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0:37
This is Undaunted Life of Man's Podcasts. I'm your host Kyle Thompson. Let's get into it.
0:52
In four-year lifeblood, I will require a reckoning. From every beast, I will require it and from man.
0:58
From his fellow man, I will require a reckoning for the life of man. Whoever sheds the blood of
1:02
man by man shall his blood be shed for God-made man in his own image. That is Genesis 9,
1:08
5 through 6. Guys, thanks so much for listening to the show. We do appreciate it. And as we give
1:11
a little commercial at the beginning, we want you guys to go out and support our sponsors.
1:14
As I talked about on Tuesday's episode, we got a new sponsor, Stevenson Nies. Make sure you check
1:18
them out. But also, leave a five-star rating and review. That is one of the ways that this show is
1:22
going to get out to more people is when you leave reviews, when you comment on Instagram posts,
1:26
all those different things that the algorithm likes that I don't understand. It helps us.
1:29
So if you wouldn't mind, please do that. And guys, if you're watching me on YouTube, you've
1:32
already seen it. But do you see my face? Doesn't my face look especially distinguished and amazing
1:38
today? It's because I've got a Fu Manchu going, my friends. And I'm not doing this just because
1:43
it looks awesome, which it does. Don't ask my wife. She doesn't really get to have an opinion,
1:47
even though she does. But not on this show. This is my show. She isn't going to have an opinion on
1:50
my show, but I support the Movember movement. So that is mustache November. So if you guys are
1:56
not really familiar with this, it's been around for a long time now. But Movember is an annual event,
1:59
which involves men growing mustaches during the month of November. And it's ordered to raise
2:03
awareness for men's health issues. It started out just as like a prostate cancer thing,
2:07
but it's extended out to testicular cancer, men's suicide, some other things, just basically men
2:11
being up and moving and doing all those things. And just for me personally, guys, one of the
2:15
reasons why I do this is because a man in my life that's very, very close to me is battling
2:20
prostate cancer right now. And also, if you've been listening to the show for a while, a few
2:24
months back actually talked about how one of the guys to my foxhole land and killed himself.
2:28
And so male suicide is something that hits close home to home for me as well. And so, you know,
2:33
this is, this is funny. And this is whatever. And you know, people will look at my face on
2:37
lap because it went from a beard to this thing. But at the end of the day, it is for a serious
2:41
issue of somebody asked me about it. I tell them about Movember. I tell them about those things,
2:45
try to encourage them to take care of themselves. Now, the Movember Foundation runs the Movember
2:49
charity event. It's it's housed at movember.com. So if you guys want to go and support them,
2:53
if you want to hit them up, if you at least want to share some of their stuff, you can absolutely
2:56
do that as well. Now, to those of you that are listening to this on time, I would like to tell
3:00
you happy Thanksgiving. Now, I've got this thing going. This is going to be two years in a row
3:04
where I basically I'm not trying to ruin your Thanksgiving, but I'm talking about really,
3:09
really serious subjects on Thanksgiving, because Thanksgiving 2020, I talked about suicide,
3:14
right? And so I went into a big, long subject about Thanksgiving and suicide and all those
3:18
different things. A lot of guys really, really liked that episode. But again, the timing was odd.
3:21
I will admit that it was odd because it was on Thanksgiving. And then today, we're going to go
3:24
ahead and do something else. We're going to talk about the death penalty. So happy Thanksgiving.
3:28
Let's talk about the death penalty. But let me give you kind of an idea what we're going to be
3:31
going over today. We're going to look at how Christians should view the death penalty.
3:36
So you should definitely stick around for that because we're going to go through the biblical
3:39
basis for the death penalty. We're going to respond to some of the common objections
3:43
to the death penalty. When people say the death penalty is racist or the death penalty doesn't
3:48
deter crime or innocent people have been executed before. So we should get rid of it. We're going to
3:51
show you how to deal with all those different responses. But before we get there, we need to
3:55
talk about why I decided to tackle this subject now. It's not just because of Thanksgiving, and I'm
4:00
just looking for a horrible topic to talk about. It's because it's very pertinent to what we're
4:04
talking about and kind of what we're going over. And that's because of the Julius Jones case.
4:08
So let me give you about a 30,000 foot overview of this case, just in case you have not been paying
4:13
attention in the news and you hadn't heard anything about it. It was obviously very, very big news
4:16
here in my state in the state of Oklahoma, but it's been national and international news as well.
4:20
So 30,000 foot view. July 28, 1999 in Edmund, Oklahoma, that's the town I've lived in since 2004.
4:27
Paul Howe, who was a local businessman, he pulled into the driveway of his parents home. That's where
4:31
he was living at the time. His two daughters were with him in the car. When he opened the driver's
4:35
side door, he was shot in the head. Okay. How was then thrown from the vehicle and the murderer that
4:40
shot him in the head jumped into the driver's seat, ran over Howe's body as he drove away.
4:45
So there were two black assailants that were on site because they were trying to steal Howe's SUV,
4:49
which they did obviously his daughter, Rachel, nine years old was in the backseat of the vehicle
4:53
and his other daughter as well. And they witnessed the murderer walk up to the vehicle. Rachel
4:58
even said she remembers waving at the guy as he was walking up to the vehicle because she's nine
5:01
years old. She doesn't really know any better. So she watched this guy shoot her father in the head.
5:06
Paul Howe sister Megan also witnessed the entire crime and she'll be very important here in just
5:11
a second. But Julius Jones and Christopher Jordan were arrested and indicted on first degree murder
5:16
and conspiracy to commit a felony. That was for the carjacking. Now, police in Oklahoma,
5:22
they found the murder weapon wrapped in a red bandana in Julius Jones's home. Okay. Julius
5:28
Jones claimed that he was innocent. He's claimed he's innocent till till this day. He and his family
5:32
even claimed that he was at home playing monopoly and eating spaghetti when the murder and carjacking
5:36
occurred. So Julius Jones also claimed that Christopher Jordan has accomplished that day to steal the
5:40
vehicle actually planted the murder weapon in his home to frame him. Julius Jones also claimed
5:45
that one of the arresting officers called him an inward when he was arrested because of course,
5:48
why not set up the racism defense as you're possible defense as opposed to dealing with your own
5:53
guilt. And then Christopher Jordan, the other guy, he eventually entered a plea agreement where
5:57
he confessed to being the getaway driver, but not the shooter. So he got a 30 year sentence for
6:02
murder and conspiracy. And he got this deal in exchange for testifying against Julius Jones.
6:07
Julius Jones was eventually found guilty of first degree murder. And he was sentenced to death in
6:12
2002. So now we need that kind of brings us up to speed as to kind of what happened with this
6:17
whole crime. But now we need to talk about why this is pertinent because last week,
6:20
Julius Jones was set to be executed on November the 18th of 2021 in just four hours before the
6:26
scheduled execution. And this is after the parole board suggested that his sentence be
6:29
commuted and all these different things. The state of Oklahoma's governor, Kevin Stitt, he you know,
6:34
after reportedly undergoing, you know, prayer for consideration, prayer, full consideration of the
6:38
facts of the case and everything else, he decided to commute Julius Jones's sentence to life in prison
6:43
without the possibility of parole, essentially saving his life. Now I personally disagree
6:48
with governor Stitt's decision, and I'll get more into that in here in just a second. But I get why
6:51
he did it. It was the right move politically, because here's the thing pro death penalty people
6:57
aren't going to not vote for Kevin Stitt in his reelection bid because he did this.
7:01
Okay, they're going to not be happy about it, but it's not going to be a center point
7:04
of the opposition for their campaign, centrist and independence. However, they might not vote
7:08
for him because of this because this is kind of a big deal to them. But most people, I would say
7:12
don't actually care that their tax dollars are going to help keep Julius Jones alive and comfortable
7:17
for decades and decades to come. I don't think they're really think about that on a daily basis.
7:21
And Stitt supporters, which I am one I voted for him to to be governor this last time around.
7:26
I think they're going to forget about this or just logging away in the not a big deal category.
7:29
This isn't going to be a big thing for Kevin Stitt moving forward. But then we had news coverage.
7:33
So the news coverage leading up to the exoneration, a lot of people were making fun of Kevin Stitt
7:37
for even trying to be prayerful in this because most people obviously, if you're in a secular
7:41
culture, you're going to make fun of the guy that prays. But the news coverage was obviously very,
7:44
very one sided. Most of the left wing media was like, he should get off. You know, there's a lot
7:50
of evidence to suggest that he didn't do this crime and blah, blah, blah, and you know, the
7:53
Oklahoma government or Oklahoma governor better do the right thing. And there was a lot of activism
7:57
around this case because this is kind of the new thing when when a black person is about to be
8:01
executed. There's all these people that come out of the woodwork to support this person,
8:04
even if they haven't really kept up with the case. So celebrities like Kim Kardashian, you know,
8:08
she's kind of big on getting, you know, death penalty reform and you know, criminal justice
8:12
reform and all that. And then we had athletes with Oklahoma ties like Russell Westbrook used to
8:15
play for the Oklahoma City Thunder and Baker Mayfield quarterback for the Browns, but used to be
8:19
quarterback for OU. They came out and drove is basically saying that he should send us to be
8:22
commuted. If not, he should just be let out a prison entirely. You know, there was a lot of
8:27
activism around just getting Julie's Jones out of prison entirely. And especially now that a
8:32
sentence has been commuted. Everyone's kind of shifting their focus till we need to get him
8:35
out entirely like this is miscarriage of justice that is even in prison, even on death row.
8:39
And then with that, they're using Julie's Jones as part of their activism to get rid of
8:45
the death penalty altogether. So a lot of people have been fighting against the death
8:48
penalty. This is on all sides. This isn't really a left to right issue as much as you would think.
8:52
There are a lot of people think, you know, especially libertarians and different things
8:54
like that that the death penalty, there's no basis for there's been too many problems with it. We
8:58
shouldn't let it happen. I forget how many years ago was, but there was a prisoner that was supposed
9:02
to be executed in the state of Oklahoma. And there was it was a botched execution. You know,
9:06
something went wrong with the drugs that they administered. So they had to kind of redo it later.
9:09
It was, you know, kind of a bad deal. But a lot of people will point to that and say,
9:12
we just need to get rid of the death penalty altogether. So I'm going to go into some quick
9:15
thoughts here. And again, stick around because we're going to get into the Christian arguments
9:19
or how Christians should view the death penalty. But we need to really deal with this case. I want
9:23
to give some quick thoughts here. Many people were advocating for the commutation of a sentence
9:27
in order to virtue signal, because this was kind of an easy low hanging fruit. This is a black guy.
9:31
He was, you know, convicted by a majority white jury in a state that's majority white,
9:35
which is every state. And but this is one of those miscarriage of justice things. So they're
9:39
going to say he his sentence needs to be commuted so that they can signal virtue. But then there were
9:43
also many people that were advocating for the commutation of a sentence because they actually
9:47
believe he's innocent. You know, they've read a few blogs, they listened to some podcasts,
9:51
maybe they watched a documentary and now all of a sudden they think Julius Jones is innocent of
9:55
this crime that he wasn't even there. Right. So a lot of people are doing that. But also people
9:59
apparently don't know what sentence commutation is. I know it's not something that we normally talk
10:02
about in everyday conversation, but essentially the death penalty has been removed. But now his
10:07
sentence is life in prison without the possibility of parole. I think some people thought that he
10:10
was just going to get out. They were like furious that he wasn't out of prison, because the thing is,
10:14
with this change in his sentencing, it is in no way removing his guilt. Okay, because if he's not
10:20
guilty, you don't commute the sentence, you get rid of the sentence altogether. And he goes free,
10:25
right? You don't, you don't make it life in prison without the possibility of parole.
10:28
But this last thing, this has been the thing that, you know, ever since this happened,
10:30
that's been very, very striking to me. And the striking thing about the Julius Jones case all
10:34
together is we're told that we need to give a tremendous amount of compassion to Julius Jones
10:40
and his family, but not the family of the actual victim, Paul Howl, because they're the ones that
10:47
lost a family member, right? Because of this crime. And since 1999, they've been dealing with that
10:54
for the last 22 years. Okay. And now they see the guy that for all intents purposes killed their
11:00
family member, their dad, their brother, their son. And now it's like, Oh, the guy that potentially
11:06
killed him allegedly killed him is going to not be put to death for that. That's got to be a hard
11:12
thing for them to deal with as well. Because this family is constantly having to talk about this
11:15
and think about this, right? But now we need to get into the real specifics of the case. And so
11:20
just bear with me. Because I think this is very, very interesting for a lot of you, especially if
11:24
you've fallen for a lot of the stuff that, you know, a lot of the left wing media or bad podcasters
11:29
are kind of put out there. The reality of this whole situation is that Julius Jones is guilty.
11:35
And he should be dead today. Why should he be dead today? Because by every available measure and
11:42
evidence, he's guilty. He was found guilty in a court of law by a jury of his peers beyond a
11:48
reasonable doubt. He was sentenced to death. He's made multiple appeals way more on that later.
11:54
They all upheld the conviction and the penalty. So he should be dead. Period. And we need to get
12:00
into the cold hard facts about the case and just quick side note on the cold hard facts.
12:04
We can't possibly get into all the details here. We can't do like a 10 hour long podcast.
12:08
I'll try to keep it to the pertinent information. But there was a, there's been a tremendous
12:11
amount of incomplete information or just straight up misinformation about this case.
12:15
So this is what happens when the general public bases their opinions off of what is said on a
12:20
documentary or alleged on some random person's blog and that you don't check your sources.
12:24
Because the best sources in this case is the actual evidence, right? The court testimony,
12:28
the transcripts and the family eyewitness testimony, which is the majority of the reason why he was
12:32
convicted because the family actually did an interview with channel four here in Oklahoma City
12:37
before the sentence commutation. And this, and I'll put the link in the show notes for that,
12:40
but this was the first time the family actually did an interview in these 22 years because they've
12:43
been reached out to by international news organizations trying to get them on the record to talk about
12:48
this. But they did this right before the sentence commutation. You should definitely watch it.
12:51
It's not a very long video. But here's the deal. In this case, in the Julie Schones case,
12:56
we have eyewitness evidence that says Julius Jones is a killer.
13:00
We have DNA evidence saying that Julius Jones is a killer and the murder weapon was found
13:06
in Julius Jones's residence. There is no reliable evidence to the contrary of any of those three
13:13
facts. None. Again, eyewitness testimony, DNA evidence murder weapon. We have all three of those
13:21
things. Okay. And also two separate people testified under oath that they saw Julius Jones driving
13:27
Paul house suburban, the day of the murder, the day of the murder. And there's even surveillance
13:33
video of Julie Schones at a store where he apparently abandoned Paul house suburban after he stole it,
13:38
the day of the murder. Okay. Now, there are a lot of misconceptions about this case,
13:42
mainly because activists spreading the misinformation in the documentary about Julius
13:46
Jones, specifically the documentaries called the last defense. It was a television documentary
13:50
now, I think you can stream it on Netflix or Amazon or somewhere like that. But the last
13:53
defense is a lot of the reasons why people, they watched this and now they're looking at the case
13:56
and they're like, Oh, this, this is a tremendous miscarriage of justice here. But there are a lot
14:00
of common misconceptions about the case. But first, we're going to look at the common misconceptions
14:04
about Julius Jones that need to be debunked. One of the misconceptions is that at the time of the
14:08
murder, Julius Jones, 19 years old at the time was attending the University of Oklahoma OU on
14:13
an academic scholarship. Okay, that's one of the things we hear people a lot of people say.
14:17
Now, here's the reality is he was a good student in high school. He went to John Marshall in Oklahoma
14:20
City. He did in fact get a academic scholarship to go to OU, but he failed out. After his first
14:28
semester, he had a 0.8 GPA. Okay, he never even finished his second semester. So before he even
14:36
got to his second semester, he had lost his scholarship and he didn't even make it out of his freshman
14:40
year. Okay, and that would have been the spring of 1999, his second semester, which he didn't finish.
14:44
So by the time this murder occurred, he was no longer a scholarship student at OU. He wasn't even a
14:49
student at OU. Okay, another common misconception about Julius Jones is that he played on the football
14:54
and or the basketball teams at the University of Oklahoma. People are like, Oh, I was such a
14:58
great athlete. He just kind of walked on. They wanted him to play. The reality is he never,
15:02
and this is corroborated by the University of Oklahoma. He never played for any of their sports
15:07
teams. He wasn't on the practice squad. He wasn't on the actual squad. He wasn't given a walk on spot.
15:11
It's got nothing. He never played. So he may have been a good athlete, but he did not play for the
15:16
University of Oklahoma. Another common misconception is he had no previous history of any serious or
15:22
violent crimes. A lot of people are like, Oh, we, you know, this is completely out of character
15:25
for this great kid. Wrong, super duper wrong. Okay, so I want you to remember, because these
15:31
dates are important. Remember that this murder took place July the 28th of 1999, July 28, 1921,
15:36
1999. Okay, on July 22nd of 1999. Okay, less than a week earlier, Jones stole a Mercedes after
15:45
pointing a gun at the owner's head and demanding the keys. One day before that on July 21st, 1999,
15:52
Jones stole a Lexus after pointing a gun at the owner's head and demanding the keys. He also had
15:57
a rap sheet that included robbery, armed robbery, illegal possession of a firearm, evading arrest,
16:03
threats of violence, and others. Okay. And then on July 9th of 1999, just earlier that month,
16:08
in one of those armed robberies, this time at a jewelry store, he was wearing a red bandana
16:13
over his nose and mouth. Perhaps you're noticing a pattern here. Okay. Now he pled guilty to many
16:20
of those crimes after the murder conviction. And that's not so subtly not mentioned in the
16:24
documentary. It's not mentioned in all these blogs about these people saying that he's innocent.
16:28
Okay. But the last misconception about Julie's Jones before we get into the misconceptions about
16:31
the actual case is that he's just a nice guy. He's just a nice kid. The young kid got caught up in
16:36
some racist criminal conspiracy. He wouldn't hurt anyone. Okay. But here's the reality.
16:42
He's an active gang member in prison. Okay. Prison officials have actually intercepted
16:47
communication by Julius Jones, threatening to kill other people while he's still in prison.
16:51
Okay. So the reality of who Julius Jones is, is he's not a good person. He's a violent thug,
16:59
a violent thug. And some of you are like, Oh, I can't say the word thug anymore to describe people,
17:04
because especially if you say it about a black person, thugs don't have a color. Thugs are thugs.
17:10
Maybe a white thug, Native American thug, a Latinx thug. Thug is thug. And if you heard the word
17:16
thug and thought immediately, I said that because he was a black person, that doesn't make me racist.
17:20
That makes you racist. But now we need to talk about the misconceptions about the case itself
17:25
that need to be debunked. Okay. This is very important. The first is that Paul house sister,
17:29
who is the main person to testify in this case, because she was eyewitness to her brother's murder,
17:33
did not accurately describe Julie's Jones's appearance. A lot of people are saying that. So
17:37
Megan, that's Paul sister, said that the shooter wore a tight stocking cap and a red bandana.
17:43
Okay. She said that there was an inch of hair above his ears that she could see. Okay. So this
17:48
led some people to believe that she actually saw Christopher Jordan and not Julius Jones,
17:53
because Christopher Jordan at the time had cornrows. Okay. Which would have stuck out about an inch
17:58
below a stocking cap. So it's like, Oh my gosh, she's talking about a different person. However,
18:02
Megan wasn't describing cornrows. In the court testimony, she specifically was asked about cornrows
18:08
and braids. She knows what those things are. And she said that the shooter did not have cornrows
18:13
and braids or braids. She said that the stocking cap was so tight, she would have been able to
18:16
notice that. But she was referring to using, you know, not so effective English was Julie's Jones
18:22
had short, she was referring to sideburns, essentially. Okay. Which Julie Jones had short sideburns at
18:27
the time about an inch below his ears and inch out away from his ears. Okay. Christopher Jordan
18:32
had this scraggly, these scraggly sideburns that went down the entire side of his jawline like
18:37
someone trying to do a really bad chin strap. Okay. So that's the first thing. That's one of
18:40
the first misconceptions that a lot of people talked about. The second misconception is that
18:45
there was never a DNA test done on the red bandana that the murder weapon was wrapped in when the
18:51
police found it, that they never tested it. Right. People are claiming this because the
18:55
prosecutors are drum roll. Guess what? Racist. Right. They definitely didn't want to test that
19:03
because that would exonerate a black man because of course, because that's always the narrative.
19:08
Right. Here's the thing. Julius Jones said that the DNA testing of the bandana would exonerate him.
19:15
He supposedly said openly and all the time, please test the bandana, test the bandana,
19:19
it's going to exonerate me. It's going to prove that I'm innocent. Now here's the deal. It is true
19:24
that the DNA test was not done as part of Julius Jones's initial trial. And it could have been,
19:30
I actually don't know the reason why it wasn't. Okay. He was convicted mainly on the eyewitness
19:35
testimony. Okay. So they didn't need the DNA test, but you know, I, that would have been
19:39
something that I would have liked to have seen. But since the trial, okay, DNA evidence has been
19:45
done on the bandana and the results are not great for Julius Jones fans because this is what the
19:51
DNA test found. Number one, this bandana was 100% worn during the murder of Paul Howe.
19:58
Number two, this bandana was not worn by Christopher Jordan.
20:04
And number three, the odds that the DNA on this bandana was not the DNA of Julius Jones
20:12
is about one and 110 million African Americans. Okay. Now there are only around 40 million black
20:20
people in the United States. So essentially, yes, the DNA on the red bandana was Julius Jones's.
20:27
That's the reality because that, uh, the last verdict or whatever, the documentary,
20:34
they into the documentary by saying, and the DNA evidence still hasn't, or the DNA test still
20:38
hasn't been done on the bandana, but now it has been. And it's not good. It basically points to
20:43
Julius Jones as a person that was wearing it when the murder happened, right? Here's another common
20:47
misconception about this case. And that's that Julius Jones was not allowed to testify.
20:51
And it's like, oh, this is crazy. This guy, you know, he's, he's, you know, trying to save his own
20:56
life. Why wasn't he allowed to testify? But according to the court transcript, which apparently people
21:00
just don't have enough time to read, Julius Jones was repeatedly asked if he wanted to testify.
21:06
He actually declined to testify in his own case, not one time, not two times, not even three times.
21:14
On four separate occasions, he declined to testify at his own trial. He was not kept from
21:20
testifying. He refused to. Okay. Another common misconception about this case is that Julius
21:24
Jones had an alibi for the time of the murder, but was not allowed to present that in court.
21:30
Okay. Now again, he and his entire family claim that Julius Jones was at home the entire night.
21:36
Okay. That was, you know, the, their home was about a 20 minutes drive away from the side of the
21:40
murder. He said he was playing monopoly, eating spaghetti. So there was no way he could have been
21:43
there during the murder because he was at home with his family. Now, Julius Jones had two separate
21:48
attorneys during his trial. Okay. He told both of his attorneys, both of them, that he was, in fact,
21:54
not at home during the time of the murder. He told his attorneys that, but his family said
22:00
something else entirely, right? The family of Julius Jones wanted to present this alibi in court
22:06
and claim that he was in fact at home and couldn't have been at the murder site at the time of the
22:10
murder. But both attorneys refused to allow the family to do that because they knew that the family
22:16
was lying. Okay. They were lying. Both of these attorneys testified under oath that they knew the
22:22
family was lying to try and save Julius Jones. Okay. Attorneys, namely defense attorneys,
22:28
they can be disbarred for allowing their clients to, or advocates of their clients to lie on the
22:32
witness stand if the attorneys know that the testimonies are lies, that the testimonies are false.
22:38
So I don't know of any defense attorney that's willing to roll that dice.
22:41
And also, again, as I talked about earlier, there were two eyewitnesses that separately
22:45
testified under oath that they saw Julius Jones during driving the stolen suburban the night of
22:51
the murder. So he wasn't at home. You know, there were other people like, Oh, I was mad about this
22:56
cookie that his family had been eating. He wasn't used spaghetti. He wasn't playing a monopoly.
23:00
He was murdering somebody in Edmond, Oklahoma. Another thing that you've heard a common misconception
23:04
about this case is that there is reasonable doubt that Julius Jones murdered Paul Howe.
23:09
There's reasonable doubt, but there's no evidence for this.
23:12
Julius Jones's case has gone to this is crazy. This is very, very important. His case has gone to
23:19
13 different appellate courts, 13, including the Supreme Court. Four times they've sent this to
23:28
the Supreme Court. And in each of those cases, in all 13 of the cases that has been sent to an
23:33
appellate court, the conviction and the sentencing has been upheld 13 times. Okay. So here's my
23:40
summary of this case. Julius Jones killed Paul Howe. It is beyond a reasonable doubt. Again,
23:48
DNA evidence, eyewitness testimony, murder weapon. What else do you want? Like literally,
23:55
what else do you need at this point to feel comfortable with the fact that yes, indeed,
23:59
he did kill Paul Howe. Julius Jones is a thug. He's a murderer and his death sentence should have
24:06
been upheld. It should have been carried out. He should be dead today. Okay. So now we need to go
24:11
into how Christian should view the death penalty, you know, kind of awkward transition here. But
24:16
at the same time, I think it's important for us to know what the history of the death penalty is.
24:21
So we'll get into what Christians, how they should view it. But I thought that this was interesting
24:24
in terms of what the death penalty has been like in the United States. So I've got a thing that
24:28
I put in the show notes here, but I'm just gonna go through a quick timeline of the history of the
24:32
death penalty in the United States. So in 1608 was the first recorded execution in the British American
24:36
colonies. And that was for treason. In 1682, Pennsylvania, decide Pennsylvania. Why did I say
24:42
it like that? Pennsylvania, Pennsylvania limits crimes punishable to death to treason and murder
24:46
only that was in 1682. In 1775, the death penalty was used in all 13 US colonies at the outbreak of
24:53
the American Revolution. In 1787, the founding fathers and the founding fathers allowed the death
24:58
penalty when writing the Constitution. On April the 30th of 1790, the first US Congress establishes
25:05
the federal death penalty on June the 20th, June the 25th of 1790. The first person executed under
25:11
the US federal death penalty was done on that date. In 1845, the first national death penalty
25:16
abolition society is formed. In 1846, Michigan becomes a first US state to abolish capital punishment,
25:22
except for treason. In 1852, Rhode Island becomes a first state to outlaw the death penalty for all
25:28
crimes, including treason. On August the 6 1890, New York State performs the first execution by
25:33
electrocution with the assistance of Thomas Edison's engineers. On February 8 of 1924, the first US
25:40
execution by gas chamber was carried out in the state of Nevada. In August of August 14 of 1936,
25:46
that was when the last public execution took place in the United States. On January 13 of 1947,
25:51
the Supreme Court finds the second execution attempt after a technical malfunction does not
25:56
constitute cruel and unusual punishment. On July 2 of 1976, the US Supreme Court reaffirms the
26:02
constitutionality of the death penalty. On June the 29 of 1977, the US Supreme Court finds death
26:08
penalty to be an excessive punishment for rape crimes. Unfortunately, on July 2 1982, the US
26:14
Supreme Court rules that capital punishment is excessive for a dependent who played a minor role
26:19
in a felony murder. On December 7 of 1982, Texas performs its first lethal injection.
26:25
On June the 26 of 1986, the US Supreme Court rules the execution of insane persons unconstitutional.
26:31
On June 28 of 1993, Kirk Bloodsworth becomes a first American sentence to death row
26:37
to be exonerated with DNA testing. So thank God for that. On January the 25 of 1996,
26:42
that was the last execution by hanging in the United States. On March the 3 of 1999,
26:47
that was the last execution by gas chamber. On June the 11 of 2001, Oklahoma City bomber Timothy
26:53
McVay first, he was the first federal prisoner to be executed in 38 years. And thank God that
26:58
tremendous piece of crap is in hell. Now, in December 18 of 2007, the United Nations General
27:04
Assembly passes a resolution calling for a moratorium on the death penalty, essentially saying, Hey,
27:08
let's pause the death penalty. On June the 25 of 2008, the US Supreme Court finds death penalty
27:14
excessive for the crime of child rape. Unfortunately, on June the 18 of 2010, that was the last
27:19
execution by firing squad. And then in March 23 of 2015, Utah reinstates the use of firing squad
27:27
for execution. So they're kind of brings you up to speed in the link I'll put in the show notes.
27:30
There's a whole lot more information, but I just pull out the stuff that I thought you would
27:33
find interesting. So let's talk about the current state of the death penalty in the United States.
27:37
So right now, there are 24 states that still have the death penalty. Okay, three states,
27:41
California, Oregon and Pennsylvania, they currently have a moratorium on the death penalty. Essentially,
27:45
they're they're about to eradicate it would be the thought. So 23 states have abolished
27:49
the death penalty altogether. That's there have been eight states that have done that since 2011.
27:54
The last two were Colorado in 2020. And most recently, Virginia in 2021, this year, only 16
28:01
states have carried out death penalty execution since 2011. As of January the 1st of 2021,
28:07
around 2,500 people are currently on death row in the United States. The number one state for
28:11
that is California. They have 704. I think right now, and that's again, as of January 1st, 704
28:17
people on death row. And that's a moratorium on that in that state. So those people likely won't
28:21
be executed. Florida has the second most people on death row with 343. And the state of Texas has
28:26
the third most with 205 people that are on death row. There are currently around 60 federal
28:32
prisoners that are set to be killed by the federal government. And here's the other thing, what we
28:36
execute people for. We only execute people in the United States for murder and treason. Okay.
28:41
And I think the last execution for treason was sometime in the 1800s. So we're essentially
28:45
not doing that anymore. I certainly think that we should expand that you've heard me talk about
28:48
this on the show before that if you rape somebody, right beyond a reasonable doubt, you're found
28:53
guilty. You should be executed for that. If you're a pedophile, if you've raped small children,
28:57
if you've performed sex acts with small children, you should be killed for that as well. I mean,
29:01
I think that is an absolute violation of the amago day and for people's personal sexual sovereignty.
29:05
So absolutely, I think that we should execute people for that. But again, we don't really do
29:10
that in this country. So let's go and get in as I promised for the last half hour. How Christian
29:14
should view the death penalty. Okay. And in order to talk about how Christian should view the death
29:18
penalty, we need to go directly to scripture, obviously. So the logic of capital punishment
29:23
comes directly from the Holy Scriptures. Okay. So let's break this down. The first thing,
29:28
as I just mentioned, is the Amago day. So we see this in Genesis 127. So God created man in his own
29:33
image in the image of God, he created him, male and female, he created them. So by this, we know
29:39
that an assault on any person, right, is an assault on the image of God. So that's the first thing.
29:45
That's the Amago day. Then we get into the covenant with Noah. So all of us are descendants of Adam
29:50
and Eve, right? And we're all descendants of Noah because Noah was the only in his family,
29:55
I guess, because they were the only people left after the great flood, right? So essentially,
29:59
if human nature and action did not improve after the flood, there needed to be some sort of law
30:05
by which to judge the actions of humans against other humans, right? So God needed to put something
30:10
in place. So we see this in Genesis nine versus five through six. And for your lifeblood, I will
30:14
require reckoning from every beast. I will require it from and I will cry out from man.
30:19
From his fellow man, I will require reckoning for the life of man, whoever sheds the blood of man
30:24
by man, shall his blood be shed for God made man in his own image. So I think the ESV study
30:29
Bible breaks this down very, very well. So the quote here from his fellow man, I will require a
30:34
reckoning for the life of man. So essentially, if a person or an animal kills a human,
30:39
they would be held accountable by God. Okay. So we're establishing some sort of a law,
30:45
whereas a just God can judge an animal or a person for destroying another human being that's
30:50
been made in the image of God. Okay. And then we have this as well, the quote that says, whoever
30:55
sheds the blood of man by man, shall has blood be shed. We'll see that in Exodus as well,
30:59
which we'll go into here in just a second, but that's basically the concept of a life for a life.
31:03
And then the quote here, and God made man in his own image, obviously, that's going back to Genesis
31:07
127. So again, an attack on a human is an attack on the image of God that cannot be ignored. Okay.
31:12
Then we also get into God's law given to Moses and Exodus. Okay. So Exodus 2013,
31:18
you shall not murder. Again, some people say thou shall not kill, but it is murder.
31:22
They're talking about murder, the intentional destruction of another human life. Okay.
31:26
Then we have Exodus 21 12, whoever strikes a man so that he dies shall be put to death.
31:31
And then in Exodus 21 23, but if there is harm, then you shall pay life for life. Okay.
31:37
Now the Bible, and I think this, this is very important, especially for people that don't
31:40
think we should have the death penalty, it creates a very, very high standard for the death penalty
31:45
as well. So in Deuteronomy 19 15, a single witness shall not suffice against a person for any crime
31:51
or for any wrong in connection with any offense that he has committed. Only on the evidence of two
31:57
witnesses or three witnesses shall a charge be established. Okay. So this is actually echoed
32:02
in the New Testament and well in Matthew 18 16 by Jesus and Hebrews 1028 by Paul.
32:08
So circumstantial evidence alone is not enough by the biblical standard in order to convict somebody
32:14
of the death penalty to warrant that punishment. Okay. There had to be eyewitness testimony.
32:19
Now that would actually be easier in a tribal culture at the time when this was written,
32:23
then it would be in a modern culture, but that was a standard that was set forth in Scripture for us.
32:27
Okay. Now God also, because some people kind of get into the weeds about this,
32:31
God gives our governing authorities, right? The ability and the right to carry out his law.
32:36
So you've heard Romans 13 talked a lot about with COVID restrictions and lockdowns and everything,
32:40
but I'm going to read verses one through five of Romans 13 because this is pertinent to the
32:43
death penalty discussion. Let every person be subject to the governing authorities for there is
32:47
no authority except from God and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore,
32:51
whoever resist the authorities resist what God has appointed and those who resist will
32:55
incur judgment for rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear
33:01
of the one who is an authority? Then do what is good and you will receive his approval for he is
33:06
God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid for he does not bear the sword in vain,
33:11
for he is a servant of God, an avenger of who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer.
33:16
Therefore, one must be in subject, uh, subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath, but also for the
33:21
sake of conscience. So a lot of people there, when they're talking about, you know, an avenger
33:25
carrying out God's wrath or the sword, uh, bearing the sword, uh, they're thinking about the, the
33:29
sword in a, um, really in the context of the ultimate punishments that could be levied out
33:35
or even other punishments as well. So essentially guys, that's the basis for the pro death penalty
33:40
position. Okay. So when you go to scripture, when people are looking for the scriptures,
33:44
that give you a basis, that's it. Okay. You can dig in further and it kind of has some tendrils
33:48
that go out from those scriptures. But the bottom line is this, if you intentionally murder someone,
33:53
okay, you forfeit your right to life and by, by the standard for conviction and I would say this,
34:00
the standard for conviction and execution is high. So even going back to the Julius Jones case,
34:04
you know, you need, you know, two or three eyewitnesses according to biblical law, right?
34:08
Paul house sister and both of his young children were witnesses to his murder.
34:12
Okay. So again, going back to that case, Julius Jones should be dead today,
34:16
even if you're just using basic biblical law, but now I want to get into some objections to the
34:21
death penalty because this is important as well because you have a lot of people that are going to
34:25
object in a lot of different ways. And I want to give you guys, you know, the right words to say.
34:29
So if you are kind of giving, you're getting pushed back on this particular subject,
34:32
you know, I want to make sure that you're actually comfortable with giving,
34:36
giving some sort of an apologetic back. Okay. So the first thing you'll hear people say is that
34:40
your support for the death penalty comes from the Old Testament, you know, aka the Old Covenant,
34:44
you know, we're under a new covenant now. The Old Covenant is no more, but these are people that
34:48
aren't really looking at the context of the New Testament. So I want to bring something to your
34:51
attention here. That is what Paul was doing in acts. And so in acts 25, Paul is in Caesarea and
34:56
he's before a Roman tribunal. The Jews came down to Caesarea to perform, or I guess to put forth
35:02
some mostly erroneous charges against Paul, maybe completely erroneous charges against Paul.
35:06
And I want to look at what we see here in acts 28 versus eight through 11. Paul argued in his
35:11
defense, neither against the law of the Jews nor against the temple, nor against Caesar,
35:15
how I committed any offenses. But Festus wishing to do the Jews a favor said to Paul,
35:19
do you wish to go up to Jerusalem and there be tried on these charges before me? But Paul said,
35:25
I am standing before Caesar's tribunal, where I ought to be tried to the Jews I have done no wrong,
35:30
as you yourself know very well. If I then, or if then I am a wrongdoer and have committed anything
35:36
for which I deserve to die, I do not seek to escape death. But if there is nothing to their
35:41
charges against me, no one can give me up to them. I appeal to Caesar. Okay. So again, the focus here
35:49
is where he says, if I'm a wrongdoer and have committed anything for which I deserve to die,
35:53
I do not seek to escape death. Okay. So since we're in the New Testament times right now,
35:58
and Jesus fulfilled the law, you know, that this scripture begs the question,
36:02
why didn't Paul just say Jesus fulfilled the law? We're under a new covenant. You can't do
36:08
anything to me. He never says that. Okay. Because you would think that would come up,
36:14
because some of the charges that the Jews were levying against Paul at the time would carry a
36:18
death sentence. So if there was an eradication of the laws that we see in the Old Testament,
36:25
which support a death sentence, don't you think Paul would have said that? The New Testament does
36:30
not have any denunciation of capital punishment. Now you can twist some things around to make your
36:36
case, but it's not terribly compelling. Okay. And also before we leave this point, if you're a
36:41
Christian, because I know a lot of Christians that are anti death penalty, if you're a Christian,
36:45
you believe in ultimate justice and ultimate hope, right? So ultimate justice means there will be
36:50
justice beyond this world. So we don't need social justice on this planet because we know
36:54
that there will ultimately be justice. People will be judged for the actions that they've committed
36:58
against people, right? And against God. But there's also ultimate hope.
37:02
There is hope beyond this world. So I'm confused when a lot of Christians want to get rid of the
37:08
death penalty, because they're not giving a very good reasoning for that. And it's almost like
37:14
they're forgetting, Hey, let's say that that someone's executed and they were actually innocent,
37:18
which we'll get into more here in just a second. Like there's ultimate hope there for that person.
37:23
But then for other people that have maybe should have been executed that haven't been executed,
37:27
there will be justice for that person as well. And I would pray that those people would accept
37:32
the gospel and be covered in the blood of Christ, but they will still have to face judgment for
37:36
what they've done. Another thing you'll hear people say about the death penalty is, well,
37:40
you're just bloodthirsty, right? You know, you might hear, as I'm talking through the
37:43
Julie Jones case, how is getting excited about it? And you might be like, Oh, you're just blood
37:46
thirsty. You just want the guy to die. But the reality is, is that I think that if you murder
37:50
someone and that's been proven beyond a reasonable doubt that you should die.
37:54
Like I'm about justice, not blood. Justice is very, very important in a worldly context and in a,
38:03
you know, other worldly context, a heavenly context. So I think that this should be applied
38:09
carefully, that the death penalty should be applied very, very carefully. But it should
38:14
ultimately be applied. Doesn't have anything to do with blood in my lust for it, right?
38:18
Another thing you'll hear people say is that innocent people have been executed before,
38:22
right? And because of that, we've got to get rid of the death penalty altogether.
38:25
Now, here's the deal. That is 100% true. The first part, there is no way that that's not true.
38:31
It's hard to tell how many it's impossible to tell how many innocent people have been executed
38:36
for their crimes. But it's been a lot. It certainly happened. It's happened all over the globe.
38:40
But the misapplication of a thing cannot be the sole reason for getting rid of the thing.
38:49
Because if the death penalty is misapplied in certain instances, that doesn't automatically
38:54
mean that it's misapplied in all instances. Now, I understand the arguments like,
38:58
well, some people have been caught caught up in this and they were innocent and we should
39:02
get rid of it entirely. But again, the fact is that this has happened to the fact that this has
39:07
happened to innocent people should encourage us to have higher standards, you know, higher
39:12
expectations and higher requirements on our justice system, not to just get rid of it.
39:18
Because if you get rid of the death penalty, that's a slow chipping away of all crimes and all
39:23
punishments. And people think, Oh, it's slippery. Slippery. Slope. You can't say that. But we're
39:27
living in a world right now where the slippery slope argument, the fallacy no longer exists.
39:31
It's just an argument. It's just a description of fact, because look at just this week, we're
39:36
removing, you know, statues of Thomas Jefferson and of Teddy Roosevelt, right? We're moving
39:41
them and taking other places. And people thought Trump was crazy, you know, three, four years ago,
39:45
when he said, Yeah, you know, you're coming after, you know, these statues of these Confederate
39:49
generals and all that, how long until it's George Washington and Thomas Jefferson? You're like, Oh,
39:52
that's crazy. You know, that slippery slope, you can't say something like that. And then here we are,
39:56
like one administration later, and those things are happening. And so when you take away the death
40:02
penalty, why wouldn't we just take away all mandatory sentences? Wouldn't that be next?
40:06
But when we take away harsh sentences, and then who gets to decide what's harsh, right? It opens
40:11
up a lot of doors that we don't want to get into. Another thing that you hear people say
40:14
that I want to get rid of the death penalty is, you know, why don't you want this person to live
40:18
longer, Kyle? Want that, you know, increase their chances of accepting Christ if we don't kill them,
40:23
if we let them just die of old age? Now, I guess you, I suppose that you could look at it that way.
40:28
But I'd say a better way to look at it is that they've had their entire life to hear and accept
40:35
the gospel up to that point. Okay. And typically it takes decades in between the handing down of a
40:42
death sentence and the execution of a death sentence. There is certainly time for this person
40:47
to accept Christ. And I don't want to get into all the, you know, arguments about, oh, you know,
40:52
election and, you know, whether people get to choose and, you know, free will and I don't have
40:56
time for that. But there's time for these people to accept Christ. So I don't see a reason to delay
41:02
the justice because this person, if we don't kill them now, you know, they just die 30, 40, 50 years
41:08
later in a prison cell that they might accept Christ. I don't really see the compelling argument
41:13
for that. Another thing you'll hear, and this is very, very common, is that the death penalty is
41:17
racist. So it should be abolished because it's racist. Now, I know that I don't mean this to be
41:22
tongue and cheek. It's gonna sound that way. The death penalty can't be racist because the death
41:29
penalty is not a person. It's a thing. Like a water bottle can't be racist, a philosophy,
41:37
like just the description of a philosophy can't be racist. Things can be racist in practice. But
41:42
when you say the death penalty is racist, which a lot of major news outlets were posting stories
41:47
about, we know with that type of a caption, it's like, what are you talking about? So that's first
41:51
of all, second of all, we only execute people for murder in this country. Okay, we can execute
41:56
them for treason, but we don't. And black people, while only making up around 15% of the population
42:04
nine states, they commit around 56% of all the murders in this country. And the overwhelming majority
42:12
of those murders are of other black people. This is according to the FBI. So 15% of the population,
42:18
around 56% of the murders, and a very high percentage of those murders are of other black people.
42:25
Okay. So right now, this is important. Right now, black people only constitute
42:30
around 40% of death row inmates. Okay. So by that measure, statistically speaking, and since we only
42:38
execute people for murder, black people should actually represent a higher amount of death row
42:43
inmates than they currently do. Again, only around 40% of death row inmates are black.
42:49
But every year, over 50% of the murders are done by black people. So when people say that it's racist,
42:56
it doesn't even make philosophical sense, but it certainly doesn't make sense when you look at the
43:00
data. Okay, again, I'll go over it one more time, because this is important. They make up 15% of
43:04
the population every year, over 50% of the murders, and they only constitute 40% of death row inmates.
43:11
Help me understand. Right. I'm the bigoted racist for pointing out these stats. Do you have a response?
43:16
And another thing that you'll you're here, and if you listen to this podcast, you've heard me
43:20
talk about this before, but you hear people say you're pro death penalty. So you can't be pro life.
43:25
Now, in episode 257 of this podcast, a few weeks ago, I did an episode called how to engage pro
43:30
abortion arguments. Here's the reality. This entire argument that if you're pro death penalty,
43:34
you're not pro life, it's meant to distract you by equating two things that are not related. Again,
43:38
in that episode, I talked about the most simple way to look at the pro life argument is that abortion
43:42
intentionally and directly destroys innocent human life. And it's always wrong to intentionally
43:46
and directly destroy innocent human life. Now, when the state or the nation kills someone,
43:50
these people are typically very, very far from innocent. They've been convicted guilty beyond a
43:55
reasonable doubt for murder. They've gone through the appellate process, and all those things have
43:59
been upheld. So the way that you respond to that person is, are you saying that an innocent unborn
44:03
child is the same as a murderer? Because in the United States, we only get rid of people, we only
44:07
execute people if they murdered other people. So tell me how the living baby inside the womb
44:12
is exactly like a murderer. Help me understand that. And then another thing that we look at,
44:16
this is the last one that we'll go through is the death penalty doesn't deter crimes.
44:21
You hear people actually say that. And my response would be is it wouldn't if the executions came
44:26
more quickly after convictions, don't you think if executions came more quickly after
44:32
conventions that that would actually deter crimes? I certainly think so. But there's a great quote
44:37
from it's actually a paragraph from Joseph Bassett. So he wrote an opinion piece for the Wall Street
44:42
Journal back in 2018. So I'm going to read this quote to you here. So the quote here, here, let me
44:46
get it and pull it up. All right, here we go. There is also a deeper kind of deterrence largely
44:51
overlooked in discussions of the death penalty, which doesn't require rational calculation.
44:55
When a society imposes the ultimate punishment for the most heinous murders,
44:59
it powerfully teaches that murder is a great wrong. Children growing up in such a society
45:04
internalize this message with the result that most people wouldn't even consider killing another
45:08
person. Here the principal justice which demands that mal factors receive a punishment proportionate
45:13
to their offense and deterrence of this deeper sort meet. If we abolish the death penalty for even
45:19
the most heinous and cold blood and murderers, we fatally undermine the idea of justice as the
45:24
cornerstone of our criminal justice system. Over time, justice will be replaced by a therapeutic
45:30
or technocratic model that treats human beings as cases to be managed and socially engineered
45:35
rather than as morally responsible persons. Again, this is from Wall Street Journal article
45:40
by Joseph a set in 2018. I'll put down the show notes as well. That's absolutely right and absolutely
45:46
perfect. It goes to what I was talking about earlier. You get rid of the death penalty,
45:50
then you get rid of the moral, the the morality of what's going on in that moment.
45:55
And society like as a kid, I knew that the death penalty was a thing. And I knew you didn't get
45:59
the death penalty for stealing bubblegum, right? You knew that you got the death penalty if you
46:03
killed somebody. So constantly from an early age, it's something inside you even if before you have
46:08
like a biblical ethic or before you have any sort of societal societal ethic or political ethic,
46:13
you know that killing another person is wrong. You may not know why you may not have thought
46:18
through all the philosophies and all the potentialities for why that is the way that it is as I laid
46:22
out earlier with the biblical arguments, but you know it's wrong. And so when you get rid of the
46:26
death penalty entirely, which a lot of states have done, right? You're telling these people
46:31
that even if you rape and murder an entire family and bathe in their blood, we'll just let you
46:37
rot in prison until you die eventually. And then there are a lot of people that murder someone
46:42
that eventually get out. That's the other thing is, you know, many people are convicted of murder
46:47
that are given, you know, 25 30 year sentences. Why should these people ever be allowed to get
46:53
out? You're like, Oh, they were just a kid and all they did. Did they not know that killing someone
46:57
was wrong? Because that goes right back to this argument that if they do make that declaration,
47:03
like, Oh, I didn't know it was wrong. You know, I was 17 and I was in a gang. I just thought it was
47:07
what I was supposed to do. When you take away the death penalty, you're also taking away
47:11
this moral idea that you shouldn't end other people's lives, other innocent people's lives.
47:15
So I think that's really, really important to discuss. So I guess in summary for this entire
47:19
episode, if you personally are anti death penalty, you're anti God's law. That is so unbelievably clear.
47:26
I laid it out there right there for you. And you can't say that it was done away within the new
47:29
Testament. If you're anti the death penalty, and again, I'm talking to you Christians out there,
47:33
you're anti God's law. And also, if you're anti death penalty, you're assuming the position
47:39
of a higher and better standard than God's. This is maybe the most important point is you are thinking
47:46
somehow that you know better than God. God says, you know, life for a life. If you in someone's life
47:53
intentionally, you should have your life taken from you again with two or three eyewitnesses.
47:58
But you, you with your P brain, your brain that only functions at like 12 or 13 percent of what
48:05
its actual capacity is, right? You think that you know better than God. You've read the scripture
48:11
as well. And I read this passage and then I heard some woke person on a tick talk talk about how
48:17
death penalty should be eradicated. And this is what I think now. And I would just say,
48:21
who are you? Who are you to say that? Who are you to know? And the reality is, is that you don't,
48:29
you don't have a higher and better standard than God does. You simply don't.
48:34
So why are you still arguing? All right, guys, before we let you go, we are going to do a quick
48:39
resilience boost. As you know, by now, an adopted life, our mission is equipping men to push back
48:43
darkness with content that forages, spiritual, mental and physical resilience. So here are the
48:47
links I've got for you. I've got the website. It's called justice for Paul Howl. So if you want
48:51
some more, you want to dig into some more of the things that I was talking about about the Julius
48:54
Jones case, you can go to that website. That's a website that was set up by the family. Also got
48:58
a couple of YouTube videos. One is called a time to speak the family of Paul Howl. That was what
49:02
channel four out here in Oakland City did that was kind of like the little nine 10 minute thing
49:05
where they interviewed the family. Then I also have a video where this guy, it's called Julius
49:08
Jones is 100% guilty. He breaks down some of the things about the transcripts in the court case,
49:12
so you can check that out. Also, the historical timeline of the death penalty of the United States,
49:16
if you want to check that information out, it's there because it's a bunch of different sources,
49:18
kind of coalesced into one. And then I have that Wall Street Journal article,
49:21
a talk and it was about it was called the cope, the pope rather makes a fatal error. And that's
49:26
where I got that quote that we just talked about a few minutes ago. All right, guys, thanks so much
49:29
for listening to this podcast. We do appreciate it. Wherever you're listening to this, please subscribe,
49:33
rate and leave a positive review. If you want me to come speak live at your event or on your podcast,
49:37
you shoot me an email to info at undaunted.life. That's I N F O at undaunted.life. You can follow
49:42
us on Instagram and tick tock and like us on Facebook and you can check out our website for
49:45
everything else, including how to donate to keep more content like this coming your way. Just go
49:48
to www dot undaunted.life. And we want to also thank the band August Burns read for allowing us
49:53
to use their music for our content. The music on this podcast is our song cutting the tides,
49:57
which is off their 10th anniversary re recording of their album leveler. The links are in the
50:02
description. I'm your host Kyle Thompson. Remember, keep pushing back darkness, keep forging spiritual,
50:09
mental and physical resilience. Keep seeking the Lion of Judah.
50:39
[Music]