[music] This is Undaunted [music] Life, a man's podcast. I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. Let's get into it. All right, guys. We got a special return guest on the podcast today. His name is Dallas Jenkins. He's a film and television director, writer, and producer. And he is the co-creator, director, and co-writer of The Chosen, which is a TV series about Jesus and the Apostles. It is going into season 6. And in this episode, we talk about season 6. We talk about season 7. We also talk about how there's actually a major motion picture happening in between those two seasons. So, we get into all those details. Guys, he was on this show before the launch of season 3, believe it or not. So, that was episode 385 of this podcast. go back to 385 and you can listen to kind of his journey, how he was in the doldrums, right? Like he was this, you know, hot shot kid that was going to be the next big thing and for writers and directors and all that and then it just went in the toilet and then we can see God move and move him from there. But in this particular podcast, we talk about the progression from that time to season 1 and then also season 1 to season 6, the biggest growing pains that they've experienced during that time period. We talk about the depiction of Jesus clearing the temple from season 5 of The Chosen because I asked him about that way back before season 3 was released and he kind of gave a cool answer that we talk about. And so we just talk about how they decided to go about doing that. But then we also talked about the people that complain about the the chosen not being scripture and how we shouldn't watch it because it's not 100% biblically accurate in terms of all the side conversations and side stories and things like that. But then I also asked him something that I was also concerned about that I talked with him off air. But I had him talk about, you know, the pride flag, the picture that was found of the person, the camera operator that had a pride flag on their camera rig and kind of how they decided to approach that and what he would say to people that are concerned about that. But then we spent a lot of time talking about season 6, what it was like filming the crucifixion, the resurrection, what it was like emotionally for all the people working on set. I mean, he said, you know, you kind of allude to it, but the first time Jonathan Roomie walked on set, he he plays Jesus with a crown of thorns and busted up and all the blood and everything like that. He said a bunch of the people on set just started weeping right at the first sight of him. It's not because it was Jonathan, it's because of who Jonathan was playing. But then we talk about kind of the release date for season 6, what we can expect with season 7, how that looks, but also the expansion of the Chosen universe. So, we've got the Chosen Adventures animated series, which is now out on Amazon. He is currently filming the Joseph minisseries. And so we talked about that on the forging table like why won't somebody do like a movie or a series about Joseph. Well, they're doing it. His studio is doing it. So we talk about those details. He's going to be making a series about some other people from the Old Testament. We talk about that. You know what's going to happen after The Chosen is done. So we just get into all the details. It's always great to talk to Dallas. So without further ado, let's get into it. Dallas Jenkins, welcome back to the show. But I just got to tell the audience right from the beginning. I love to give them a little bit of a peak behind the curtain. So the guy that greeted me when the screen came up was not you. And he was like, "Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm getting everything set up. Dallas is going to be late." Which everybody knows is unacceptable, Dallas. Everybody knows this and off air in order to pay a penance to me. You have decided to write me in an angry ginger into season 7 of The Chosen. You're just going to mush me in there somehow. And I am thrilled. >> Yeah, it's it's interesting. I'm I'm I'm kind of discovering this as we speak. Um, and it's exciting to to to learn new things. Uh, that that the punishment for two minutes uh lateness is is not really a punishment at all. It's a gift to the to the to the audience that they're going to be introduced for the first time. And in in a biblical story, the idea of a ginger who just >> I I I haven't figured out what to do with him yet. Um, I think it'll be interesting that he doesn't have a soul. So, Jesus clearly has something for him, >> but we'll see. It could it could be the kind of the where we we kind of bring together the the the origin story of of soulless gingers starting 2,000 years ago. I'm I'm I'm in to some extent. >> Well, I can't be, you know, I can't pull off the Middle Eastern Jew look, but you're telling me there wasn't a single Celtic guy just walking around Rome be bopping around, sunburnt, not knowing what to do with his anger. Come on. Like that that guy's in there somewhere. Uh, but it is kind of interesting because I don't know if you remember this because I mean you you do a few things for a living and you've had a few marketing conversations. >> The last time you were on the show, we're in the 800s now, but it was in 385 and it was right before the release of season 3 of The Chosen. >> And so to see where we are now versus where we were then. Well, I guess I'll make that the first question because in that first conversation we talked about, you know, your past and how, you know, you went from rocket ship, you're the you're the next the hot thing to going all the way down to the doldrums to building back up. But, you know, season one, not a lot of money. Are we going to be able to finish the season? Then you get into season two, you got momentum. Season three, you really start to hit your stride. And guys, I'm just going to tell you, season 5 was preposterous. It was it was so unbelievably high quality that you're just like you're not going to be embarrassed to show this to your secular friend because it was so high quality. But as you look back right now, it's kind of a grandio way to start, Dallas. You've you've experienced it all. But what does it feel like from your perspective to see the evolution from what you were doing to pull something off in season one versus what you're doing right now post-production season 6? Yeah, I I I know that this is going to sound almost like just like a platitude or the kind of thing that you'd hear from a a self-help guru. Um, but it's genuinely true, which is that the the the state before God that I found myself in after my career failure in 2017 when I didn't know if I was going to make another movie or TV show. And God reached out to me through my wife and through someone I'd never met. You know, it's the the story. I told the story in our first conversation of the message of it's not your job to feed the 5,000. It's only to provide the loaves and fish. Your job is to provide five loaves and two fish. When you hand them to God and he deems them worthy of acceptance, the transaction is over. So when you truly believe that and when you when you get on that plan and and it's why it's the name of our studio now five and two studios is to remind myself to remind our team that over the last seven years since seven eight years since that happened the the growth and opportunity and level of success has been unimaginable but the the principle is the same and when God first shared with me through this individual that I hadn't met. God just told him to tell me this thing about the feeding of the 5000. Uh the tone of voice from the Lord was very encouraging and gentle. It was, "Oh, Dallas, you know, because I was in this low point, right? Oh, Dallas, it's not your job to feed the 5,000, right? The failure is not for you to worry about the fact that it didn't reach the big audience. Your job is to provide that loaves, those loaves and fish." And you did that, right? It was encouraging. Well, now the tone of voice is different. It's it's Dallas. Remember, your job is not to feed the 5,000. It's only to provide the loaves and fish. And so, I truly am in this um posture of surrender and brokenness and humility and five loaves and two fish. Five loaves and two fish. Every day, whatever is in front of us, whether I'm filming or I'm marketing or I'm starting a new project or whatever it is, these are five loaves and two fish. and every time that the project that you know for example recently we released our animated show um right now we're we're filming um a Joseph miniseries about the about Joseph of the Old Testament um whether it's a social media initiative or a big event that we're putting on when we're about to launch it I always remind the team now remember we've this these are our five loaves and two fish we've done the best that we can and so the results now because we believe that we've genuinely done the best that we can we've honored God, we we we have not contradicted the character of Jesus or or the Gospels, then the transaction's over. And I truly mean that. I truly believe that. So, so this is a long answer to your question, but all that to say that when we're filming season 6, which we just finished a month and a half ago, and we know now that this season will probably be viewed by hundreds of millions of people, whereas when we were filming season one, we didn't know if anyone was going to watch. If you visited the set, there's a lot more people, there's a lot more toys, but you would say, and and most people do say this, that the the atmosphere is the same. We still are focused on the work. We're still focused on doing right by God. And the results we don't think about and we don't think about the fact of how many people are going to be watching. It feels the same because um we really do try to keep our head down, hand to plow, focused on the work, focused on getting right and doing the best with what God gives us each day. And the fact that it's bigger now um really doesn't change the the meaning of what and the principle of what guides our entire company. Well, in Dallas, I think it's it's important for people to understand, and I do repeat it quite often, like you could you can control the inputs, but you can't control the outputs. Like, you need to have a mindset of control the controllables. And so, I I approach these shows the exact same way because people ask me all the time, what are your numbers at now? What are your downloads at? And I I honest goodness, I tell them, I have no idea because it's not going to change how I prepare for an interview. It's not going to change how I prepare for a solo episode or a Bible study or something like that. It's just that's not the important thing. It's I told God from the very beginning of this thing, hey, I'm going to work as unto the Lord, unto an audience of one. And if the audience grows beyond one, that's great. And you reminded me, Dallas, of something that Wes Huff said when he came on the show earlier this year, because obviously his profile went from completely unknown a year ago to, you know, maybe the most famous Christian apologist of all time in a very short period of time. But he said every time he gets a cool accolade or a cool invitation to come speak somewhere, a podcast or something like that, he sees it as an opportunity from God to come low, to to bow down, to come low and to say, "God, look at you. You are showing off now. Really, I get to go do this. Really, I get to go speak there. Really, I get to do research in this location." And so, I think carrying that is going to help keep you humble as you kind of go on. But I'm just curious for you, like, you know, I like getting into kind of the nitty-gritty stuff, the stuff that's not great on a on a poster or on a, you know, marketing short, but what have what is the biggest growing pain that you've seen? Because obviously you're going to have a bigger staff. You have more people on set. You're going to have uh, you know, dealing with actors and actresses and they don't always have the reputation for being the easiest people to deal with. And you've got a bunch of other people that got to get their hands in there. What's been the biggest growing pain from beginning to where we are now? Yeah, I mean I think what you you touched on some of them um as you grow even as much as you want to diminish the value of the numbers um you can't ignore them either. I mean, the fact that you managed to ignore them for the most part is impressive, but there comes a point where you you recognize that that advertising is going to, you know, the ad dollars are going to be dependent on the numbers and and sometimes numbers can be a good measurement of of are we on the right track? Um, you know, our social media teams uh are are all, you know, if if we do a post that has that gets no no engagement. Um, we don't beat ourselves up over it, but sometimes we go, okay, does what does this mean? Does this mean that we missed misread the tea leaves about something or the audience doesn't care about this? Should we keep doing it anyway because we're not doing it again for the numbers? Those kinds of things always come up. Um, but when you have a lot of mouths to feed, um, you you look at a cast of of, you know, we have one of the largest casts in the history of television in terms of series regulars, meaning people who are leads or or here every every season. And when you need someone to be on your show every season, you're asking them to commit a large chunk of the year every year, and that takes them off the market for other jobs, right? and and so you have to pay for that and it's it's human nature and it's it's not even a I wouldn't even consider it wrong for the for these actors and crew members and and team team who've been so responsible for the success of the show to look around and go we're one of the biggest shows in the world why aren't we getting paid the same as what we would be getting paid on on a similar show that's from you know a big streamer or whatever and so that that's always present as you know I now I went from like when I was when I did your podcast last the company five and two studios that I founded probably had at the time 10 15 employees tops >> and now we have over 90 >> Wow >> and it's and it's global um we have teams that that and that doesn't include some of our vendors and some of the people that we've hired part-time to manage social media um in in some of these other countries. So the the weight of it, the size of it, even though we're not focused on the results, the the size of our five loaves and two fish are imminently imminently bigger. And that's just a lot to manage. And it's a lot to keep track of. And it's and it's just challenging to keep everyone engaged and happy and and and motivated when not everyone is signed on to the same mission that you were signed on to. Then there's also, I think this is the most obvious one is just what happens when I mean the moment that we launched The Chosen, everything in my personal life and my family's life got immensely harder. We had within the first few months more medical bills than we'd had the previous 20 years combined. Um, as I talk to you right now, we're we're we're dealing with two [snorts] with my wife and my daughter, uh, medical crises um that that aren't going away and that are significant and have been present for a while and um everything that you can think of within my family and within my my personal life um has been challenging. Now my my my marriage is great and all that, but it's like we have just been battered from the moment that this started and the the growth of the show and the increased success and and more money to to be able to live on and and and popularity and all that kind of stuff has not brought with it a a a comfort, a yeah, >> the ability to relax and settle in and and and now we can now we have some margin. it has it has blown past that and and our lives are significantly more difficult and challenged and stressed than they were uh back then. So that's uh and I don't know that that's ever going to change because season 6, the crucifixion season, was the hardest season we've ever had and and both personally and professionally. >> So it's not a complaint. Um, I'm I'm immensely blessed and privileged to be able to do this and uh it's just a it's a reality of of what's happened with the growth of the show. Hey guys, real quick. So, you're there. You're in a small town. You've been invited over to someone's house for dinner. You walk through the kitchen and you get that smell, the smell of home cooking. You go to the back porch where they're grilling or smoking meat and you get that smell and then you get the taste. And you know exactly what I'm talking about, guys. It tastes incredible. The flavors are big and bold. It feels like home and it feels like happiness, right? Well, you try to pull that same thing off at your house, but all you have in your cabinet are some random seasonings from the store, right? And many of these big companies just make bland blends. And we all know this by now. Bland blends lead to bland food. And bland food leads to a bad food experience. And I don't want you to guys to have any bad food experiences. That's why I want to remind you about my friends at G's Seasoning. G's Seasoning is a small family-owned and operated seasoning company from a small town in rural Texas. The recipe for their flagship all-purpose seasoning has been passed down in their family, and now they're passing it on to you. And I've used G's allpurpose seasoning on beef, pork, wild game. It's really, really awesome on elk, by the way, chicken, fish, eggs, veggies, and yes, yes, the daddy hack of all daddy hacks, popcorn. And also, I'm super, super pumped for this. They have a brand new seasoning out now, salt and pepper blend. So, it's a classic seasoning duo, right? But G's has leveled it up. So, G's a salt and pepper blend uses two different grains of topshelf flake salt and two different grinds of hand cracked black pepper to give you the bold flavor you're looking for. And I've used it so far on brisket and burgers. And dude, amazing. So, throw out all of your bland big box store seasonings. Support a small town American family business by going to gezseasoning.com. That's gsseasoning.com. And guys, if you're looking for a stocking stuffer for this Christmas season, these bottles fit really well into your average stocking. So guys, get a case of them. Give them out to all your family members. Give them out to all the people at the office. Again, that's gezseasoning.com. That's golfierseasoning.com. Order today. One, Dallas, it's a reminder to Christians especially that this idea that you become a Christian and things just get easy and you just have this really cool chill life. It's like, man, you just you sound very biblically illiterate at this point, man. I talk about being at the tip of the spear like with what you do in your space. What I do in the podcast and speaking men's space, we're [snorts] at the tip of the spear. And so, even if you have your shield up, the flaming darts of the enemy are coming at you. And if they miss you and your shield, they're going to hit someone that you love that's standing next to you, right? And so I warn guys that are part of my inner circle here or any contractor that I hire or something like that. I'm like, "Hey man, even if no one finds out you work for me, you're going to get some arrows because or if you were, you know, kind of stuck in the mud or stuck in neutral as a man and now you're getting like you're in the game because of, you know, something you heard me say or something you heard one of my guests say, it's like, bro, all right, the arrows are flying over your head, but if you're sitting on the couch, you're good to go. You're standing up now. So now we got to be ready to go. We need Ephesians 6. We need the the full armor of God." But I've been probably most excited, Dallas, in the because we haven't, you know, spoken publicly in the last few years. We've just spoken privately to ask you about this. So, I've kind of held off asking about this until this moment. So, here we go. Back on the episode we did, episode 385, I asked you, are you going to show the clearing of the temple? And you just smirked at me, right? You didn't even show me your teeth like you're doing now. You just kind of smirked. And and I talked about how I've been very disappointed in depictions of that particular scene, of that particular historical event, which I believe happened twice. Once at the beginning of his ministry, once at the end of his ministry, depends on which archaeologist you you you know, believe in, >> right? >> But I was so worried be because all the other things I've seen, it's kind of this wispy-haired Danish guy just kind of going over and like sadly tipping over tables and I can't believe y'all are making me do this. And it's just like, oh my gosh, that's not the Lion of Judah. What are y'all doing? And all I can't remember exactly what you said verbatim, but you're basically like, Kyle, I think you'll be happy with what you see. You didn't say yes and you didn't tell me how. And then we get to it, right? And this wasn't just like, you know, a random scene that is jammed into a single episode. This was an arc of several episodes that showed the premeditated righteous violent aggression that Jesus was planning to use whenever he came to clear the temple. And so just give the audience an idea because man that's read me for my audience big time and they were thrilled as as I was. But why spend so much time focusing on that? Because some people would be like, "Oh yeah, it's a story in Jesus's life, but it's not a big one." But it was so central to how I understand Jesus as both lamb and lion. So I was thrilled with how y'all did it. So take me behind the decision-making process on pulling it off that way. Well, when w with every story that we do from the Bible, um we want to give it appropriate context. That's the whole purpose of the show is that you take these stories from scripture that cover maybe just a handful of verses and and out of context, historical context, Jewish context, um and even biblical context, you know, the Bible um the Bible affirms itself, right? like the Bible. You you want to learn more about the Bible, read the full Bible and and you know, some of these passages that out of context are very confusing make a lot more sec more sense when you uh when you when you read them in the context of the Bible, but especially when you get historical and cultural context. So all of the stories that we tell that are from the Bible, we try to build an arc uh before, during, and after them. Uh a because it just helps you understand those stories better, but just like a good pastor will do. I mean, no p some some of the people who criticize the show who say, uh, you're adding to scripture. You shouldn't say anything more than just what scripture is. I'm like, what what about your church? Your pastor doesn't just get up and read the Bible and then just sit down and say, well, you know what? Scripture is all we need, so I'm not going to say anything more. The pastor unpacks the packs unpacks it, gives it context. And yes, sometimes even says, now imagine this. You you have to assume that at this time these people would have been saying this and that. So, we're giving we're giving a an arc. So that that's one reason. The second reason is just drama. I mean you you you want to give a beginning, middle and end. You want to give motivation for what's happening. And so with uh with this particular story, Jesus behaving in such a unique way, you don't see often in the gospels or in our show. Jesus being so angry, not just upset or sad, which we see multiple times, but actually angry and physically expressive in his anger and including destruction. So there is physical destruction in his anger to to just kind of go and then he went to the temple and then he turned everything over like what most Bible projects do would have been very confusing. So we wanted to give you the backstory of of what led him to that anger. Um and we show that in episode one of of season 5 to kind of show the building frustration that he has the historical context of the past, the present and the future. Jesus has a a vision of the of the future that portends what Jerusalem is headed towards. And so, um, we all thought that that that was important to portray. Um, but also, yes, Jesus was protecting his father's house. He's a good son. He is uh take he's taking it personally as he should. And so he's behaving in a way that is a responsive to what he's seeing, but it is also on the offensive. He is in many ways intentionally stirring the reactions of the religious leaders to get a result that has been foretold, right? that his father sent him to earth to die to sacrifice for the people while he's there to be dropping many huge breadcrumbs along the way so that when he resurrects people and his followers can look back and go, "Oh, he was predicting this. This is what he meant by that." He even says in scripture and in our show a lot of the things I'm doing right now and saying you're not going to understand, but I'm doing them so that when these predictions come to pass, these four prophecies come to pass, you will know that it was I who orchestrated this. My father who orchestrated this. So all of that plays into it. Um and then we just get to, you know, kick a little a I don't know if you're allowed to say the a word on your podcast. >> You can say whatever you want to say. Yeah. But but uh but to show Jesus, you know, he he's he's he this was not a random act. Uh he he had this loaded up. He as the scriptures said, he fashioned the whip. So it's not like he just grabbed something that was there because he just was out of control. He took the time to get this right, to make a statement. And uh and so we wanted to have I don't I don't know if fun is the right word, but we wanted to we wanted to uh to to have a little fun with this and and really show this side of Jesus that hadn't really been fully explored before. And then we show the after effects, right? We show how the religious leaders reacted. And yes, all the also the disciples. The disciples, the men following him are confused. >> Yeah. >> Did he hurt anybody? Well, he didn't hurt anybody, but he did some things that caused some people to be hurt. Why isn't he unifying? Why is he so divisive? Well, he said that he would be divisive. Well, yeah, but he's supposed to be the Messiah. Messiah is supposed to unify everybody against the oppressors. Oh, wait. He's he's act he's attacking our own, not the not the Romans. You know, all that stuff that I think we would face today, the questions we'd face today, we we tried to accurately explore and portray and not just shy away from that. >> When I think just the images, the the images burned in my brain. I believe the shot was like over the uh Pharisees shoulder and you can just see Jesus standing there, Jonathan standing there uh defiantly with the whip in his hand. Um and I mean Jonathan Roomy's performance uh of that entire setting was just incredible cuz again you had so much leadup and it was the anguish the anguish that he felt at what was going on in the temple and then what he was doing. And I think that's a really good point that you brought up, Dallas, like this was not a wild man that did a wild thing, right? This was very calculated, very measured. And the my joke that I always say when I go somewhere and I talk about the story, I was like, we have no evidence to suggest that Jesus conceal carried, right? That he always had a whip on his hip ready to go, it said he left and made a whip of cords and came back, right? And so I think that that's that's very important. But you did bring up uh some, you know, I guess you could call some of the comments that come from the haters or different people that say you're adding to scripture. So, there's been a couple of things that have come up really in the last couple of years. There's one that I don't really understand the complaint and there's one where I do understand the complaint. The one that we've already talked about that I don't really understand is but but that's not scripture complaints. These are the same people that don't, you know, complain about the anecdotes, the personal anecdotes that the pastor says, right? So, a pastor might read two or three verses and then it's 45 minutes personal anecdotes, but then they don't want to listen to the watch the chosen because they're like, that's not in the Bible. It's like, okay, well, you know, the core things that are in the Bible, if the chosen starts changing them, yes, we need to hold them to account. Sure, let's boycott, let's do all the things. Let's yell at Dallas. I'm fine with that. But it's like, that's not what's happening. They're trying to help you understand the setting better. But then on the other side, I don't know how long, a year or two ago, there was a picture that came out of the pride flag that was on one of the the camera people's rigs. And you and I talked about this privately. I kept our private conversations to just between you and I. and you kind of gave me your explanation as to why you you came out the way you did and the commentary that you gave. And so, whatever you would like to share with our audience, because I remember for some people in the audience, they they're busy. They got things going on. They oh, okay, we'll get to watching the chosen eventually. And then they're like, well, wait, but they're not they're not scriptural. It's like, well, no, no, no. It's like they're scriptural, but they're they're adding to it. And then they're like, well, wait a minute. What about the pride flag on set? They they're okay with that, but what if it was a Nazi flag? What if it was a Trump flag? Would they have, you know, gotten that offset quickly and immediately? So, here's another chance because I know you've never done it, Dallas. Address the haters. Address the con the truly concerned individuals that have a a God's honest concern in their heart where maybe they feel convicted if they were to watch your show. >> Sure. Well, uh, one thing I want to say about the adding to scripture is your Bible has not changed since The Chosen came out. Uh, the Bible is scripture. Um, I I I was a Bible major in college. I've been raised in the faith my whole life. I love the Bible. I believe is the perfect word of God. Um it should not change. It's it's superior. Uh we don't need the chosen to make the Bible come to life. The Bible is already alive. >> Um the chosen has for literally millions of people around the world, most likely tens of millions of people. We've heard from hundreds of thousands of them personally and then there's more that have told us about others that they've heard from and ministries that talk about this that um their relationship with the Bible and their love of the Bible and their understanding of the Bible has increased dramatically since watching the chosen the American Bible. >> Can I I just want to interrupt you there because I want to give you something that you personally did for me. So please don't lose your train of thought. >> Sure. the the story in the Bible, the woman with the problem of blood is this many lines, right? It's it's four or five lines in whatever synoptic you read. >> That was like a three episode arc, I believe, in season 3, if I if I remember correctly. >> And I can barely talk about that story now without getting upset and getting weepy cuz it never occurred to me, right, >> what this woman would have to go through. She wasn't just on her period for 12 years or, you know, she was ritually unclean for this entire period of time. She was outside of society. She likely hadn't seen her family in a very long period of time. She was completely ostracized. >> And where was Jesus going during this time period? I can't remember if it was 12 12-year-old or 14year-old or the the problem of blood was 12 or 14 years, but going to save Gyrus's daughter, okay, who was the same age as the length of time that this woman had had the problem with blood. What do you want to bet that problem of blood started when that girl was born? Right? And so what it did is it slowed down Bible reading for me as a highly conscientious got to get it done. Got to check the box. Got to do my daily reading guy to be like, "Oh my gosh, this woman, this poor woman, this was everything to her. This wasn't just fighting through the crowd to have a shot at you meeting a celebrity. This was everything." And so the way y'all handled and packaged that helped me individually, and I know it's helped other people. Sorry to interrupt, but I thought that was important. Yeah. >> Yeah. No, no. Yeah. And that's that's happened for lots and lots of the Bible stories of, "Oh, I'd never considered this before. I never understood it before." Or, "Oh, now when I read it, it it it's in color as opposed to black and white, and it makes more sense to me." Um, the American Bible Society re, you know, does their yearly uh research and and and uh studies about Bible reading, Bible purchases. Um, and just last year they reported that Bible sales are up 20% in the last couple of years. And in their first paragraph of their study and and their their their uh released analysis mentioned the chosen as a significant factor in the increase in Bible sales. Um, so if if the chosen was replacing the Bible, if I was suggesting that I was delivering kind of a fifth gospel or or or a new found understanding that had previously not been found and I'm going to deliver God's truth through the chosen, uh, that would be a problem. Um, and and I'm sure there's a handful of people for whom uh, the chosen has become part of their understanding of the Bible, maybe independent from the Bible. And I I'm sure there's exceptions to the to the rule that we've seen, but but overwhelmingly as in 100 to one, the stories are I'm reading my Bible more than ever. Um, and I understand the Bible more and because of that, um, a as for some of the personal or kind of the off camera things like the pride flag or uh the connection to PE that I work with people who are from the Mormon faith um or atheists or whatever that people are that are involved in the show. Um, so just quickly, I do hope that people who hear things like this out of context or they see a YouTube headline or um or watch a YouTube video from someone else that before they at least publicly make some comment or are sharing with others their comments about me or the show that they would do at least the honor of of their own research. And almost every single topic that they've heard, I have addressed in detail in some way. So, you just going to The Chosen's YouTube channel or doing a search for Dallas Jenkins comments on Mormon or comments on Pride Flag or whatever. It's easy to find. Um, so I hope that they'll do that. But just briefly for now, um, I don't have a religious litmus test for the people who will work on my show. Um, I'm responsible 100% for the content. No one has input into the content, but when it comes to the cast and the crew, about half of our cast and crew, if not more, are not traditional believers. um they come from all walks of life. Um my job is to I I have a mission for the show. I have a goal for the show. Anyone who is capable of helping me get that uh is is worthy of of working on this show. And um so one of our camera operators uh on his own personal equipment had a 3-in pride flag patch. Um and we don't police what people have on their own personal equipment. If I had a job somewhere else and I wanted to put a cross or a or a what would Jesus do or a fish symbol on my computer, a sticker, I would be upset. I'm sure most of your audience would be. And we would probably have a public debate about it if if some boss said you can't have that or that's offensive or whatever. And so for someone to have on their own personal equipment their own expression of themselves, um that's not aggressive, that isn't uh insulting anybody around them, um we just don't have an issue with that. And this employee is one of one of our hardest workers and and best employees and is uh I've met his parents and and he just loves the show and is extremely uh does an extraordinary job. And so uh we you mentioned well you would would you allow a Nazi symbi [laughter] symbol but but we do have we do have MAGA shirts and hats and and flags on our on our uh on our crew. Um, I have made a statement from the beginning that to all the cast and crew, your own personal social media, you can do whatever you want. Um, we have people on our cast who've said things politically, who've supported candidates politically that I wouldn't align with and some of our audience would align wouldn't align with. They've gotten in trouble for some of that with some of the audience. And I've said, "We're not doing this. We're not doing cancel culture. We're not doing what we've complained about. I'm a conservative. I'm a Christian for years. We've been complaining about the public sphere um restricting or diminishing or cancelling or complaining about people that come from our background. And uh I don't want to I don't want to do the same thing. So um the show speaks for itself. The content speaks for itself. Uh we're not broadcasting or publicizing or pushing forward any kind of agenda, but on our own personal sets, on our own personal lives, on our own personal social medias, um I I just don't uh police that. It's just just not the the approach that we wanted to take. And we've used the show as an opportunity for many cast and crew to understand Jesus more to to be in relationship with um my my wife and me in a way that points people towards Jesus. And we've had multiple cast and crew members become closer to Christ or even give their lives over to Christ as a result of working on the show. So that's the approach that we have. I would have just hope that people would and people may disagree with me on on their approach and that's perfectly fine. I would hope that you would at least a let the show speak for itself and b um before you speak publicly or engage in in kind of the typical social media comment back and forth that you at least do your research and make sure you have clarity on the on the on the issues. >> When I remember Dallas when I had Noah James on the show uh this was maybe before you were on the show um you know he plays Andrew and I I think at the time I don't know what he would consider now. I kind of asked him about, you know, his his faith journey. And I, you know, I think he I'm trying to remember, uh, ethnically Jewish, uh, but kind of Christ curious, whatever that means. And so, but just not a Christian, not a Southern Baptist, not a Calvinist, not a whatever box that you would prefer to be checked. And so, some people would think, okay, if we were doing this strictly on like ideological or theological purity test, well, he is not able to play Andrew. Um, and so I I just don't quite see it that way because believe me, I've got some things that I am completely black and white on when it comes to theology, ideology, like how we perform in the public square, culturally, politically, all the things. But it's like, if y'all were only able to find people to work on the show that met your personal theological, like, hey, are there people that are all millennial postmillennial premillennial, or atheists? Right? We got four categories of people. Pick a category, and that's the people that we're going to work with. I don't know that it's it's actually realistic and it's what is the goal and is what we're doing in place of the goal. The one thing that I would say and then we'll we'll move past the the haters or the the the concerned commenters or whatever because those are two different kinds of people is there are people that the pride flag being on the set may [clears throat] as well have been a Nazi flag. It's that offensive to them because because of the ideologies they're in. The pride flag itself has six stripes. The rainbow doesn't. It has seven. Seven's the number of perfection. Six the number of imperfection. There's a lot in there, right, that you could go into. And so it's that guttural feeling of like, oh no, they were on our team and then they went crazy. It's kind of the what people are currently going through with Kanye. They were like, all right, Kanye's terrible. He's a rapper. He's awful. Wait, he's wearing a MAGA hat. I love him. Oh, he made a gospel album. This is incredible. Oh no, he made a song praising Hitler. Shoot. And so you kind of ride the wave and you lived with the Kanye. Now you're dying by the Kanye. It sounds like y'all are trying to let the art speak for itself. And again, the mission of what y'all are trying to do as as a group, but also going back to your individual mission that you got from God, none of that has seemed to change based on the people that you've hired or fired or contracted to work with you. So, let's talk season six. So, as you've already mentioned about uh 6 weeks ago, you've wrapped production on season 6. I think most people at this point know that season 6 is where we are getting into the last few days of Jesus's life. We will see his public execution. We will see his resurrection. And then I've just seen reports, but I'll just let you clear the air on it. Reports that there's going to be an episodic season 6 that culminates with a major motion picture finale of some kind that will also eventually be a part of the release for streaming and all the different things. And so clear that up for me because I've gotten uh varying, you know, announcements out there. But overall, Dallas, just what can fans expect from season 6? Yeah. So, the first six episodes are coming to streaming in the latter part of 2026. So, that's, you know, working on them as as we speak, editing and all of that. And then typically, you'd have episodes seven and eight. And we wrote the finale of season 6. Um, we we we combined two episodes into one. Now that um meaning uh instead of what we sometimes do when we do a theatrical release is we you know we write individual episodes and then we put them together just back toback and we release them in theaters. Well this this wasn't written as two separate episodes that we're just putting together. We wrote it a a as with a film structure in mind. Um, so typically, you know, each individual episode of The Chosen H has its own world and its own feel and its own beginning, middle, and end. Um, we wrote the finale as a fulllength feature uh, structure. And so the first six episodes are going to come out in the latter part of 2026. And then the big, you know, superers sized finale is going to come out. It's going to debut in theaters all over the world in uh early 2027 as a standalone, meaning it's going to be released um in in multiple, you know, well over a dozen languages all over the world. Uh whereas previously it's, you know, we've released them different times because it takes time to get all these translations done. So, um, that's going to be a standalone film, the the the chosen crucifixion. Um, people could watch that without having seen the show. We we'd prefer that they have watched the show before, but there's always increased attention towards the crucifixion, uh, especially globally. Um, and so we believe that that's an opportunity for people who maybe haven't caught up to to still appreciate it and to still enjoy this this uh story as a standalone story, but it definitely still fits within the context of the chosen show. So, six episodes coming to streaming, then the feature film, you know, coming out uh all over the world and then that'll also be released to streaming as well. Um, but both the crucifixion story and the resurrection story that that I don't I don't want to spoil it for you, but Jesus does come back. Uh, that happens. Yeah. Yeah, I know. It's It's crazy. But uh in season 7 we'll do a similar uh approach where we'll release it as a fulllength feature film structure and it's going to be kind of the launch of our seventh season. Um so it's just a uh we always do things a little bit different, a little bit unique. Um but it's still going to be season 6 is still a full season. Um it's just the structure of the of the finale is a little different than normal. So, obviously a lot of people have already kind of put this together now, especially since you've said the timeline. There seems to be another resurrection double movie thing happening in early 2027 that's already been announced by a little fellow named Mel Gibson. You know, I don't know if anyone's ever heard of him, but this is going to kind of be right in that timeline. Obviously, y'all aren't working together on this. These are separate projects covering, you know, similar events, that type of thing. Any consternation because it shouldn't be competitive, guys. But you people are automatically going to do that. There's automatically going to be comparisons. They're going to take the double release from from Mel Gibson and they're going to add it to the Passion of the Christ and then they're going to compare it basically to season 5, season 6, and then this kind of like finale episode to one another. What What's the feeling there? [sighs] >> I mean, there's some consternation for sure when it comes to, you know, audience confusion or you don't want to be cannibalizing each other. I I've met Mel. He's he visited the set um two seasons ago. He he's a believer. He's he's going to he wants to honor Christ. I have zero uh resistance to or competition towards him or his projects. Um his resurrection movie, it's going to be two-part, does come out around Easter time of 2027. Uh we are are are now planning to release our crucifixion movie um earlier than that. We were originally thinking around a similar time. Once he kind of staked his claim for that period, we thought, yeah, let's not let's not be in each other's way. We will be at some point. Um, but there's plenty to go around. Um, you know, audiences see multiple movies all the time. Uh, there's nothing wrong with seeing um a crucifixion movie from me and a resurrection movie from from Mel. Uh, they're both going to be uh I I believe I I hope um that they're both going to be honoring to God and to scripture. Um, I know mine will be and I'm sure his will be as well. And so, um, you know, obviously you hope that it doesn't diminish the impact, um, or the opportunity for either project, but hopefully, um, it just means more more Jesus in theaters all over the world. And there's nothing wrong with that. >> Amen. Amen. Uh the question that does come up for me that is raised from his work obviously with the passion of the Christ that came out so long ago is people were absolutely shocked by two things. First of all that it had an R rating. They were absolutely shocked by that. And then it became very apparent whenever you got into the movie with the elongated scenes of the brutal flogging of Jesus and the absolutely in-your-face brutal upclose uh you know [snorts] description and depiction I guess rather of the crucifixion. And so a lot of people obviously knew where this was marching where seasons of the chosen were going to be marching to. And you've already filmed it and so you pretty much have a good idea of what's going to be shown and what it's going to look like. But in terms of the brutality, me personally, you can't understand the cross of Christ without the brutality of the crucifixion. They they go hand in hand. So if you sanitize it or do a little bit of ketchup on the forehead and with the fully clothed actor, yeah, it's it's just not really the same thing. I think it plays into the entirety of what we need to understand as fully depraved, black-hearted sinners. Like what had to happen in order for the, you know, sin debt to be paid to a holy and just God. So, what can fans expect in terms of the actual depiction of the crucifixion? >> Yeah, there's two things to consider. One is um I do have more tools in my tool belt approaching the crucifixion than than previous depictions have had. And by that I mean because we've had five seasons of character development. Um, I don't need to be quite as brutal and bloody as some other depictions have been or what a documentary would be in order to communicate the devastation and the pain and the weight of all of this. Because just looking at Mother Mary or Mary Magdalene or John the Apostle or any of Jesus's followers, uh, observing what he's going through is that that alone is going to be brutal to people. Um we are in a business that is you know our movies and television are not documentaries um that there is always going to be a certain artifice just by the nature of it. Um so you want to find that middle ground between pure reality which which you you can't even sustain in the course of a movie and Jonathan of course isn't literally going through what Jesus went through. And so there there's the farthest end of the spectrum which is where Mel approached which is just pure pure brutality for a long period of time. Um and I'm just not I just don't believe that that serves actually even the story. I think it could be so distracting in some ways that you could be you're not even you're not even really emotional about it. You're not even really comprehending or understanding or thinking about the spiritual ramifications of it because you're just so your eyes are just being so brutalized by it. So, um I do believe that there are ways to communicate this and and and give all of the the things that you just said, the weight of it, the pain of it, all that without having to be quite so gory. Um on the other hand, like you said, to be sanitizing it to just to make it PG or to to diminish its import would be a grave mistake as well. There's another thing that I want to address too, which is that in my research for this. Um, there is there there's also a range of of accuracy when it comes to I've seen some videos even that have been released where people are like Mel Gibson's portrayal was a fraction of what it really was. And and I remember seeing reading some things and seeing some things of like the the the belief that for example he literally had to to push himself up with just the weight of his his the nails in his wrists um to to to to breathe. Um that that his intestines were laid bare that he some of these things that I think have become traditionally assumed but actually when you do the the full research aren't totally accurate. Um, that's not to diminish the unbelievable, disgusting, horrifying torture that he went through, but um, there are some things that we're like, yes, [clears throat] this isn't even this wouldn't even be accurate to to portray. Um, and and would would he wouldn't even be able to talk. He wouldn't be able to none of this would be to would would make sense if if it was quite what some people are are thinking that it might have been. So, the the portrayal that we've ultimately done, I firmly believe is going to be very I mean, it's it's very brutal. It's very upsetting. Um, watching it being filmed was was um for for the cast and for myself, the hardest thing we've ever done emotionally. I I had I had my first in my entire career moment where I had to step away from everybody and just weep for five minutes. I mean, it was it's extremely intense. It's extremely brutal. There is a lot of blood. Um, but it's not it's not torture porn either. Um, it's not we don't go as far as Mel did. Um, um, but we also don't go as soft as a PG-rated TV project that is just trying to show sweet Jesus um, you know, kind of solemnly uh, taking on our sins and and and uh, and and kind of walking his way through it. It's it's going to be extremely extremely brutal and um, but yet also it's the greatest act of love in history. And so we want to we want to portray that as well. >> Well, I appreciate the clarification and and I remember when I read Eugenia Constantinu's book, she's an Eastern Orthodox writer. It's called The Crucifixion of the King of Glory. I feel like I learned so much about crucifixion at that time. And even just the little nuances that are going to be almost impossible to pick up on watching a a movie or something like that. But the the pain receptors along the the the hairline of a human being are some of the most sensitive if not if not the most sensitive pain receptors and nerve endings on the entire body. And so when the acacia thorns, which again we we've seen these little these little bitty thorns, this crown of thorns, it's like no acacia thorns can be 2, three, 4 in long. And when that's jammed down onto that part of the body, the the excruciating nature of that pain would be almost impossible to describe. But one thing that you also talked about is the emotions that y'all felt because obviously there's emotions when you work with someone for so many years. You spend that amount of time together. Uh you know, some people they're they're either written off the show or they leave the show or they you know their character arc has closed or some whatever the thing is. But even just the pictures watching some of the actors watching what's happening to Jonathan, right? and everyone knows it's not really happening to him, but they're having to think about the fact that this actually happened to a real historical person named Jesus, whether they've put their faith in that Jesus or not. And you know, you walking away from the set to go weep for a while, like man, that's like the least surprising thing you could have told me that you had to do like watching something like this happen. But just talk to me about that. Like were you all expecting that level of emotion like real not just on camera tears but the real emotion from the actors that were having to really go through and witness this? >> Yeah, we we always said, "Oh, it's going to be tough." uh you know we we always dreaded it to some extent but we weren't prepared for like for example the first day that Jonathan came onto set with the blood and the crown of thorns. We we filmed um him him being dragged through the streets first. We filmed that actually before he was on the cross before the scourging. So this is post scourging. Um this is now him carrying the cross through the the street. It was the first time the first thing that we filmed of his of of [clears throat] that kind of journey of of torture in many ways. And when he showed up, all of us kind of had a collective, you know, gasp of and it and it felt real. I I I was very shaken. Jonathan was shaken that some of the actors just were immediately started to cry. Um and and so we weren't quite prepared for that. I think when we were filming in Italy, we didn't know how brutal it was going to be. We were thinking how beautiful the setting was and how right the setting was for for what we needed to film. But then we got there and the the culture shock, the the crew not speaking English, the heat, the the the the elements, the the mountain that we were filming on the hill that was so rocky and uneven and and uncomfortable and being away from our families and um and then going through all of that and then filming Jonathan as Jesus being tortured and screaming and and then the actors having to cry every take a and having to find the emotion and the pain over and over and over again every day for a long period of time, weeks at a time. Um, it was traumatic for sure. And um, so I I believe God wanted us to have a little bit of a sacrifice for this season, a little bit of a taste. We'll never fully fully come close to grasping what Jesus went through. But I think some of the suffering that we've gone through just in our again in my own personal life during this season and then the challenges of the set I think were kind of a baked in to the to to the nature of of what we do into this season. So it was for sure bonding but yeah I mean it was it was painful and I believe you're going to experience that watching it for sure how painful it was. Um, but in the midst of it, there are still I mean there I'll just very quickly share, you know, there's a a scene that we wrote where the Apostle John and and Mary Magdalene approach the cross and and just in their confusion to say to Jesus, "Why does it have to be like why are you doing this? Why like we we we you you've told us that you're going to go through this, so we're we're trusting you, but why does it have to be so painful? Why do you have to be why this way?" you know, and and Jesus reminds them of the prophecies in Isaiah of of being wounded for our sins and by his stripes, by his torture, we are healed. And that the chastisement of him brought about peace. And so, he's mentioning peace and healing and they're and they're saying, "We don't understand. This doesn't make sense." And and and and John says, "This isn't peace." And Jesus says, "Not yet." And and at one point they they say, "We don't understand." hand and and J Jesus says you will. And that that whole concept of being in the midst of pain and and confusion and suffering and and being told or trusting that God will eventually redeem it and that there will eventually be peace and healing when you don't see it as a human being. That's what faith is. That's where the trust comes in. And that's in many ways the theme of the season is can you trust and and have faith even when you don't understand and even when you're suffering um to to know that even the suffering is coming from a good God. That's a that's very challenging and I think this season and and what Jesus went through personally allows us to to really wrestle with that more than for some of us we ever have. Um, not only why does why does God allow suffering, which is a question that all human beings ask, but then why did why did God go through it? Why did he why did he allow himself to go through the worst kind of suffering? Um, that's a that's a that messes with your mind, but but but is where faith comes into play. And I think we explore that uh this season in in what I think will be a very profound way. >> So, that's season six. Now, we look forward to season 7, which I believe is the final season of The Chosen. Just thinking timelinewise without giving anything away. Obviously, if you want the real timeline, guys, go to your Bibles. But does season 7, does this end? Are we in the middle of the Acts of the Apostles at this point? Is Jesus still uh on on this planet? Is Jonathan Roomie a part of season 7? Or is it like, no, we're we're doing crucifixion, resurrection, and he's going to hang out for a while, and then he's going to zip zap up to the sky, and then we're just going to, you know, everyone's going to be here confused for a little while, and then the Holy Spirit comes out. Like, what? Give us a timeline of what we can expect there. Well, I won't give the exact timeline, but uh but no, we as as we always do with the show, we take what in scripture is a handful of verses and we take our time to explore some of the context. So, yes, Jesus will be in season 7. You know, there's the resurrection, there's what happens after the resurrection. He was on Earth for 40 days. Um uh encountered multiple uh people. There's plenty of stories to to mine uh that we'll be covering in season 7. Um he will the the show when the show ends Jesus will no longer be with us. Uh he he will have have ascended. Um but uh we'll we'll take our time to to to really explore the aftermath of the resurrection. What that means for the for the apostles, what that means for the enemies of Jesus, uh what that means for uh you know their understanding and and then when Jesus ultimately sends them off to go into all the world and preach the gospel. um what they're what they're preaching. What is the gospel that they're preaching? It's not just the crucifixion. It's not just his teachings, it's eternal life. And um and so they they they need to kind of make sense of that before they go. So we we need to make sure we cover all of that. And uh I have already announced that we'll eventually be doing a follow-up show that that gets into the book of Acts and and the birth of the early church. So we'll we'll touch on a few things in season 7, but uh but I won't give away exactly how we how we end it. Don't worry guys, he'll tell me off air and then I'll tell you in the outro. Don't worry. Uh but I do want to get into the life after The Chosen because obviously there was always going to be an end uh to the series. There was always going to be something to do after that. You've already talked about the animated series, The Chosen Adventures, which is on Amazon. It's hilarious. By the way, the little uh you know, sheep guy. He's probably my my favorite character. He's just absolutely preposterous. But then you mentioned it earlier, the Joseph series. We were sitting around here at the forging table, you know, going through Genesis and we're reading Joseph's story and we're like, why has no one done like an like an episodic series about this dude's life? And then like two weeks later, there was the announcement that y'all were doing it. Uh well, let's actually talk about that cuz we're we're sort of winding to a close here. My understanding is that the Joseph series is going to basically be like you could call it either a miniseries or just a one season, you know, show or something like that. And my very first thought is how how in the world are they going to do all the stuff that happened to Joseph over that time period which was decades in one like series you know eight episodes or 10 episodes or something like that. So let's talk about the Joseph series and where are we at in the production of that. >> Well I think that an eight episode miniseries about Joseph is significantly better and more expansive than what we've seen before. Right. Previously, it's tried to cover the whole story in a in a single movie or in a Sunday school lesson or in a sermon or even just a handful of sermons. I mean, my church right now is literally going through the story of Joseph over the course of of uh, you know, a month and a half or so. Um, covering, you know, each sermon is covering a chapter of that story. Um, we do, I think, explore more of this story than has ever been portrayed on on film. Um, so yeah, there's got to be there's there's always some passage of time that you have to to wrestle with. The story of Joseph is is is a is a strange one in that it it covers more ground than almost any story in in the entire Bible. Uh when when we started to do the research for we're like, man, this is Genesis covers a lot uh of of Joseph. Uh but within that there's like and then seven years went by and and and yada yada yada and you're like, wow, that's that's a big time jump there. So we've got to wrestle with that a little bit. But right now it's filming. I was just on set last week. I'm not the showrunner director of this particular project. It it started filming while we were still filming um the what we call the mothership show of the chosen universe [snorts] which is the current chosen season seasons that I'm working on. I'm overseeing it. I'm the final I'm the final say. Um you know I'm ultimately responsible for it. But we have two directors that are handling it. We had a another writer that that did the bulk of the work of the writing um with our my contributions still still there. But I'm really excited about it. It's really um you know as as the chosen as want to do. We we we really dig into the character motivations. It's not as just black and white as you like to hear in a Sunday school lesson. We show that Joseph had some things to learn himself. He had some there were reasons why his brothers um weren't happy with him. The brothers weren't just all evil and Joseph all good. Uh you you you start to realize when you explore the stories of Jacob that that as listed as one of the heroes of the faith, Jacob was quite a quite a rough dude. Um he made some horrible decisions and was not a great father and was not a great husband. Um which is hard to kind of wrestle with when you uh when you dig into the story. And we have to portray all that while still recognizing that he uh was was honored by God as a hero of the faith. And so there's a lot to wrestle with, but I'm I'm I'm really excited about. The casting is awesome. Uh the writing, all of it we're really we're really excited about. And so uh we're working on that. Like you said, The Chosen Adventures now out on Prime on Mino. If you're a parent who doesn't want your kids, uh navigating through other streaming platforms. Minnow is a very safe one that that has the Chosen Adventures on it. Now, um we're going to start releasing one episode a month on YouTube. So we, as always, want to make it as accessible as possible. But yeah, there's 14 episodes, 11 minutes a piece that not only are great for your kids and for families, but even as adults, we like you said, we we included some humor, some things that even adults can appreciate. Uh we're developing um when I finish The Chosen, the seventh season of The Chosen. I'm going to take a little bit of time maybe to do another project, but then when I come back, I want to do um the story of Moses, a threeseason um uh you know, show about the the the life of Moses, and then get back into the book of Acts and kind of follow up on the chosen. So, we got a lot in the hopper. We got the Bear Grill show that's chosen in the wild that's coming out next year. Lots going on. Um we're trying to maintain um one project at a time, kind of this, you know, really focusing on quality as much as possible. But at the same time, there's an opportunity that the world is wanting and that people are willing to finance uh the the ability to to to tell Bible stories from people who love the Bible. And just, you know, a couple weeks ago, you go on to Prime Video and in the top 10 TV shows, three of them, there's The Chosen Adventures, our animated show. There's The Chosen, and then there's House of David, you know, from my from from Wonder Project, one of the projects that I'm I'm involved in as well. All God-honoring, Bible honoring shows that are uh that are reaching mass appeal around the world, and that's an extraordinary time to be part of. >> I love it. Well, we got to wrap up, but here we are. You're talking about the chosen. We got Joseph. We got Moses. We got the Acts of the Apostles. And there's no shortage of other places you can go. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Noah, Nehemiah Samson Gideon Elijah Daniel, whatever. But we need to break some news on this podcast, Alice. I mean, come on. I've just like I've carried you along. I've dragged you through this interview. I tried to make I tried to shine you up as best I could. Just got to break some news here. What's that other one? So, yeah. Yeah. Let's look in the p. Let's look in the future, rather. You got Moses in the bag, right? The three seasons of Moses. You got the Acts of the Apostles. Everyone's tired of seeing anything from those people. What's that next one? What's that next one? Where's the universe going to expand? >> I I will say that one of the men people that you mentioned, uh, we are developing a show right now, but but it's not officially green lit yet, meaning we're we we we really do things one step at a time. So, we're we've we're we're about to close a deal with a writer and and and we're going to be developing this uh series about one of the people that you mentioned in that list. And uh when it's official, when we know that we're actually going to do it, uh I will let you know for sure. Well, and that's the problem with how my brain works. I mentioned about 110 billion things all at once and people because that's just the way my does it rhyme with schmson is that if I take a guess is it does it No, you don't. I mean, you can just say yes. You can just give me a thumbs up. >> It's not it's it's not it's not Samson. I'll say that. But but uh it's it's it's one of the other ones that you mentioned. >> All right. Well, Dallas, I really appreciate your time and you getting into all the detail with us, but that's all for me. Is there anything else you want to get off your chest? >> No, I'm good, man. Thank you so much. I I guess I'll quickly mention um just what because you asked The Best Christmas Pageant Ever, which is the movie that I made last year, came out in theaters. Um and was very wellreceived. Uh if you're a dad, um I mean, I think just even if you're a normal dude, even a single dude, I think you'll enjoy the movie. It's funny and charming and and really honors Christ. Um but it's a book that I read to my kids when I was a kid, when I was younger. I've read to my kids when I was a kid. Uh read to my kids when when they were younger. And um I I weep every time I read it and and it was it meant so much to me. I finally got a chance to do the movie and it's now out on DVD. It's now uh you can get it on on online and streaming. Um and so I think if you're looking for another Christmas classic for your family, the best Christmas pageant ever is something that I think you'll enjoy. And if you're a especially if you're a father who's leading his home and and trying to bring in good um content into your home and for your family, uh that that's this is one that is not only stands on its own as a project that even that non-believers and critics liked. We got a 91% of Rotten Tomatoes, but uh but it it's absolutely a a commercial for uh for the true meaning of Christmas and for for Christ as a redemptive uh as a redemptive power in people's lives. >> Very good, guys. You heard it there. If you want to bring in good content, you are the head of the household. Bring in good stuff. Dallas, thanks again. >> Yeah, thanks Kyle. Appreciate it. Always good to talk to you. >> There you go, guys. I hope you enjoyed Dallas Jenkins's return appearance on the show. But before we let you go, we are going to do a quick resilience boost. At Undaunted Life, our mission is equipping men to push back darkness with content that forges spiritual, mental, and physical resilience. So, there's going to be a lot of links in the show notes, but it's going to be links to where you can go and watch the stuff from Dallas and his studio. So, enjoy. Thank you for listening to this podcast. Wherever you're listening to this, please subscribe, rate, and leave us a positive five-star review. If you want me to come speak live at your event or on your podcast, just shoot me an email to info@undantton.life. That's info@undantton.life. Follow us on Instagram and like us on Facebook and check out our website for everything else, including how to donate to keep more content like this coming your way. Just go to www.undton.life. And as always, we want to thank the band Holy Name for allowing us to use their music for our content. The music on this podcast is their song Perpetual, which is off their self-titled debut album on Faceown Records. The links are in the description. I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. Remember, keep pushing back darkness. Keep forging spiritual, mental, and physical resilience. Keep seeking the Lion of Judah. [music]