MIKE GLOVER | Wait for the Dust to Settle (Ep. 614)

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0:50 This is Undaunted Life of Man's Podcast.

0:54 I'm your host Kyle Thompson, let's get into it.

0:57 You guys, we've got a special return guest to the show, and it is Mike Glover.

1:01 To be honest with you right here from the beginning, I think that this is one of the

1:04 most important interviews that we've done.

1:07 You should know at this point that I don't really use hyperbolic language just for the

1:10 sake of it.

1:12 Even as it was going on, I was like, "This will likely have a very big impact that will

1:16 go well beyond today, the day you're listening to it, and I think that there's going to

1:20 be some rocks put in your shoe, some things that are going to bother you, some things

1:23 that are really going to help you as you move forward.

1:26 If you're not aware of who Mike Glover is, he's a retired green beret and CIA contractor.

1:30 He was deployed 15 times.

1:32 He's also the founder and CEO of Fieldcraft Survival, so they do a lot of survival, and

1:36 their disaster preparedness training courses.

1:38 They do equipment with that training and all of that, and then he authored the book prepared

1:42 a manual for surviving worst-case scenarios.

1:45 I went on his show back in December of last year, and it really changed the trajectory

1:49 of Undaunted Life because of how widely that was received and how well that was received.

1:53 A lot of the clips went viral from that.

1:55 I still think it's the most watched interview that he's ever done on his podcast, which

1:59 has just showed when we talk about biblical masculinity and the things therein, that there

2:04 is still a thirst for that.

2:08 The thing about Mike Glover is if you've heard that name or seen that name over the last

2:11 couple of months, it was attached to some pretty dire circumstances.

2:16 I remember getting a text from one of the brown belts that I trained with a swag guy

2:19 named Dylan, and he's like, "Look, dude, Glover just got arrested for domestic."

2:25 I was just like, "Wait, what?"

2:27 If you know anyone in the LEO community or any of those types of guys, domestic is one

2:30 of the most common calls that they get, but it was like, "Wait, Glover got arrested?

2:35 Yeah, he got arrested for beating up his wife and breaking her wrist."

2:38 I was like, "Whoa!"

2:41 As I even said in the interview, I was like, "My first thought was, "Man, you can't put

2:43 your faith in people because they'll always let you down."

2:46 But then the very next thing I thought was, "Well, this doesn't really make sense.

2:50 Not that long ago, I was around both of them."

2:52 Again, guys, just because you're around people, they might just be giving you their best look

2:57 and the behind closed doors were all a little bit different, and some of us a lot different,

3:01 right?

3:02 But I just remember, "Wait, this doesn't really make sense."

3:04 I started looking into the case.

3:06 A lot of the details didn't quite make sense in terms of the guy that I knew or the gal

3:10 that I knew, and I talked with Greg Lapin.

3:12 It's his black belt, his academy, a guy that spent a lot of time with when I was out there

3:16 in Utah.

3:17 I was like, "Hey, man, give me the lowdown on this," and essentially without violating

3:21 trust or confidentiality, he's like, "What you're seeing is complete BS."

3:27 The details that are being released and even the charges that were brought against him

3:30 are complete BS because he went from one day just being a guy running a company and having

3:35 this big profile to the very next day facing multiple decades, 30-plus years in prison involving

3:41 multiple felony counts.

3:45 As we've worked through these last few months, he had his phone taken away, put in as part

3:51 of evidence, but he had a separate phone that only a few people had the number, so he and

3:57 I would talk via the phone and we would talk via through his assistant and different things

4:01 like that.

4:02 Guys, it was really dire there for a little bit.

4:04 It got very, very precarious.

4:06 We get into that in the interview a little bit.

4:08 Some of the treatment that he experienced in jail and also the treatment that he almost

4:12 experienced in jail was rather significant and super negative in a lot of ways.

4:18 A lot of these charges and a lot of the law fair that was happening behind the scenes that

4:23 involved the city of Provo and the police department of Provo and different things.

4:28 There were a lot of things there that were like, "Oh my gosh, they're trying to string

4:30 this guy up."

4:33 It was like they were looking for an opportunity to get him, and then they found their gap

4:38 and they ran with it.

4:40 But the thing about this interview is, of course, we can't get into the exact details

4:44 about the case.

4:45 All the criminal charges have been dropped as of Tuesday of this week if you're listening

4:50 to this on time, and so that's one hurdle, one tremendous hurdle that is now behind him,

4:55 but now he's got the hurdle of getting access back to his wife and to his nine-month-old

4:59 child and all these different things that are still being adjudicated and being figured

5:03 out.

5:04 But there's been something that has been shook loose in Mike for lack of a better term.

5:10 I could sense it the first time I talked to him on the phone, after all this was going

5:15 down because part of the reason why his and I's conversation on his show did so well is

5:20 because we talked openly and he talked openly about his faith and his upbringing and things

5:25 that he's wanting to do, but that focus has become the material and dominant focus of

5:31 his life and for his future, and just to go from the extreme circumstances that he was

5:37 experiencing to what he's talking about and the direction that he's talking about going

5:41 now is incredibly significant.

5:44 So those of you that are followers of Mike and I've been concerned over the last couple

5:48 of months or even guys that maybe written him off, you really want to listen to this interview

5:52 today as we talk about the stuff that we're going through.

5:54 But also his perspective now on his role as head of his household as a follower of Christ,

6:02 and then additionally as a business owner and former operator and all these different things,

6:07 it is tremendously focused on what the father wants for him and wants to teach him and wants

6:13 to work through him to teach others.

6:15 And so again, I said, I think this is a very, very important interview.

6:19 If I sound somber in my tone, it's not really somber.

6:22 It's more of a reverence for the what's what's gone on and what we've been able to work through

6:27 over these last couple of months, specifically with Mike, but then what things look like for

6:32 the future, even though it was very, very dark there for a little bit, there is a whole lot

6:37 of light that's going to show up on the back end of this.

6:39 So guys, without further ado, let's get into it.

6:43 Mike Glover, I'm glad to have you back on the show.

6:46 It's good to see you because you've been a little bit out of the limelight here for

6:50 a little bit, we'll certainly get to that, but you sound like you're in a dream right

6:55 now.

6:56 Like you got, I can hear rushing water, I can hear birds chirping right now.

6:59 So where are you and why am I not there with you?

7:03 Well, I'm actually, thank God I'm at home.

7:08 Unfortunately, I won't be here for long.

7:11 I actually will be leaving this morning because of the court mandates.

7:17 I'll be leaving today and to be honest, Kyle, I don't even know if I'll ever be coming back

7:23 to this home.

7:24 I honestly don't know, but it's tucked up against the mountains in Provo, Utah.

7:29 I'm happy to be kind of in a better situation than I was talking to you before, but yeah,

7:37 it's been a rough go man.

7:38 It's been 50 now, seven days.

7:41 Well, obviously we're going to get into a lot of that you and I have talked a lot, but

7:46 just right off the top here, I got to say over your left shoulder, I was pretty certain

7:50 that was a black bear, but no, that's your dog.

7:52 And so it's good to know that you're not going to get a snuck up on.

7:55 Yeah, look at that.

7:56 Look at that beast out there.

7:57 But obviously I remember a very good friend of mine that I trained you just with.

8:02 He sent me a text, you know, a couple of months ago and just said, hey, Glover, Glover's been

8:08 arrested and I'm like, arrested, like for what?

8:11 And I immediately went to like, hey, there's got to be some misunderstanding.

8:14 And then I looked at the reason why you were arrested and all I could think about was the

8:20 advice I give to guys on my show all the time, which is, hey, don't put your faith in people

8:24 because they'll let you down.

8:25 Don't put your faith in your favorite pastor or politician or podcaster or internet personality

8:30 or whatever.

8:31 Because they're going to let you down.

8:32 That was my immediate thought.

8:33 But then immediately my very next thought was, wait, none of this makes any sense.

8:38 And so I reached out to a mutual friend of ours and we've stayed connected.

8:42 But I guess take, take me wherever you want to go with this because there's been a lot

8:47 of people that have been very, very worried about you, your family and then tangentially

8:52 your business and the impact that you've had through your books and your courses and everything

8:56 else field craft survival related.

8:59 So let's just start there and then we'll work our way through.

9:02 Yeah, so this all happened on May 1st in the morning and you know, a lot of things transpired

9:13 in a very short period of time to say I was blindsided with the subtlety.

9:25 I mean, I was rocketed into outer space into a foreign world very quickly.

9:34 After that morning by noon, I was in jail and part of general population and I was attempted

9:45 based on a request to be moved to solitary confinement.

9:48 Again, for many reasons, I had no clue of.

9:55 When you are involved in some kind of domestic, some kind of potentially criminal action,

10:05 the idea is you're innocent until proven guilty.

10:07 I didn't feel that way.

10:11 But I will say being in jail for seven days was life altering in many ways.

10:21 One, I wasn't privy to anything that was going on on the outside world.

10:27 I know I had a lot of people subsequently after the fact.

10:31 I found out I had a lot of people including yourself who were supporting me, who were

10:35 praying for me.

10:37 And to be honest, the fact that I'm sitting here talking to you now and you've given

10:43 me spiritual guidance along the way, the fact that I got out of jail in the first place

10:47 is a miracle of God because by design, that's not how it's supposed to work.

10:53 I was booked on 31 years of charges, which included four serious felonies and two misdemeanors.

11:04 And by design it, according to the criminal justice system, based on the severity of my

11:12 proposed crime, I was the worst of the worst and wasn't supposed to be let out.

11:16 It was a no-bail.

11:18 And based on God, first and foremost, a lot of praying in a 15 by eight center block

11:27 cell where I was allowed 90 minutes a day to get out of that cell.

11:32 I was able to come to my defense in some form or fashion and I was released after a week,

11:42 after seven days.

11:44 So here I am 57 days later and on day 56, all of my criminal charges have been dismissed,

11:53 not based on opinions and philosophy and hopes and dreams, but prayers and evidence.

12:02 And look, as traumatic as it is for me, because like I've always said, as a military guy,

12:11 I'm not a traumatic victim of circumstance.

12:15 I was a volunteer and I did so willingly, but I will tell you this is the most traumatic

12:23 circumstance of my life and that of my family's life.

12:27 It also has affected and impacted everybody who's close to me, including close friends,

12:34 but also my business, including my employees that feel craft survival.

12:38 I mean, I took a 40, 50% hit revenue, hit on revenue out the gate because of a leaked

12:45 affidavit with unredacted information, which included the names, birth dates and address

12:51 of my children and my spouse.

12:54 And so, summing it up, I'm still going through legal processes and litigation despite the

13:03 dismissal of the criminal component and the fight's not over for me.

13:09 I do want to say I thank friends and family, including people like you who believe me and

13:17 my family, because this wasn't just me, it was my family as well, including my spouse,

13:24 who willingly recanted her statement on day two and nobody believed her.

13:30 She fought for me, we fought for each other despite now day 57 not being able to communicate

13:36 to her or my now nine month old child that I haven't seen except for about 16 hours total

13:43 of visitation that the state has graciously allowed me and I say that sarcastically.

13:50 And I'm just thankful to God and thankful to people who have been in our corner.

13:56 And you know, I'm a fighter, I'm going to defend myself, my family, and nothing's changed

14:04 in that.

14:05 Well, Mike, I've got a lot of follow ups, but I want to be clear about something from

14:08 the beginning.

14:10 And I don't want to go to the conspiracy stuff.

14:12 You and I have talked offline about that, but the initial kinetic nature of your situation

14:19 could have gone so poorly because they basically put an APB out on you and said, Hey, this

14:25 guy's armed, incredibly dangerous.

14:28 I mean, because I've I've thought through the scenario, Mike of like, what if SWAT had

14:32 the wrong house and they kicked my door down someday and I go to defend myself with, you

14:37 know, the tools necessary to do so, like, and I hurt somebody or I'm killed or something

14:41 like you think about a situation like that.

14:44 This was very, very precarious for a while there, but I want to be very, very clear and

14:49 I know we can't get into the specifics of the case because it's still being adjudicated

14:52 and things like that, but just to put a very, very fine point on this, there was not finagling

14:58 done by your high powered, high, highly paid attorneys that, you know, put the screws into

15:04 your wife or something like that to get her to recant your statement.

15:08 To be clear, you're telling me in the rest of the world, there was never a physical salt

15:14 of your, your wife.

15:16 There was never a domestic assault, correct?

15:19 That's correct.

15:20 Yeah.

15:21 That never happened.

15:22 And Mike, the reason why I wanted to be so clear about that is because in this type of

15:25 a situation with a person with a public profile, there's all kinds of finagling going on.

15:31 Like I'm I'm digging in right now to some stuff that happened with a very high profile

15:35 pastor and the finagling that went on behind the scenes to basically hide his sins, which

15:40 were egregious, which was basically pedophilia.

15:43 And there's always something where there's an attorney involved or an NDA involved or a

15:47 bunch of people with a bunch of money that just like, Hey, let's, let's make this situation

15:51 go away.

15:53 But I want to dig in a little bit more into the support that you got during this time because,

15:59 you know, I'm reminded in second Timothy, you know, Timothy or Paul is writing a letter

16:05 to his people, Timothy.

16:06 And at this point, he's, he's in a Roman prison and he knows he's not getting out.

16:10 That was perhaps a familiar feeling for you because you didn't know exactly what was

16:15 going to happen.

16:17 And somehow in that moment, even though his supporters had had left him, people that had

16:21 done ministry with him and supported him the whole way, had basically turned their back

16:26 on him almost immediately.

16:28 He was still incredibly faithful and was able to write these incredibly powerful words to

16:33 his pupil, Timothy.

16:35 Tell me about your mindset because your communication with the outside world was incredibly hamper

16:40 heard, because your phone was taken away.

16:43 I was basically getting messages to you through a mutual friend and, you know, your assistant

16:49 and things like that, but just tell me about the support that you got during that time.

16:54 And, you know, I guess talk a little bit about the people that maybe just took what they saw

16:59 on Twitter, ran with it and said, you know, what screw, you know, screw my glove or he's

17:03 toxic from here on out.

17:05 Yeah, it was, it was interesting finding out about it in hindsight.

17:09 But I'm very understanding of the fact of being a popular figure in social media, the

17:17 way you want things to work out are necessarily the things or the way that they're going to

17:22 work out.

17:23 And, you know, I didn't think my spouse nor my children would be propelled into the limelight,

17:28 but I was truly offended by that, especially because there's a burden of responsibility

17:34 on law enforcement to protect both the victim in this case, as well as as minors in this

17:40 case, which just happened to be my spouse and my children.

17:45 And when I found out on a ladder date, probably day eight, that their faces, their names and

17:54 my address was put all over social media, I was very worrisome for me and my family because

18:02 I felt so helpless, I mean, right, like you're a man, your job is to protect and defend

18:07 your family.

18:08 And despite the circumstances that I was handed, I felt helpless and I still feel even helpless

18:14 today.

18:15 Like I'm not able to communicate, I haven't communicated to my spouse in 57 days.

18:20 And I asked God why, and I asked the legal team why, and I asked myself why.

18:27 And at the same time that I was kind of like falling apart, which was by the day, and I'm

18:35 kind of just picking up the pieces now, I was also getting a lot of support and rallying

18:41 from friends who showed up and were reaching out to me immediately.

18:48 Like I said, to you early, I didn't have my phone for a month because it was served,

18:53 a warrant was served on it on like day two or three when the police officers pulled me

18:58 out of jail and confiscated the phone.

19:01 So I didn't realize the amount of communication that was taking place, but as soon as I got

19:06 out, I was welcomed by family and brothers in arms that I served with, including gentlemen

19:16 like Greg Lapin and Evan Haefer and Andy Stumpf and Jaco and all these amazing human

19:22 beings.

19:23 And you know, there's too many to name that not only supported me, but talked me off the

19:28 ledge, man.

19:29 I mean, I cried in Evan Haefer's shoulder in an Airbnb 10 minutes from his house, dislocated

19:37 from my family and knowing at that moment, my world was falling apart and had nobody

19:44 to run to and was desperate.

19:48 And he taught me off the ledge.

19:51 Greg Lapin, who sat behind me in court and every time he said, he said, if you feel like

19:56 you're falling apart, turn around and just look at me and I'll walk you through it by

20:01 helping you breathe.

20:03 And I did that constantly during that hearing because it involved my children.

20:07 So yeah, it was tough and I'm thankful that I have really good friends in my corner and

20:16 I'm thankful that they were there for me because I don't know if I'd be here without them to

20:20 be honest.

20:21 Well, Mike, go back to when you and I met at the end of last year when I came to Utah

20:26 and we did an interview and I mean, you knew me, you knew of me, but we didn't really know

20:29 each other that well and we became fast friends.

20:32 But you know, the most viral clip from our little chat, which you know, frankly changed

20:37 the trajectory of undaunted life forever was where I just kind of floated on what it means

20:41 to be a three AM friend, right?

20:43 And so I talk about it in the context of a foxhole guy, but so many guys don't don't

20:48 have those three AM dudes.

20:50 Those dudes that will sit behind them in court and say, Hey, look at me, I like, I'll help

20:54 steady you.

20:55 Like if you start to fall apart, just let me know, like those types of people, the people

20:58 that will hop on an airplane or take time out of their day to, you know, record a video

21:02 to like, you know, give you the support that you need.

21:05 But I do, I do want to go back to something that you told me one of the first times that

21:10 we connected after this, that while you were in jail, you missed out on solitary confinement

21:17 by like this much, right?

21:20 So essentially what you told me is that because of the charges and because of the nature of

21:26 who you are and how dangerous you are and all these things, they were going to be putting

21:30 you in a literal hole where the only way that you can, you know, get excrement out of your

21:36 body was in a hole in the middle of the floor, no contact with other prisoners because you

21:40 were going to apparently start a riot in a revolt or something like that.

21:45 And it was the dutiful attention of an officer in a hallway that actually kept that from happening.

21:52 So I know you can't name names and anything like that because I wouldn't be fair to the

21:55 individual person, but talk to me a little bit about that because in all of this, and

21:59 there's a lot of scary stuff about this situation, a lot of which we can't talk about here on

22:04 the air.

22:05 But that was one thing where it's about, it's easy for just about all of us to put ourselves

22:09 in those shoes.

22:10 And what would have happened if God had not coordinated you walking by that man, you know,

22:16 at that exact moment?

22:17 So talk to me a little bit more about that because it was hard enough for you mentally

22:21 to make it through that time.

22:22 And I can only imagine what it would have been like if you were putting a dark dank hole

22:25 alone.

22:26 Yeah, I was man, I was having some very serious issues with the whole situation and they put

22:38 me in general population, which is like basically a holding area before they put you into the

22:44 place that you're going to spend your time.

22:46 So when I, when they move me into this room and there's like eight other guys, and I thought

22:51 to myself at, at some points in this that, well, this isn't that bad.

22:57 There's like, there's men here, there's, I'm able to socialize and talk to these men.

23:02 I had these guys doing yoga with me and breathing exercises and, and telling them about, you

23:07 know, how they need to be better fathers and, and, and focus their attention to God and,

23:11 and, and, and trying to help them because that helped me and they came in and, and look,

23:18 this is Utah County corrections officers that came in and said, Hey, Glover, grab all your

23:23 stuff, your, your bunk bed, your sleeping pad and all your belongings, which were a whole

23:31 bunch of folded pieces of paper and a, and a, and a small pin or a small pencil.

23:37 But that's like, that's like, like your life, I said, get your stuff and then start moving

23:42 down and follow me.

23:44 And so I get into the hallway and I'm walking down the hallway and this is only hours after

23:48 being arrested and then processed to the system.

23:53 And as I'm walking down the hallway, I see two corrections officers coming down the main

23:58 hallway and they intercept us.

24:01 I could see their intent to intercept us.

24:03 It wasn't just a happenstance they, they deliberately came out when they heard the call and, and

24:10 they said, where are you moving that it was the younger corrections officers were you,

24:14 where are you moving Mike and, and he said, um, I just got a call and a request, which

24:19 I found out later came from a police department, which, uh, we'll get into offline later, later

24:25 on.

24:26 Um, they came from a police department and they had a request to move him into solitary

24:31 confinement.

24:32 And solitary confinement is just that.

24:34 It's a, it's a empty room, basically with a hole and it's, it's typically for murderers

24:40 and people who are suicidal.

24:42 If you're suicidal, they take your clothes, they give you a poncho and they just put you

24:45 in this hole and you stay in this hole until you kind of graduate until they realize, like,

24:50 hey, you're calm, you can, you're going to be able to get through this and then they move

24:54 you on to a, a higher level or a lower level of security.

25:00 Um, so I, I'm a confused cause I don't know what's going on.

25:04 I'm just going with a flow and I look at them all and I'm like, is this a good thing or

25:08 bad thing?

25:09 And they're like, oh, it's a bad thing.

25:11 And then when the officer says to me that, that intercepted us, he says, are you having

25:15 a mental health crisis?

25:16 So I said, no, not at all.

25:18 He said, okay, so why are we moving them?

25:21 And the corrections officer really didn't have a good reason besides it was requested.

25:26 Now, according to both the security assessment, which is the community security assessment,

25:33 uh, from the state of Utah, I was deemed no bail and the most dangerous basically member

25:39 of society and should never be allowed out and be isolated by all means.

25:45 And they use the word restricted restriction.

25:47 And so I'm kind of like taken back because I have no clue what's going on.

25:52 And they tell me, look, you don't need to be in solitary confinement.

25:56 He doesn't need to be in solitary confinement.

25:58 Turn him around.

25:59 And this guy was a supervisor.

26:00 I could tell by his demeanor, his posture, he turned, he turned this officer around and

26:05 he put me back in myself.

26:07 And you know, two days later, I was processed and then put into basically myself so with

26:14 a mate, a cellmate where I would get 90 minutes out per day.

26:19 And then if I, which was that next level, I mean, it's right above solitary.

26:23 Um, and then if you get from that, you go to like a couple hours a day and then you get

26:28 like four hours a day and then three sessions of four hours a day depending on how good

26:32 you are, but I was basically the highest level restricted.

26:36 And the only reason I wasn't put in a hole where I literally wouldn't be able to come

26:41 out of a hole or cell, except if my lawyer pulled me out was because of the grace of

26:47 corrections officer who, who in the beginning knew something wasn't right based on how they

26:54 were interacting with other agencies and the things that were being said, including the

26:59 litany of charges, which by the way, those same charges are like the equivalent to manslaughter.

27:04 They're the same charges that if you walked into a home and beat your entire family with

27:09 baseball bats, entire family, like your spouse and your three kids with baseball bats and

27:15 then kidnapped them and then went to jail.

27:18 Okay.

27:19 So as you're describing that, Mike, the thing that kept coming to mind and again, I don't

27:26 like engaging in hyperbole or conspiracy theories or something like that, but it seemed like

27:31 to me, they were trying to get you to react to something.

27:36 So in, in the, the APB that was put out initially, the force that they showed trying to find

27:44 you the things that they were doing inside of, of the jail, potentially putting you in

27:51 the hole.

27:52 It seemed like there was a coordinated effort to get Mike to react, to get you to do something

27:56 to yourself to hurt someone else to maybe have a little freak out session so that they

28:01 could have something to point to to be like, you see, you see, and again, you know, it's

28:08 been widely publicized for anyone that, that knows you and knows your company that the

28:11 federal government has targeted you and at least put you on a list as like, oh, this is

28:17 someone that could be a potential domestic terror threat and all that.

28:20 We should probably keep an eye on this, on this guy and the people that he's training.

28:24 And you know, there's, there's a lot of smoke there, if not a full on raging fire.

28:29 And so if you can talk a little bit more about that, that's just something that as you were

28:33 talking, that just seemed evident to me that that was going on.

28:37 Yeah, it's definitely not a conspiracy because I have direct evidence supporting that theory.

28:48 And without going into much detail, what I will say is, look, the institutions that

28:54 are meant to defend, protect, secure, treat, take care of us as a whole are inherently

29:04 flawed now.

29:05 And I was on the news this morning, and it just occurred to me because I was looking

29:09 at the headlines of how many of the headlines include some type of litigation or some type

29:16 of correlation to law, legal systems, courts, and it was like 90%, it was 9 out of 10 articles,

29:26 had something to do with some form of litigation, the Trump component, courts and systems.

29:33 And what you're seeing is a broken society in many ways across the spectrum, right?

29:39 We know this, we talk about it, me and you have talked about it a lot.

29:42 I think it's because of many things, including the lack of Christ and God in our lives.

29:48 But when you look at these institutions that are ran by members of society, which are inherently

29:55 flawed and broken, like, like us all, there's an opportunity to utilize the power in the

30:03 in those systems to weaponize against people who are just folks.

30:11 I don't know.

30:12 I don't know the prejudice.

30:13 I don't know the component or characteristics of prejudice.

30:18 I could speculate, but I could tell you right now, I have a litany of evidence to prove

30:24 that including text, I have the receipts and eventually that will come out.

30:31 But to be on the other side of that, to be, to have a company down in Provo, to have my

30:37 house here in Provo, supporting the community, teaching law enforcement, doing everything

30:42 I can to make sure that my community is policed up and taken care of.

30:47 And then have that same institutions we support, turning around and declaring me a hazard and

30:56 threat to my own community.

31:00 It's Rambo, I mean, it's like, it's like the story of Rambo, like Rambo comes back from

31:04 Vietnam and it's like, it's a it's a made for movie or made for TV, a movie.

31:10 It's like all the things that you would see in drama.

31:13 But what was the storyline?

31:14 He comes back from Vietnam.

31:15 He just wants to be left the hell alone.

31:18 And then he has tyrannical, radical people who decide to pick on him and he burns the

31:24 entire town down.

31:26 Now I have been a professional my entire career, like this idea that somehow I just woke up

31:33 one day and decided to terrorize my family and the world is false.

31:40 What I will say is people forget in these institutions where I come from.

31:46 I don't do anything haphazardly.

31:48 I don't react.

31:50 I respond and I do so with a very comprehensive, contingency based plan.

31:57 And I don't do anything on accident.

32:00 So when you're picking on a guy who spent 26 years of his life in a professional career

32:05 field of doing just that and just thinking that, oh, this is what tipped him off.

32:11 He must have whatever it is.

32:14 That's a false reality that shows complacency on their end.

32:19 And the facts will come to light at some time.

32:22 Here's what I'll say.

32:23 Lastly, I love my family.

32:26 My spouse is a good woman, a Christian woman, a faithful woman.

32:32 And just as I'm the victim, she's the victim and so is my entire family.

32:38 So are my friends who've been targeted by this.

32:40 I can't even tell you the level of targeting and you know that will come out as well.

32:47 But even friends close to me who have supported me have been targeted and that's wrong.

32:53 My spouse has been targeted by social media.

32:56 She's been demonized by radical influencers and she's been demonized by components of

33:03 the institutions that look at her like she's evil as they've looked at me like I'm evil.

33:09 And all of that will come to light and I will defend my family.

33:12 I'm not defending myself, I'll defend my family and in any matter of time.

33:18 When I'm I for one, I'm impatient by nature, but I am very impatient for the facts of this

33:23 case and all the things that that you know and all the receipts that you have to come

33:27 to light.

33:28 I would encourage the audience to be patient, but also to keep paying attention to what's

33:31 happening here because if it can happen to you, it can happen to everyone else listening

33:36 to this and to me and you know, we've all kind of battened down the hatchets a little

33:40 bit to to get ready for the blowback.

33:42 And I know there will be blowback for for this interview and there will be people that will

33:45 be added to lists and there will be people that will be added to to target packages and

33:50 things like that.

33:51 I don't mean that like I'm not assuming a drone is going to come to Edman, Oklahoma

33:54 and give me a visit or anything like that, but you know, who the heck knows, but also

33:57 I think there's a component here that sometimes we just have to wait for the dust to settle.

34:01 Everybody is so ready to cancel a person or to get rid of a person or to believe the headline

34:06 as opposed to what's actually happening in the situation.

34:09 So I think it's always best to do that, but I do want to go back to to when you're in

34:14 jail.

34:15 This is one of the things that we talked about offline, but there was a certain point where

34:21 there was there was a level of despair that most of us can't really know unless we ourselves

34:27 have experienced it to where all at once you think I've lost my marriage, I've lost my

34:34 children, I've lost my business, I've lost my reputation, which takes a lifetime to

34:39 put together.

34:40 And the reputation of an operator that has tremendous amounts of self control, like

34:45 you've never been in a bar fight.

34:47 You've never been in a situation where you used your training, you know, from, you know,

34:53 from SF to like hurt somebody else because you had an axe to grind or something like

34:57 that or because you had an ego problem.

34:59 But in all of this, you felt like you were losing everything up to and including your

35:03 own life.

35:04 And at that moment, you had some choices you could have lashed out or you could have cried

35:09 out and you decided to cry out and you cried out to God, which again, for a lot of people,

35:14 that's not really something that you talk about too terribly often.

35:18 That's why, you know, the talk that you and I did on your show was so widely received because

35:23 they're like, oh, this is a conversation with a guy like this that we don't normally get

35:26 to hear.

35:28 So take, take me through a little bit of that to where you're, you're basically busted

35:31 up and things aren't looking good and you're in jail and you decided, all right, God, you're

35:37 in this situation.

35:38 It's time to show up.

35:39 Yeah.

35:40 Um, I've been talking to God since I can remember talking.

35:45 I mean, I grew up a a a faithful Baptist in the south, all my families from Georgia.

35:54 They're all raised Baptist.

35:55 I was raised Baptist.

35:56 I was saved when I was 10 years old, I was baptized when I was 10.

36:02 Like it's all I remember, but I've, I've subsequently via our first conversation suppressed a lot

36:08 of that, keeping it to myself, maintaining some privatized, you know, word of God down

36:19 deep in me because I didn't want to influence or negatively impact people because I had

36:24 a worldly perspective, I thought, because I spent time with Muslims and I, I spent time

36:28 overseas where, you know, potentially talking about God and in specific ways would destroy

36:35 rapport, right?

36:38 When I should have been doing the opposite, I should have been professing my faith and,

36:42 and potentially changing those people's lives.

36:46 Um, I had many opportunities that I felt that as a Christian and, you know, obviously the,

36:53 it's easy to find God at the bottom of a barrel.

36:56 Um, when you're at the very lowest point in your life, which certainly I was in that

37:01 jail cell, um, staring at the cracks in the center blocks, you know, looking at my hands,

37:08 realizing I may never have my children's hands inside of my hands for years to come.

37:15 Um, that's, that was a tough pill to swallow, but it was easy to reinvigorate my faith in

37:22 God and it's what got me through.

37:25 Um, when, when I had periods of complete loss of control, all I would do was read King James

37:35 Bible out loud to myself, pacing myself until I couldn't walk anymore.

37:42 I would do pushups and jumping jacks until my body would literally lock up and then I

37:47 would hold the Bible and lay in my bunk until, uh, I, I packed out.

37:53 I mean, I got no sleep.

37:54 It was, it was the most difficult situation I've ever been in.

37:59 And those seven days, those six nights in jail, I would rather go through, um, seven

38:05 iterations of survival school in a whole, in a box getting slapped by instructors, um,

38:12 I would rather be a prisoner of war than be in a situation where I'm dislocated, disaffected

38:18 for my family.

38:19 As you said about like social media, like all these people who may say, I am way beyond

38:25 that.

38:26 When you are stripped down to naked, where you have nothing left, you restructure your

38:32 hierarchy and needs.

38:33 And the last thing I care about in jail and I care about now is my position on the hierarchy

38:41 scale of influencers on Instagram.

38:44 I give a crap about any of that.

38:47 What I've realized is I've put, I've put more energy in my position than I have my family.

38:54 You know, I talk about like, Oh yeah, you know, these are the things that happened.

38:58 This is the things that I did and didn't do, but I am inherently flawed where, where I've

39:03 made the most mistakes is not investing enough where I would give my, my podcast guests hours

39:10 of my time.

39:11 I wouldn't give myself 10 minutes of my time to emotionally communicate and navigate the

39:17 difficulties in our relationship to lead through God.

39:21 Yeah.

39:22 I said it in my head.

39:23 I said it potentially out loud, but I didn't do it on a day to day basis.

39:27 And, and that's where you discover all of those flaws at the very bottom.

39:32 And, and, and if there's any good that comes out of any of this, it's rediscovering potentially

39:38 with never getting my family back, by the way, I don't know how this unfolds.

39:42 I don't know if I'll ever be with my spouse again.

39:45 I don't know if I'll ever not be on a schedule to see my, my, my infant son.

39:50 But what I do know is every day that I wake up, I will lead with prayer, scripture and

39:57 my faith in God and lead everybody around me in the same way.

40:02 And I will never keep quiet about the feeling that I have in my heart and my soul that I've

40:07 always had to profess my love for Jesus Christ and, and God.

40:12 I will never do that again.

40:13 Hey guys, real quick.

40:15 If you're anything like me, you are constantly on the lookout for high quality products that

40:18 are actually made here in America by American hands.

40:22 The problem is that a lot of American companies have outsourced their labor overseas.

40:26 So it's an American company, but it's supporting people that don't live here.

40:30 So I've always went to partner with an American company that prioritizes America, American

40:34 workers and making all of their materials here in this country.

40:38 That's why I want to remind you that we are partnered with Origin.

40:41 Origin is an apparel company based in Maine and they are focused on getting as much manufacturing

40:46 back to the United States as they can possibly do.

40:49 What do they make?

40:50 They make the best jujitsu geese on the planet.

40:52 And these are the only jujitsu geese that are made completely in America.

40:56 They also make jeans.

40:57 Yes, they're stretchy and awesome.

40:59 They also make amazing hunting gear.

41:00 I know you guys love your kuyu and your sicca, but those companies use overseas labor and

41:05 they don't do that to help you guys out.

41:07 They do that to increase their profit margins.

41:10 Origin also makes boots and work boots.

41:11 And yes, that does include still toe boots.

41:13 And in the fall of last year, they launched a line of everyday clothing, their Versa pants

41:17 or their everyday pants.

41:18 And they are just especially phenomenal.

41:20 They also make other outdoor clothes and workout clothes and they're launching new apparel

41:24 stuff all the time.

41:25 If you haven't already, you need to check them out and support a company that supports America

41:30 and America's workers.

41:31 Try origin out today by going to www.originusa.com.

41:36 That's originusa.com.

41:38 Use the promo code undaunted to get 10% off of your order.

41:41 Again, that's originusa.com promo code undaunted to get 10% off of your order.

41:49 So let's actually dig in a little bit more there because you and I, our brains work

41:54 a lot in the same way where we will look back on past experiences and just be like, I tell

41:58 people all the time, you should look back on who you were five years ago and always be

42:01 a little bit embarrassed.

42:03 Like, wait, I thought that I used to, I used to say things like that.

42:06 I used to like that band or whatever the situation is, but we will look back on those moments

42:10 where we should have said something and we will just play that over and over in our brains.

42:16 And it's, it's interesting, Mike, that you have a situation like this where you were

42:19 brought low, right, where you are stripped down as you've talked about, literally, you

42:24 know, and figuratively and it took that to get you to this point where you have an overwhelming,

42:31 an overwhelmingly clear picture of what it is the next era of your life is going to look

42:36 like as it pertains to your relationship with Jesus Christ and you're, you know, professing

42:41 in the gospel.

42:42 So take me to that because, you know, people will have these big experiences or maybe it's

42:47 like the church camp phenomenon where you get back from church camp and oh boy, you're

42:50 fired up and I'm going to read my Bible every day and gosh darn it, I'm only going to listen

42:54 to Christian music and I'm, I'm never going to say a bad word ever again and I'm just

42:57 going to do all that.

42:58 And then the dust settles after a few weeks and then they kind of go back, but this is

43:02 different for you because it has been a reshuffling of your life and your priorities that you

43:10 did not start, you did not initiate, but you have made changes already in terms of what,

43:17 you know, my Glover is going to be doing business wise, but also ministry wise as, as you continue

43:24 and as you work your way through this situation.

43:26 So just talk to me a little bit more about that because I'm sure there are a lot of people

43:31 that are excited about this and in one, I want to get you going and to really help you.

43:37 But tell us how we can encourage you in this and kind of what, what your plans are in terms

43:43 of what that looks like tangibly.

43:45 Yeah, I think, I think one, you know, the Sergeant Major in me wants to lead by example

43:52 by professing the errors, the mistakes, so that men and people don't make the same mistakes

44:01 that I made where I talk about it and preparedness where everything leads up to this tipping

44:06 point and then catastrophically, by the time you figure it out, it's too late.

44:12 But that's okay, that is, that is sometimes the cycle of life.

44:17 And also, I think, you know, God's plan is perfect for everyone.

44:20 It could be the cycle of your faith and you're slipping away from faith.

44:26 You know, I, I, I have seen many times in my life where I've gotten to tipping points

44:31 and I've made gross errors and the common denominator is me being further distance from

44:36 God and my faith in Jesus Christ.

44:39 That has always been the common denominator.

44:41 I read a verse and I'm hacking it.

44:45 You might know it exactly.

44:46 It's like James chapter 1 verse 19 through 20 about being quick to listen or quick to

44:54 hear and slow to anger because God detests this component in you that is angry.

45:01 And, and when I, when I think through these circumstances of my life, I have always prioritized

45:07 things and what I thought was my own principles and value metric.

45:12 But that got further away from my position with God.

45:16 And so if it all starts with that, then everything falls into place.

45:21 So what I did basically as I woke up and I prioritized, I'm going to be a protector,

45:26 a defender and a provider.

45:28 And most men wrap their arms around that.

45:31 But a lot of men use it as an excuse because when I'm a writer, it's a virtuous thing, Mike.

45:36 It's very, very virtuous, but it's still, it's not the right, the right aim.

45:40 Yeah, because if I'm providing, I'm hunting in the backcountry and honey, I got to put

45:46 meat in the freezer because it's who I am as a man.

45:48 And not to say that that's a bad thing.

45:51 But it's like every time you allocate your energy in something, you are neglecting something

45:57 else.

45:58 Right.

45:59 What I, what I've realized is whenever you invest in God, you are actually benefiting

46:03 everything else.

46:04 It is like, you know, I do have the Mason jar analogy where I'm like, you're investing

46:08 all your coins and one, you know, your eggs in one basket.

46:12 And then you look at the other jar and you're like, well, that's completely empty.

46:14 Like my spouse's emotional capacity to live with me, I, it's zero.

46:21 But me going hunting, me going fishing, me going to work and providing for my family.

46:26 Oh, it's full.

46:27 Right.

46:28 But what are you giving back?

46:29 If God, if you're investing everything in God at the top of it, it's spilling over into

46:34 everything else, because through your faith, you're investing in everything across the

46:39 whole.

46:40 That's important to you.

46:42 So I did all of the things wrong and read in this process for me reshuffled the deck.

46:48 And when I realized when I wake up with God in mind, when I, when I wake up with prayer

46:53 in mind, when I focus my attention on not drowning in sin, man, everything just seemingly

46:59 falls into place.

47:00 And it's always been like that.

47:02 You're going to fall from grace.

47:03 You're going to slip away.

47:04 You're going to get out of the church.

47:06 You're going to do all these different things.

47:07 But guess what?

47:08 You're either going to make a catastrophic mistake because it's the plan of God or you'll

47:13 be intelligent enough to listen to examples like mine, like yours, like others and go,

47:18 you know what?

47:19 I don't have to fall from grace.

47:22 I could actually realize that Mike fell and I just need to realign some things and figure

47:30 things out, which is, which is part of the process.

47:32 I mean, I don't even know if I'll ever do field craft survival again personally.

47:36 I don't know if I'll do that.

47:37 I don't know if I'll be on a range teaching Caribbean because I have a lot of stuff to

47:41 work on that doesn't include teaching people how to shoot a pistol.

47:45 And I know like people love the personal offense and the gun stuff and all that stuff.

47:51 But you know what?

47:52 What's more important is my family.

47:54 What's more important is my health and wellness.

47:56 And what's more important is my relationship with God.

48:00 When Mike, this would be my encouragement to you and you and I have been working through

48:04 this and will continue to work through this, but my encouragement would be to you is the

48:07 skills that you gain by being in the United States military, by being deployed, by doing

48:12 some of the other contracting stuff that you've done.

48:15 Those are skills that you can utilize for the sake of the gospel.

48:19 And so whenever I talk to certain guys, there are certain guys that don't want anything

48:23 to do with me until they see my ear.

48:25 And then they're like, oh, your ears are messed up.

48:27 Like did you, did you wrestle?

48:28 Do you do jiu jitsu?

48:29 And then all of a sudden that opens up the conversation because before that, I was just

48:33 some Christian, some Bible thumper guy that talks about conservative politics, right?

48:38 But you're going to be able to talk to people in a way that maybe a lifelong pastor or minister

48:44 is not.

48:45 And perhaps it shouldn't be that way, but it's just the way that it is.

48:48 There are guys that will judge you based on, you know, whether or not you've got a pocket

48:54 knife on your pocket or whether or not you're wearing the right kind of hat or you're carrying

48:58 the right type of pistol or something like that.

49:00 So I think that you are uniquely suited to speak to men in a way that perhaps a lot of

49:06 other men wouldn't.

49:07 And so, but let's talk a little bit more about that.

49:11 Because when you're in prison, you're obviously there with a lot of guys that are destitute

49:15 have made a lot of wrong terms and made a lot of wrong decisions and they've, you know,

49:19 put themselves into these bad spots and have ended up in bad places.

49:23 But because of the things that you experienced in prison, because of the things that were

49:26 revealed to you during this time by God, you know, through the Holy Spirit, because of

49:31 the things that you are capable of doing, moving forward, what is your focus on how you

49:37 specifically, because we've talked about doing this together, but even just you Mike specifically,

49:41 how you can help these men understand yes, be a protector, yes, be a provider.

49:47 But if you are not shepherding your family, if you do not have a headship of your household,

49:52 if you are not protecting your, your wife and your children spiritually, then you're missing

49:58 the Mark brother, like what, what do you want to do and how do you want to make that happen

50:02 as it goes in the future?

50:03 I know we're both kind of looking through the glass dimly right now, but at the same

50:06 time, I think there's a pretty good idea of the direction that you should go.

50:10 Yeah, it's interesting.

50:12 It's a difficult landscape that I've conveyed to you and your pastor about how do I navigate

50:19 this landscape of a saturation of opinions and paths and journeys, and how do I make

50:27 sense of it all, right?

50:29 And I think if you're somebody like me who is looking for a path based foundationally

50:38 in God, there's, there's many things that you could do, right?

50:44 One, like you said, you can't foundationally lead your family unless you have that.

50:50 You know, we talk about resilience and preparedness.

50:52 It's like resilience is your faith.

50:55 It is, it is, it's not even the foundation.

50:57 It's the earth.

50:58 You can't even lay a foundation if you don't have the earth beneath the foundation.

51:02 So all these things you want to build are based on your faith, and what's more, what's

51:09 more virtuous than leading your family through your faith and shared love of God?

51:17 What's more virtuous than that?

51:19 There is none.

51:20 So we like to say like, especially in preparedness, like I'm going to be the virtuous defender

51:24 and protector.

51:25 Well, that's nice.

51:27 And what happens with if you haven't accepted Jesus Christ, if you haven't led your family,

51:33 then you all burn in hell.

51:34 I mean, I hate to say that out loud, but that's how it works.

51:38 So you're, you're willing to protect and defend in a circumstance that's so narrow in scope

51:43 and field, but you're not really willing to address the 10 million pound gorilla in the

51:48 room, which is eternal life, right?

51:51 So when I look at all of the things that you could do and all of the ways that you could

51:56 do it, there are good resources, including yourself.

51:59 I mean, you're, you're like a spiritual unicorn for me, right?

52:03 You're a guide for me to like make me understand how this world works.

52:08 Like I said to you, I want to start a church.

52:11 My mom and my family, all of her Korean sisters, my grandma, who's 90, since I was a child

52:18 have always wanted me to be a pastor.

52:21 And I came to you and said, Hey, how do I do this?

52:24 I don't even know the start point in this.

52:25 Do I just cause I want a cowboy church, because I like to wear ball caps and cowboy hats and

52:29 boots.

52:30 I don't like the formalities of certain things.

52:32 And so how do I do that?

52:34 And you're like, well, you need to get in unique education.

52:38 It starts with education.

52:39 It starts getting involved with the church.

52:40 It starts with community and it's multifaceted.

52:43 But the interesting thing is when you start looking at it all, it requires a plan.

52:48 And that plan brings purpose and it inspires me.

52:52 It actually reinvigorates me to go, wow, there's another path, another journey that

52:56 I haven't even touched.

52:59 I haven't even taken one step into this.

53:01 And I talk to you about in your pastor, Joby, about a masters of divinity program, right?

53:10 I have my GI Bill.

53:12 I've started the registration process with a masters of divinity where they focus in

53:16 biblical studies because I know my error.

53:19 My error is in not understanding the scripture, right?

53:23 And I want to become more educated and knowledgeable because I can talk to people.

53:29 But if I don't reference the Word of God, then I'm only, I'm only haphazarding myself

53:34 through those murky waters, but I want to be able to make the connection for people.

53:38 And, and I'm not doing it for social media.

53:40 I'm not doing it for YouTube.

53:41 I don't want to be the dude with a mic who's talking to millions of people who's caught

53:45 up in the Dateline controversy.

53:47 I want to be talking to my local community and most significantly my family.

53:51 I'm doing it for me being able to communicate to my children and my spouse in my living

53:56 room.

53:57 That's the start point for me.

53:59 It's like, I know people think, oh, this is a big business plan.

54:03 There's no business involved.

54:04 I don't care about the business aspects of my faith in developing a marketing scheme.

54:11 I care about developing and inspiring and marketing to my, my children, to my spouse,

54:17 to my family.

54:18 And hopefully one day, if, if, if, if God allows it, my community.

54:24 So Mike, it's interesting that you talk about that because you will have the cynics out

54:27 there that are like, okay, this is just a ploy.

54:30 Like earlier this year, I had to take a few weeks to deal with some stuff that was going

54:33 on in my extended family and you know, I needed to kind of go dark for a second so I could

54:37 give full attention to what was going on.

54:39 And some of the first comments on YouTube on my return video was like, oh, this was

54:43 all just a ploy for more views.

54:45 And you know, you see these people like there was this, this gal that was doing only fans

54:49 and she was making millions of dollars and then she becomes a Christian.

54:52 And the first comments were, which were coming from a lot of Christians was like, oh, this

54:56 is some sort of ploy for money.

54:57 It's like, do you dorks not know anything about how marketing and money works?

55:01 Like she was going to be making way more money staying and doing the depraved things

55:06 that she was doing than to all of a sudden be a Christian.

55:08 Like she's not going to get paid a whole bunch of money to go be a Christian speaker for

55:11 the rest of her life.

55:12 You know, we wish her well, but it's kind of the same thing.

55:15 There seems to be a fervent focus and the thing that I love about what you're saying,

55:19 like, is some people will see guys like Pastor Joby or like any of these other big pastors

55:25 that have big profiles and sell a lot of books and be like, that's what I want.

55:28 I want the big stage.

55:29 I want the microphone on my face and I want the, you know, you know, hundreds of thousands

55:33 of millions of people hanging on my every word so that I can control them and send them

55:38 in the direction that I want to send them.

55:40 That's not what I'm hearing from you.

55:42 And so that's the thing that's encouraging to me is you're starting small, which is your

55:47 biggest task that you've been given on this planet, which is head of your household, starting

55:52 there and letting it work out from, from your community.

55:56 Now it's kind of speaking of community.

55:59 Obviously, you're in Provo, Utah now, that's the center of Mormon country.

56:04 And that probably has a lot to do with some of the things that went on during this case,

56:08 which we can't really get into.

56:10 But where are you going to end up?

56:13 Because I don't think field crafts over, not by long shot.

56:15 I don't think that your role with field craft is over, not by long shot.

56:18 I think that the gospel centered things that you're thinking through right now will have

56:22 an incredibly incendiary effect in a positive way to what you're doing via field craft

56:27 and will send it to a different and even better dimension.

56:31 But it seems like your time in Provo is going to need to come to a close before long and

56:37 you alluded to that at the very, very beginning of this interview that this might be the last

56:41 time you're at your house might be the last time that you're in that area.

56:43 But what does that look like for you?

56:45 If you're going to be focusing on community, family first, but then the community outside

56:50 of the walls of your home, where does that take you?

56:54 Honestly, I don't know, man, I was up at three in the morning on my balcony right outside

57:02 my room, praying to God, looking up at the sky, my underwear, asking God for guidance

57:12 and what the next steps are for me and my path and my journey.

57:18 I have to learn to live again.

57:21 I have realized getting this massive reset that I don't even know how to live.

57:26 I don't know how to function without this distinct purpose of work, of drowning myself

57:35 by distracting myself through my virtue of work.

57:41 So when everything got quiet, I didn't know who I was.

57:46 I didn't know where I stood.

57:49 And so all of the things that I was tethered to, whether it was the social media, whether

57:53 it was the preparedness style, the tactical operator, all these things got stripped down.

58:00 And I talk about this in preparedness engagement, it's just like who you really are is that

58:08 couple of minutes on your pillow right before you go to bed.

58:12 That's who you really are because you don't have the ability to virtue signal to the world.

58:16 You have quiet moments and then it's just you and God.

58:19 And it's like, if you don't know who you are in that moment, you're lost.

58:23 Well, I've been lost and I've been having to redefine myself and figure it out step by

58:29 step.

58:30 And to be honest, I don't know where I'm going to be tomorrow.

58:33 I honestly don't know where I'm going to be tomorrow.

58:36 I know I'm going to be an Airbnb distance from here, not able to communicate to my family,

58:41 my spouse, my child, and I don't know where the next steps will be because I'm dependent

58:46 on reacting to the offensive nature of an institution that wants to bury me underneath

58:54 the gym, right?

58:56 So, so look, I think, you know, my family wants me to continue to inspire people and

59:04 do all these things, but that's the last thing on my mind.

59:07 I don't, if people listen to this, I'm happy.

59:11 I'm sad.

59:12 I'm satisfied.

59:13 I tweeted for the first time yesterday, which sounds disgusting after 57 days and not being

59:18 on social media because I wanted to let people know that it was okay and thank people for

59:24 their support.

59:25 And that's it.

59:26 I don't want to be drawn back into this world of toxicity because the most appreciative

59:33 and significant moments in my life with fieldcraft and my journey have been face-to-face

59:38 engagement, shake in hands, and tell them people that they're going to be okay.

59:42 I care about them.

59:44 That engagement is something that will likely be the future of my life and journey.

59:49 Look, I lost it all.

59:51 I'm likely going to, look, I don't know how fieldcraft unwise or bounces back from 50%

59:57 hits in revenue.

59:59 My book deal gone, like multi-million dollar deal over years, completely gone.

1:00:05 How do you bounce back from that?

1:00:07 You just do the best you can.

1:00:08 And so my focus, again, isn't any of this, my focus is breathing.

1:00:15 It's not my social media account.

1:00:17 It's not my bank account.

1:00:18 It is breathing from moment to moment.

1:00:21 Lastly, look, I mean, God has answered all my prayers.

1:00:26 I prayed for guidance and a voice came into my head.

1:00:31 And I'm only going to, I'm going to clearly concisely tell you it was the voice of God.

1:00:38 Not likely it was the voice of God.

1:00:40 And he said, refer back to the Ten Commandments for guidance.

1:00:45 When I went back to the Ten Commandments, there's a very good social media YouTube kind of

1:00:52 thing called the Bible Project, and they do like really good antidotes of the Bible,

1:00:58 but it's more modern, it's illustrative, it's visionary, and they talked about the Ten Commandments.

1:01:03 And what I took from multiple sources of the Ten Commandments was multiple offenses for

1:01:10 me of not just sinning, but drowning and sin.

1:01:14 The most significant one was my attachment to materialism.

1:01:19 So I was making more money so I could buy more crap to satisfy those around me.

1:01:25 And then I realized because all of those people around me were like sell all the crap, I don't

1:01:29 need that crap.

1:01:30 I don't need the bicycle you bought for me for my birthday.

1:01:33 And the reaction naturally would be, how could you, but why would you unless you were

1:01:41 materialistically tethered to this idea that that was going to bring you happiness?

1:01:46 Because my spouse didn't want a mountain bike that cost $2,000, she wanted 10 minutes

1:01:50 of my time and I couldn't give it.

1:01:53 So taking a step back, I realized the way I was living my entire life was wrong.

1:01:59 And so now what am I doing?

1:02:01 I'm purging everything.

1:02:02 I don't want to be a minimalist and a weirdo and don't have anything living in a tree

1:02:06 house in Washington.

1:02:08 I want to get rid and purge this idea and this concept that that's going to make me happy.

1:02:14 What has that done for me?

1:02:16 Well, my priority isn't making more social media followers to get more money to get more

1:02:21 crap.

1:02:22 It's how can I just police myself up?

1:02:25 How can I take care of my family?

1:02:27 And my priorities are not the same.

1:02:29 I don't know where it's what tomorrow.

1:02:32 Kyle, I don't know what this afternoon brings me.

1:02:36 I have a hearing today at 4.30.

1:02:39 I don't know what today brings me.

1:02:42 My mom's like, have you heard any news?

1:02:44 Well, are they going to communicate?

1:02:46 I don't know.

1:02:48 I am at the mercy of God's perfect plan and I'm letting Jesus take the will.

1:02:55 Well, Mike, here's the thing.

1:02:56 I'm always reminded of this.

1:02:58 So Psalm 119, your word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my path.

1:03:05 We want it to be a flood light though, right?

1:03:07 We want the entire pathway to be lit for us so that we can know exactly what all the steps

1:03:13 are going to be.

1:03:15 But the real goal, especially in the moment that you're in right now, Mike, is what is

1:03:19 the next best step?

1:03:21 What is the next right step for me to go in the direction that God has for me?

1:03:25 Because even if you're going in the right direction, like if you have the right north

1:03:29 that you're trying to go towards, if you veer off path, you can get back on the path pretty

1:03:34 quickly.

1:03:35 And here's the other thing that I would say to the guys listening to this and also to you,

1:03:40 it's not how many years you've been a Christian, it's how many hours, right?

1:03:44 Someone told me that a long time ago, and it's like that applies to a lot of things.

1:03:47 It's not how many years you do jiu jitsu, it's how many hours, it's not how many years

1:03:50 you've been shooting, it's how many hours you've been shooting.

1:03:52 And so that is super applicable to where it's like, what in this exact moment is the next

1:03:57 right step?

1:03:58 So when you want to react in your flesh to something that's happening inside of your

1:04:01 family, what is the exact right step with what you do there?

1:04:05 Whenever you're wanting to chase that next thing, whether it's that next promotion or

1:04:09 that next million or that next 10,000 followers or whatever your thing is, it's like, what

1:04:14 is the most God honoring thing for me to do in this moment?

1:04:17 But Mike, even from the first time that you and I spoke to one another, you have a heart

1:04:22 for men and you have it in a very, even then you had it in a very healthy way.

1:04:28 But now it's even more specific and even more healthy, as I would say.

1:04:34 So what would be your message to the guys listening to this right now that are in their

1:04:38 own valley of the shadow of death, which as you and I talked about and as the message

1:04:42 I gave you is the greatest thing about the valley of the shadow of death, the first is

1:04:47 that God's allowing you to go through it.

1:04:48 But second, it's that he's allowing you to go through it and not forsake you and not

1:04:52 leave you there.

1:04:53 The greatest thing about that valley is that God is there with you.

1:04:56 There are dudes that are in the valley of shadow death right now, Mike, what's your message

1:04:59 to them?

1:05:00 Yeah, my message is it's never too late and you always have a choice and, you know, there's

1:05:05 philosophical differences in the idea that God's perfect plan means you just sit idle

1:05:15 and wait.

1:05:17 I take the value from God's perfect plan that that perfect plan can be facilitated by being

1:05:27 guided by the light and making the right choices and understanding that it's never too late.

1:05:35 If you're listening to this and you find yourself in a difficult circumstance where

1:05:40 you're slipping further away from God, which is likely facilitating you slipping further

1:05:46 away from everything in your life, you're headed to a crossroad and disaster.

1:05:51 You're headed to a side impact that is going to knock you off the intersection and potentially

1:05:56 take your life in various forms and various ways.

1:06:01 So if you want control, start with God, start with prayer, start with scripture, and get

1:06:07 yourself right.

1:06:09 It's never too late.

1:06:10 I wish I was hearing my own advice 58 days ago.

1:06:16 I had a choice to mitigate risk in my own household by being compassionate, empathetic,

1:06:23 and a good communicator, all virtues of being a good Christian and a follower of Jesus Christ

1:06:29 and God.

1:06:30 It's never too late.

1:06:32 Make a choice and I would opt in to make that choice right now.

1:06:36 I wouldn't wait.

1:06:38 When I started doing rewilding courses where the concept was tribe community, it should

1:06:46 have been tethered and based in faith.

1:06:50 Men got up from the fire side chat and said, "I'm changing my life right now."

1:06:55 There's people who left our course who said, "I haven't talked to my daughter in 17 years.

1:06:59 I'm going home because I'm making that change," be very willing to open yourself up to that

1:07:06 level of personal courage and do it now because it may be too late tomorrow.

1:07:12 That would be my encouragement as well because guys, when you feel the prompting and the whisper

1:07:17 of the Holy Spirit, which one thing to talk about that earlier when you were talking about

1:07:20 hearing the voice of God, guys, we will hear voices.

1:07:23 Those voices aren't always God.

1:07:25 So you have to put them through the filter of something like, "Where's this message coming

1:07:29 from?"

1:07:30 So if the message is you're terrible, you're awful, everyone's finally figured you out,

1:07:33 you're an imposter.

1:07:35 You should probably just end it.

1:07:37 There's not a single way that a message like that comes from the Father, not whatsoever

1:07:41 because he wants amazing things for you.

1:07:44 But for a lot of guys, Mike, that's not subtle.

1:07:47 That's not a subtle message.

1:07:48 That might be easy to differentiate whether that's coming from the light or from the dark.

1:07:51 But sometimes there are messages that you'll hear that voice inside your head and it is

1:07:55 very subtle.

1:07:56 It's very cunning.

1:07:57 It's very Genesis 3.

1:07:58 If God really say the first lie that was told to humanity, did God really say?

1:08:04 And so if you don't have a foundational understanding of Scripture, if you're not in the Scripture

1:08:09 daily, if you're not consuming this type of content, you might think that God is talking

1:08:15 to you and it's not him.

1:08:17 It's the Father of lies that is trying to steal, kill, and destroy you.

1:08:23 That was the thing that I talked about years ago, Mike, because I was kind of where you

1:08:26 were at.

1:08:27 The whole focus was growing the show, whatever I got to do to grow the show.

1:08:30 And so I read 54 books in one year, four interviews for this podcast because I wanted to show

1:08:35 the people I was interviewing and show the publicists and show the publishers that I'm

1:08:39 the best interviewer.

1:08:40 I'm going to read the book and I'm going to ask the best questions.

1:08:43 Mike, I didn't read 54 chapters of the Bible that year.

1:08:45 I probably didn't read 54 pages of the Bible that year.

1:08:49 And it just hit me all at once.

1:08:50 I was like, wait a minute.

1:08:51 This is a tremendously bad thing right now.

1:08:54 I'm shooting at all the wrong targets, and so that's why we started the forging table.

1:08:59 That's why I started studying the Bible in groups with men and started doing more stuff

1:09:03 on my own, kind of dialing back some of the interviews and doing some other things.

1:09:08 And so there are practical things that men can do to lead them in the direction that

1:09:12 you're talking about right now.

1:09:14 Mike, you talked about a little bit earlier as well.

1:09:17 There's obviously been a reputational hit to you personally, whether you care about that

1:09:21 or not.

1:09:22 You really don't, the reputational hit for your organization, for fieldcraft.

1:09:26 Again, there's still some things that got to be figured out organizationally for how

1:09:30 that's going to look moving forward.

1:09:32 But for guys that are fans of yours or guys that are just want to be brothers and arms

1:09:37 with you.

1:09:38 And I mean that in the Christian sense, how can people support you and your family and

1:09:42 all the things that you're doing right now?

1:09:44 Yeah, the best way people can support me is by supporting the hardworking employees that

1:09:51 I have at Fieldcraft Survival by supporting the company and supporting your families and

1:09:57 yours level of preparedness.

1:09:59 I mean, we educate all over the country every single weekend.

1:10:03 We just had a first aid medical seminar or a medical conference here in Hebrew city and

1:10:09 didn't have a lot of signups.

1:10:11 We have lots of equipment, lots of training, lots of online content, Fieldcraft Survival's

1:10:16 app, my personal Patreon where all the revenue goes to the company.

1:10:22 I'm really fearful that I'm going to be out of business and I know a lot of CEOs, a lot

1:10:31 of owners would step up and blow smoke to somehow mask what's really happening behind

1:10:39 the scenes, it is nearly impossible to recover from a 40-50% loss of revenue overnight.

1:10:46 That happened overnight.

1:10:47 The graph dropped out overnight based on a leaked affidavit, unredacted by the way.

1:10:56 And that takes a hit.

1:10:57 I'm not at all worried about my reputation, I don't care.

1:11:01 If my kids look up to me as their father, if hopefully one day my spouse and I can work

1:11:08 it out, if my mom and stepdad look at me and they think I'm a good son, that's the

1:11:14 greatest gift that I could have in my personal reputation.

1:11:18 I would just keep doing me.

1:11:22 But yeah, I think, gosh, man, telling employees that I've worked so hard for you over a real

1:11:32 tragic circumstance that they won't have a job, it's like, yeah, but people can get

1:11:37 a job.

1:11:38 It's like, no, these people didn't just leave their jobs to get jobs, they left their jobs

1:11:44 to get purpose.

1:11:45 Right.

1:11:46 And they have dumped and poured all of their lives into that purpose of giving back and

1:11:51 educating people from all levels of preparedness.

1:11:55 Let's feel craft will never go away.

1:11:57 We have to restructure, we have to reorganize, but we will always educate people in some

1:12:02 form or fashion, I'm thankful for the support that we're getting, I'm thankful that people

1:12:08 are rallying behind us and supporting the company, and that's the best way you could

1:12:14 support me.

1:12:17 I appreciate you talking that way, and I've got obviously guys follow, follow field craft

1:12:23 everywhere on the different social sign up for the mailing list so that you can be sure

1:12:27 about those things.

1:12:28 Mike, even as you describe it, and dude, you're talking to a major league pessimist right

1:12:33 here.

1:12:34 Okay.

1:12:35 So this guy is always falling, the glass is always half empty, you know, the glass was

1:12:39 never going to be full.

1:12:40 Like that's the type of guy that I am, even in hearing you, there's no doubt in my mind

1:12:45 that what field craft and what your future in business and in your family needs to be

1:12:51 or wants to be because of where you're focused at now.

1:12:54 And if you can keep that heading, I have, I have full confidence in faith that things

1:12:59 are going to work out.

1:13:00 And that doesn't necessarily mean that everyone gets to keep their job, and that doesn't necessarily

1:13:04 mean that you were going to take over the world, which was a trajectory that you were

1:13:07 on there for a little bit.

1:13:08 But I think it's going in a more God honoring direction.

1:13:11 And you know, God's not a genie.

1:13:14 He's not just going to give you all these things and, and Ferrari's an influence because,

1:13:17 you know, you're focused on him now, that's not how anything works.

1:13:20 If you read the scripture, specifically the New Testament, you don't get a guarantee of

1:13:24 any of that all that prosperity garbage is garbage for a reason.

1:13:27 That's not how any of this works.

1:13:29 We are, we are guaranteed rough times here on this planet, but we're guaranteed the best

1:13:33 times possible after we leave this planet.

1:13:36 But is there anything else you want to give to our audience before we let you get out of

1:13:38 here?

1:13:39 Yeah.

1:13:40 Look, there's, there's a, there's a lot of complexities to life.

1:13:47 I mean, life is very confusing.

1:13:50 When I dabble and just reading the news, like I used to every day to do this weekly show

1:13:55 call prepared, I see the dysfunction.

1:13:59 I could more see it clearer than I've ever seen it based on my detachment from that

1:14:06 dysfunction, but also restoring my faith in God.

1:14:11 And so I almost feel like it's like being sober out of my club and everybody's wasted

1:14:18 in the dark and everything's mystical and romantic, sexy.

1:14:24 And then you're the only guy who's sober and they turn the lights on and you realize

1:14:29 what you're standing in is sticky alcohol and belligerent drunk people and you realize

1:14:36 you don't belong.

1:14:38 There are a lot of things that I did to try to belong and I no longer feel the desire

1:14:46 nor need to prove myself, defend my reputation or belong as, as a follower of Christ, my

1:14:55 entire existence to be cognitive enough to understand Jesus Christ and God.

1:15:05 That's all you need.

1:15:08 You just need to be the sober one.

1:15:09 I haven't drunk a sip of alcohol, I've exercised every single day, I focus my efforts and attention

1:15:17 to scripture and God, and that doesn't make me a virtuous hero.

1:15:23 That personally makes me a better human being.

1:15:27 And I don't need YouTube, Twitter or Instagram to represent that.

1:15:33 And so if you're somebody who doesn't have a following, doesn't have a popularity and

1:15:38 you're just getting it done, congratulations, continue to get it done.

1:15:42 And if you're not, maybe you need to start because it will simplify your life, it will

1:15:48 improve every optic and focus on everything that God touches.

1:15:55 And honestly, man, there's no turning back for me.

1:15:57 I've held on to so many things for too long, I've suppressed the right into the wrong and

1:16:04 I'm not willing to make that mistake again, and it doesn't include some virtuous bugle

1:16:09 from the hilltop, it's just me getting it done day to day.

1:16:13 And will I slip?

1:16:14 Yes.

1:16:15 But I'll have people like you, close family and friends lifting me up because they know

1:16:21 that's the path that I'm on.

1:16:23 So yeah.

1:16:24 Yeah.

1:16:25 Well, Mike, I'm here for you.

1:16:28 You know, you know, you got a three AM foxhole friend and me, and I'm even just very encouraged

1:16:34 by the things that we've been able to accomplish in the last couple of weeks as you work your

1:16:40 way into verse through the situation.

1:16:41 So I'm thankful for the time that you've spent with me today talking openly and honestly

1:16:46 about all this and also all the wisdom that you shared with the audience.

1:16:50 We'll we'll certainly chat more soon as we continue to work through this.

1:16:54 All right, brother.

1:16:55 I appreciate you, I appreciate your message, I appreciate your audience.

1:17:00 And thanks for having me on now.

1:17:03 There you go guys.

1:17:04 I hope you enjoyed my time with Mike Glover.

1:17:05 But before we let you go, we are going to do a quick resilience boost.

1:17:08 Add on to life permission is equipping men to push back darkness with content that forges,

1:17:12 spiritual, mental and physical resilience.

1:17:13 I've got a link to the field craft survival website again, guys, go there, support them

1:17:17 anywhere on social media, make sure you're following them and supporting them.

1:17:21 If you'd like to check out Mike's book prepared, there's a link to that and I've also got a

1:17:24 link to his first appearance on the show.

1:17:26 Thank you for listening to this podcast.

1:17:27 Wherever you're listening to this, please subscribe, rate and leave us a positive five

1:17:30 star review.

1:17:31 If you want me to come speak live at your event or on your podcast, shoot me an email

1:17:34 to info@undonton.life.

1:17:37 That's I N F O at undonton.life.

1:17:39 Follow us on Instagram and like us on Facebook and check out our website for everything else,

1:17:43 including how to donate to keep more content like this coming your way.

1:17:45 Just go to www.undonton.life.

1:17:47 And as always, we want to thank the band Holy Name for allowing us to use their music for

1:17:51 our content.

1:17:52 The music on this podcast is our song Perpetua, which is off their self-titled debut album

1:17:56 on Face Down Records.

1:17:57 The links are in the description.

1:17:59 I'm your host, Kyle Thompson.

1:18:01 Remember, keep pushing back darkness, keep forging spiritual, mental and physical resilience.

1:18:08 Keep seeking the lion of Judah.

1:18:22 [music]