do.
45:14
Because again, especially if you grew up in an area like me, I grew up in Oklahoma.
45:18
So just by virtue of the fact that I was born on this beautiful red clay, I'm a Christian,
45:22
right?
45:23
I automatically believe in God, right?
45:24
And again, especially in the Bible belt, just believing in God is enough.
45:27
You don't need to believe in Christ.
45:28
I God, it's part of the package deal, right?
45:30
So there's no reverence, there's no appetite for the Bible.
45:34
And again, yeah, Bibles everywhere, there's three Bible bookstores in your town, you know,
45:39
at your family's house, there are four or five of them sitting on the bookshelf.
45:41
Most of them had dust on them.
45:42
And the fact that the Bible was around so much, we don't get the same attitude towards the
45:47
Bible.
45:48
Someone that's like a Christian in Iran or North Korea or China or Eritrea or one of these
45:53
places where you will literally lose your life if they find you with one of these Bibles,
45:56
right?
45:57
It's capital offense.
45:58
Okay.
45:59
But his reverence for the Bible is that of somebody that doesn't know when his Bible is
46:03
going to be taken away from him.
46:05
And again, you can quibble with his theology and his approach to it and all those different
46:08
things, but you can't quibble with the fact that he has a tremendous reverence for the
46:12
word of God.
46:13
Also he gets me to think about the Bible from a different perspective.
46:18
Again, I would highly suggest you go to the daily wire and look at the whole Exodus series
46:23
because again, you have some people there that are secular Jewish writers, you have,
46:28
you know, Orthodox Jews, you have Christian theologians, you have evangelicals, you have,
46:33
you know, Jordan, who's, you know, kind of coming from the secular point of view within
46:37
psychology and things like that, but when you listen to these giants, these intellectual
46:42
giants talk about the book of Exodus, you just cannot help but think about the scriptures
46:48
differently because we all bring our own lives to the scriptures, right?
46:52
Some of us have been convinced that somehow the Bible is about us that, you know, we're
46:55
David in the story of David and Goliath.
46:58
But again, if you pull out from that and think about the significance of that document, because
47:02
as Jordan Peterson has rightly said, it's not a book as much as it is a library.
47:06
But if you look at that library, like these collection of texts, it's incredible that
47:11
it's even here, but it can be evaluated from a multitude of different perspectives, which
47:15
is important.
47:17
But also, and I've said this before, and I'll say it again, I'll maintain it until I change
47:20
my mind or if I change my mind, Jordan Peterson is the most important non-Christian public
47:26
figure to Christian them on earth right now.
47:29
Because again, looking at the fruit and looking at his own words, I don't think that you can
47:34
say he is a Christian in the sense that he has trusted in, put his faith in Jesus Christ
47:39
and the sacrifice on the cross for the propitiation of his sin.
47:43
I don't think that we can say that right now, but I feel like he's close.
47:48
He is just so close because he's got the reverence for scripture.
47:53
He has Christians around him constantly.
47:55
He's digging even more into the scriptures.
47:57
He's seeing how the Old Testament aligns with the New Testament, how it's not an Old Testament
48:02
God in a New Testament God, how it's just God.
48:05
Then again, he's thinking about God in this archetypal sense as like a necessity to the
48:09
overall flourishing of humanity, not necessarily like in reality, but he's there.
48:14
But talk to any pastor, well, not any talk to a lot of different pastors, talk to elders
48:20
and churches, talk to deacons, talk to different people in leadership, talk to just lay people
48:25
that go to church and are really, really involved.
48:28
Because all these people have a tight knit relationship with Jordan Peterson's content.
48:32
Yes, they will read Spurgeon and they'll read Calvin and they'll read MacArthur and they'll
48:38
read whoever their favorite pastor is now, like they'll read these people and they'll
48:42
go back and they'll study the ancient texts and they'll study even the non-Christian Josephus
48:48
and Tacitus and Kelceus and all these different, they'll study, they'll go look at the church
48:52
fathers and then they'll read through Augustine and then switch over and read through all
48:56
these other people.
48:57
Jordan Peterson is part of that mix too and it's just incredible that a guy that is essentially
49:05
doing college lectures is selling out arenas all over the country and all over the world.
49:12
Again, there were about 3000 people that were in the convention center whenever I was there.
49:16
But when he went to Perth, Australia a couple of months back, again, in Western Australia,
49:20
there's not really a whole lot there that's going on, he sold out an arena and I believe
49:25
it was 12,000 people on two separate nights, back to back, 12,000 people in one night,
49:30
very next night, 12,000 more people and it wasn't a rock show, wasn't a comedian, it's
49:37
a college professor, it's a clinical psychologist, but you have to ask what is he tapping into
49:42
because he's not just talking about the Bible, he seemingly doesn't, he doesn't seem or sound
49:49
like somebody that's just using Genesis and Exodus to make a bunch of money.
49:53
He's genuinely interested and he wants to share his insights with the rest of the world.
49:57
That's why it's so important as a, again, how I would say a non-Christian, he's so important
50:02
to Christian them overall, but he is close to being a Christian, I believe.
50:08
And if I would have had more time with Jordan and certainly we have plans to be around each
50:13
other more in the future, I would take a passage like the one I started this podcast with John
50:19
935, Jesus heard that they had cast him out and having found him, he said, do you believe
50:24
in the son of man?
50:28
Because guys, that's the crux of all of this.
50:30
Jordan Peterson is a very important guy.
50:32
He's made tens of millions of dollars off the sales of his book.
50:35
I think 12 rules for life has sold over 7 million copies.
50:39
Guys, a lot of publishing houses are just beside themselves.
50:42
If they can sell 10,000 copies in the first week of a release of a book and maybe overall
50:47
50,000, 75,000, maybe even 100,000 over time, 7 plus million copies.
50:53
I looked at the Amazon charts the other day.
50:55
That book, which was released, I can't remember, it was released quite a while ago, it's still
50:58
in the top 10 of all books being sold on Amazon right now.
51:03
Beyond orders up there as well, the follow up book, he's got another book coming out later
51:06
this year called, I think it's called We Who Wrestle With God or Wrestling With God, something
51:10
like that.
51:11
But I would ask him, what about the son of man?
51:16
Because when I was going through the list of questions that you could text before the
51:19
speech or whatever, most of the ones got upvoted were like, hey, what do you think of the New
51:23
Testament?
51:24
What do you think of the Gospels?
51:25
Do you think Jesus is the son of God?
51:27
Do you think Jesus was an actual real person that we have from history?
51:30
Do you think he was resurrected from the dead?
51:32
Do you think that God did that?
51:34
How do you explain how the first century church came to be the second century church and the
51:38
third century church?
51:39
How did it survive Rome?
51:41
How did it survive actual persecution?
51:43
Not how we call persecution today, but Jordan, do you believe in the son of man?
51:49
Because you can have reverence for the book of Genesis and reverence for Exodus and reverence
51:53
for the Bible overall and the necessity of a God.
51:58
But if you don't put your faith in Jesus, that when he died on the cross that that somehow
52:03
counted for you, it's kind of all for not, isn't it?
52:08
You're going to have a big impact, you're going to be one of those one in one in 10 million,
52:13
one in 100 million, one in one billion people, you know, you sold all these books, you've
52:17
made all this great content, you put it out there for everybody.
52:21
But if you don't put your faith in Christ, you have nothing at the end of the day.
52:28
And so for all of us, we should hope and pray that Jordan and others in our lives would accept
52:34
that, would accept the reality of the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross for our sins so that
52:39
we could be before the Father.
52:41
Our guys for let you go.
52:42
We are going to do a quick resilience boost that undaunted life or mission is equipping
52:44
men to push back darkness with content that for just spiritual mental and physical resilience.
52:48
So again, just want to remind you guys, go to the origin website is right here linked
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53:02
And then for the rest of the things I've got here, I've got a link to our donation page.
53:05
I got a link to the Fox News article about the asbury university revival ending.
53:09
I've also got a link to that J.D.
53:10
Greer article in the gospel coalition website.
53:13
I've got a link to Jordan Peterson's tour dates website.
53:15
So if he's coming anywhere near you, I'd highly suggest you guys go and check that out.
53:18
And then also I have a link to Jordan Peterson's daily wire page.
53:22
They have more Jordan Peterson content behind their paywall than anything.
53:25
They're keep releasing new series.
53:26
And you know, all the speeches that he does on tour are recorded and put up there on the
53:30
website. I would highly suggest you guys check that out as well.
53:33
Thank you guys for listening to this episode.
53:35
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I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. Remember, keep pushing back darkness, keep forging spiritual,
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54:27
I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. I'm your host, Kyle Thompson.