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This is Undaunted Life, a man's podcast.
0:54
I'm your host Kyle Thompson.
0:56
Let's get into it.
0:57
Joe B. Martin, welcome back to the show.
0:58
You look safe and warm and here recently you were really, really, really cold, so this
1:03
is coming out a few weeks from now, but you were just recently in Washington, D.C.
1:07
For the inauguration of our 47th President of the United States, Donald J. Trump.
1:12
So what was that like?
1:13
How did you get hooked up and why didn't you bring me?
1:16
I was an invited guest, and because of you, man, you introduced me to Chad Roboshow.
1:23
And so, Trump wanted to--
1:24
And then he gave me no love.
1:25
What the heck, Chad?
1:26
Well, it's because Trump specifically wanted to bring some pastors, and so that's how that
1:32
happened.
1:33
So, good on him.
1:34
Dude, it was awesome.
1:35
Yeah.
1:36
The energy in Washington was through the roof.
1:38
I mean, it was just really great.
1:40
It was exciting.
1:41
Okay, so you sent me a few pictures that made me jealous.
1:44
So you hung out with-- So the one that's funny is John Jones.
1:48
So obviously, he's popped for steroids.
1:49
He's had some terrible run-ins with the law.
1:52
He's used his physical skills on women.
1:55
But all I could think about is John Jones is the only dude walking around in Washington,
2:00
D.C. with zero fear for his life.
2:03
That guy is the most dangerous man when it comes to hands and feet on planet Earth.
2:08
So what was it like standing next to somebody so dangerous?
2:10
Dude, he was super awesome.
2:13
You know, I mainly just went to talk to him so I could send a picture to JP by 19-year-old
2:17
son who competes in Jiu Jitsu and is the biggest USC fan.
2:22
But then we talked about the Lord, because all these guys assumed that I'm former military,
2:27
you know, just 'cause like bald beard and tattoos.
2:30
And I'm like, "No, I'm actually a pastor."
2:32
So we talked about Jesus, and he followed me on Instagram, he said he was going to watch
2:37
Sermon.
2:38
So let's go.
2:39
All right.
2:40
We'll see how that goes.
2:42
Well, speaking of Jesus, Joby, I don't know, because you've seen this.
2:46
But I got this new Jesus tattoo on my floor.
2:48
Let's go.
2:49
I'm working on my sleeves.
2:50
Shout out to Dustin Yip in Oklahoma City.
2:52
It's kind of peeling right now, but you guys can see it there on YouTube and rumble.
2:55
But I've been reliably informed by theology professors online, right, on Instagram that
3:02
I am violating one of the 10 commandments.
3:05
And so I want to read it here in Exodus 20, okay, Exodus 20 starting in verse four.
3:10
You shall not make for yourself a carved image or any likeness of anything that is in heaven
3:14
above or that is in the earth beneath or that is in the water under the earth.
3:19
You shall not bow down to them or serve them for I, the Lord, your God, am a jealous God
3:24
visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children of the third and fourth generation
3:28
of those who hate me, but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and
3:33
keep my commandments.
3:34
And these guys, these geniuses have reliably informed me that not only does that apply
3:38
to putting a rendering of Jesus on my body, but if I were to put one in a picture frame
3:42
on my wall or to watch the passion of the Christ or the chosen or something like that,
3:46
but I am violating one of those 10 commandments.
3:49
What say you?
3:50
Those guys sound like a lot of fun, don't they?
3:53
Oh, man, I've had fun with them.
3:56
So this, the whole point, if you if you shrunk down the second commandment is, it's just
4:01
don't worship idols.
4:03
And then it instructs you on some ways that people historically have worship idols, particularly
4:09
during that time.
4:10
So are you worshipping an idol?
4:11
Uh, no, I don't believe so, sir.
4:15
And you are not breaking the second commandment.
4:17
So, uh, that I will translate for Joby suck it nerds.
4:21
You got it wrong.
4:22
Joby's right.
4:23
I'm right.
4:24
Just appreciate this amazing content.
4:26
That might be a sin.
4:27
Tell them some might suck at nerds that you might be sitting there.
4:29
Well, no, no, I didn't, I didn't mean like literally or maybe I did.
4:32
Who knows?
4:33
But we could just move right on.
4:34
I do have another question, uh, because recently we've had, and you and I've talked
4:38
about this, we had, uh, Christian apologists, Wes Huff go on the Joe Rogan experience and
4:43
represent himself and Christianity very well.
4:45
We had the great Jordan Peterson publicly saying that he believes that Jesus rose from the
4:50
dead.
4:51
He did that last year, but then in a recent interview on the, the diary of a CEO podcast,
4:56
he said that he believes that Jesus is God, which implicitly means that he publicly admitted
5:01
for the first time that he believes in God, which he has not done.
5:04
You've got guys like, uh, Russell brand and gals like I on Hershey Ali, uh, coming out
5:10
as, as Christians and publicly declaring, uh, that Jesus is Lord and, and their savior.
5:15
You have Richard Dawkins admitting that he's at the very least a cultural Christian, right?
5:20
One of the four horsemen, you've got the explosion of Bible sales.
5:23
You have our show, the Daily Blade that is taking off and we were one of three Bible-based
5:29
content, you know, shows that were in the top 10 of the Associated Press's best new shows
5:35
of 2025.
5:38
But at the same time, Joby, the fastest religion in the world in terms of growth is Islam.
5:43
And so I want to ask you, is there a revival coming?
5:47
Is there a burning off of the fake and weak Christians and more of the legitimate stuff
5:54
is coming out now?
5:56
Are we losing cultural Christianity for real Christianity?
5:59
Are we heading for our final duel with Islam or the dragon, which may be the same thing?
6:06
Just give me your thoughts overall.
6:08
Uh, yeah, probably some conglomeration of all that you just said.
6:12
I mean, I think oftentimes, uh, in societies, you know, the pendulum swings and over swings
6:17
and corrects and over-corrects.
6:19
And so there was definitely a societal over-correction in regards to where, I mean, what, fifteen
6:28
years ago, the four horsemen of atheism were thought to be the future.
6:32
And now they're literally irrelevant, right?
6:34
Uh, and even, you know, our guys like Jordan Peterson and, and, and Rogan are saying things
6:41
about the Lord, even President Trump in his inaugural speech talked about God, like I've
6:46
never heard him talk before.
6:48
So what is this?
6:49
Well, we'll see.
6:50
I mean, the ultimate answer is we'll see.
6:51
I want to believe that God is on the move and that the prayers that people have been sewing
6:55
into our nation and our culture for a long time are coming to fruition.
6:59
And I want to believe, um, you know, I know that God's arms are not too short to save
7:05
and he's saving all kind of people all over the place.
7:08
That's what I want to believe.
7:09
Only time will tell.
7:10
I would highly encourage your audience to not be, to not, not have your first instinct
7:15
to be a critic of what God could potentially be doing, but to for your first instinct to
7:21
be a champion of what God could be doing.
7:24
Um, you see it in Mark chapter two, uh, you see it with the Pharisees all the time.
7:28
Jesus does a miracle and they criticize instead of champion the miracle.
7:32
So you want to be on team Jesus here hoping for hope, the hope of glory, which is faith
7:37
in Christ Jesus.
7:39
We don't want our instincts to be, well, I'm a critic of anything that I didn't have
7:43
something to do with.
7:44
Well, when we do have this chronological snobbery, as C.S. Lewis points out that for a lot of
7:49
us, we think that history started in like 1987 or something like that.
7:53
But it's like, okay, I bet the people that were sitting just recently, I was, I was digging
7:57
into Jonathan Edwards's centers in the hands of an angry God sermon.
8:02
And I bet people that were on the front end of the great awakening thought that something
8:05
was going to happen there in the very, very near term.
8:07
I bet you the people in that were living through the Great Depression in the 1930s and 1940s
8:13
and the, you know, hundreds of millions of people or over a hundred million people that
8:16
were killed between Mao and Pol Pot and Stalin and Lenin and Hitler and all those guys.
8:21
I bet they thought that we were living through, no, the end times are, we're here.
8:25
We're in it.
8:26
And so that's, I guess my encouragement for some people, you, you revelation people that
8:29
love like digging in and you're trying to crack the code and you're trying to like do
8:32
the math and all that.
8:33
It's like, we, we could, we could be in the final days of the, of, of, you know, the
8:39
real end times, but we just can't know that.
8:41
But let's try to open our arms wide and welcome as many people into the tent as possible.
8:45
Is that fair?
8:46
Yeah, that's very, very, I also think, you know, history has a tendency of repeating
8:50
itself and if you look in the late sixties, the late sixties looked a lot like our COVID
8:59
race riot kind of thing going on here, very, a lot of similarities and those two things.
9:05
And then what happened coming out of the late sixties was the Jesus revolution, which, you
9:10
know, the gospel was being preached and people that were church people would have thought
9:15
the least likely group of people to get saved were getting saved in the huge numbers.
9:20
And it was a legitimate movement.
9:22
I'm, I'm hoping and praying that coming out of like what the enemy intended for evil in
9:27
America four or five years ago that God is at work in that thing to bring a whole generation
9:33
under Christ.
9:34
I mean, honestly, Kyle, if you just looked at like if our church was in the 17, 18 hundreds,
9:41
they would write books about like the number of people getting saved and baptized coming
9:46
to Christ.
9:47
There's a real movement of God right here in Jacksonville, but then you see it in these
9:51
pockets all over.
9:52
So I hope and pray.
9:53
I mean, I really do.
9:54
I hope and pray that God's just on the move, saving a whole bunch of people.
9:57
Yeah, history doesn't technically repeat itself, but it certainly does echo.
10:00
So let's go to the next question here.
10:01
This is from Eric Browning of the forging table fame.
10:04
Brain science people tell us our bodies are constantly assessing threats and are built
10:08
to naturally avoid pain and seek pleasure is seeking pain for the right reasons.
10:14
One of the ways we deny our flesh, if so, in heaven is pleasure.
10:19
All we are going to experience all the time.
10:22
Will there be war competition, healthy pain and suffering?
10:25
So kind of a little bit more of an ethereal question.
10:27
But what do you got?
10:28
Yeah, I mean, oh, man, I have no idea.
10:30
So I think it is the goal of why you're seeking pain.
10:36
That determines like if it's under the glory of God.
10:38
So for instance, I'm sure both of us got up this morning early and we intentionally put
10:43
ourselves through pain for a greater purpose, which was the steward, the gift of our bodies
10:48
that God has given us check to go to the pain of taking the gospel to the third world check.
10:53
Okay, those kind of things, but I do think to seek pain to somehow pay penance for sin
11:02
is anti-gospel because Christ payment on the cross fully paid at all.
11:08
So there's no amount of pain that you can endure physically that somehow adds to that.
11:12
Yeah, it's like self-flagellation, like Opus Day and different sex where they would like
11:16
literally, you know, make themselves put themselves through pain.
11:20
But I have thought about this as well.
11:21
And again, we can't really know.
11:22
I'm just wondering where your thoughts are.
11:23
Think of some of the most pleasurable moments you've ever had in your life and we'll keep
11:27
a PG here, but maybe when you see your kid do something amazing where they help someone
11:31
else.
11:32
You're like, Oh my gosh, that's awesome.
11:33
And just that fluttery, you know, lovey-dovey feeling when something just goes really, really,
11:36
really well, is that what heaven is going to be like?
11:41
Is that kind of going to be what we're experiencing?
11:43
Like do we have any hints from scripture?
11:45
Yeah.
11:46
Well, in Revelation, you know, we don't, with the consummation of all things, we don't live
11:50
in heaven forever that heaven is a holding pattern right now for the consummation of all
11:53
things, which is a new heaven and a new earth that we will live in a new earth where there's
11:58
the new Jerusalem. And if you take that down to the granular level, that sounds like we're
12:03
going to be doing stuff like, you know, living in houses and having jobs and accomplishing
12:08
things. So it would be all speculation. But imagine, I mean, when Adam and Eve were cultivating
12:15
the garden, there was hard work that had to be done. You just pulled out all of the pests
12:20
and all of the thorns and thistles to that hard work. So there still seems to be that
12:27
we will be overcoming things as a part of our eternal human experience. It'll all be
12:33
the glory of God and none of it will be tainted by sin.
12:36
Okay. So we can't fully know, but can we at least agree that in this new earth, there's
12:41
going to be dogs, right? We're going to have dogs and it's going to be, you know, like
12:45
Samson, Roman, like those types of dogs.
12:48
Those types of dogs, I agree. Yeah. Okay. Very good. Glad I could pull you all the way
12:52
over to my side of things. All right.
12:54
This next question is from a donor. Thank you, Adam, for being a donor. And guys, if
13:00
you want your questions asked and put in this question, make you either need to be me, you
13:03
need to be on the forging table or you need to be a monthly donor. So here we go. Pastor
13:08
Joby, I've been following your sermons and the Q and A's you do with Kyle for a couple
13:12
of years now. I'm pretty sure that I remember you saying from the pulpit and on Kyle show
13:16
that women are not allowed to be pastors nor preach to mix gender audiences. However, I
13:21
saw where your church announced the saturated speakers for this year. And there is a woman
13:25
that you are allowing to preach from your pulpit at your church. Have you changed your theological
13:30
understanding of having women preach? If so, why?
13:33
Well, he put words in my mouth. The Bible says that the role of elder or pastor is for
13:40
a man, but I did not say that a woman is not allowed to, you know, ever talk in front of
13:47
mixed gendered folks. So it really comes down to a second Timothy when Paul says, I do not
13:54
allow a woman to preach or hold authority over a man. And so the question there is, does that
14:01
mean both of those together? Like, can a woman not give instruction to a man on where the
14:06
bathroom is during a church service? Is that what it's because some people would say yes.
14:10
And then some people just kind of throw out the Bible and say it means whatever. Basically,
14:15
if he wants to go, let's do a deepen podcast that will come out in two or three weeks,
14:20
I'll go into it for about 30 minutes. So I think what the Bible means is that the position
14:27
of pastor is only for men, just like the position of father is only for men, period. And that
14:34
though there were women in ministry all throughout the New Testament, but none of them held the
14:40
position of elder or pastor. And so that's where we land as a complimentary in church.
14:47
But there's all kinds of ministry activities that can happen, but the role of the Sunday
14:53
weekend regular gathering preacher needs to be a man. Now what we're putting on is a conference.
15:02
And so I would give more latitude and a conference than I would the church service. And so that's
15:09
where we land. There are going to be people on the right and left of me. The real thing
15:14
you have to come to is how did you get to that idea? And the reason we got there is because
15:23
we believe in the authority of scripture, and we're trying to walk out the authority
15:28
of what the Bible says for us today in our time, not trying to bend anything that it
15:35
says, but just apply it. And that means apply it not to just limit the roles of men and women,
15:42
but also fully express the roles of men and women in our church to the best of our understanding.
15:48
Hey guys, real quick, very early on in undaunted life, I knew I wanted to partner with a meat
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in the United States, but every single month, you might be getting beef from a different
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you're going to get stuff that isn't up to snuff and stuff that you don't want to feed
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17:45
Yeah, I was wondering because when I was reading through the question, it's like, okay, well,
17:49
there are church services, there are worship services, there are conferences, there are
17:53
revivals, there are, there's a lot of different categories of things. And so, you know, I think
17:59
you did a great job of kind of explaining, okay, what is the difference between a Sunday morning?
18:03
Because there's also been, I think you and I've talked about it to where it's like,
18:06
do we talk about political things for the pulpit or is that something for Wednesday night, you know,
18:10
for churches that typically do a Wednesday night or a Sunday night or something? But what is Sunday
18:14
morning for? So thank you for going into that detail. This next question is from me. And I don't
18:19
think you and I've ever talked about this before. I frankly don't know that I've heard anyone talk
18:22
about it. But it's why, so we see from scripture that when Jesus was resurrected, that he still had
18:27
holes in his hands and a hole in his side, right? So why was he seemingly at least visibly not wounded
18:37
in any other way? Because obviously we can tell from the cat of nine tales that he would have had
18:41
his his insides ripped open, his organs probably would have been exposed. You know, the crown of
18:45
thorns would have left a bunch of crazy marks all over his face. He was beaten, you know, all the
18:49
things right. And so he comes back, he's fully healed, but he's got holes. Help me.
18:55
Yeah, somehow in our glorified bodies, we are still recognizable, but not limited by any of the
19:04
pains that we have gone through in this earth. So I mean, you know, the thing about a hole or a
19:09
scar is that it a scar shows that there is it has been healed, you know. And so I think a part of
19:17
it, because he is the prototoco from the dead. He is the prototype. That means that when you and
19:22
I see each other in glory, we will recognize each other even though we're in our glorified states.
19:27
I mean, I think, I think one of the biggest things that you should take from that,
19:33
and I don't think I'm answering your question physically, philosophically, or theologically
19:38
very well, but I think the real takeaway from the scars of Jesus post resurrection is that the
19:44
enemy constantly tries to get you to be defined by your scars. And Jesus says, no, no, you're
19:48
going to be defined by mind. So the things that happened to you don't get to ultimately determine
19:54
who you are, but believing in the resurrected Christ means that he tells you who you are.
19:59
So he is recognizable and yet he's glorified. So even our glorified state, I'll still have my
20:06
cauliflower is what you're saying. So people will at least, you know, recognize me in heaven. That's
20:11
what you're saying. I would if I had it, I would want it. Don't you want it? It's like the biggest
20:16
badge of honor right now. I mean, what used to be, because I had, I mean, I had it in college a
20:21
little bit, but I got it drained and got it under control fast. So it was fun. But
20:24
Hey, I will tell you, I was, I was talking some of the other things about you if you got
20:28
cauliflower here. That's true. Right. If you have an ugly face and messed up ears,
20:32
people are like, well, you know, that that guy did a thing or two, but it is funny because I've
20:36
had conversations with guys that I know were extended, like gospel conversations that were
20:40
extended because they noticed my ears, right? And they said something about it because they're like,
20:44
all right, this is, this is not just like, you know, some random like youth pastor or something
20:48
like that. But I forget what I was going to say specifically. Oh, there was a, there was an
20:54
objection that came up on the West Huff interview on Joe Rogan that I had never heard before,
20:58
but Joe Rogan asked West Huff about, well, did these people understand time back then,
21:04
which is kind of a silly question because we understand the sun going up and the sun coming
21:08
down. So it was very chronologically snobbish, you know, question, right? But in terms of them
21:13
writing it down, there is certainly a big difference between three days and three months.
21:18
Because the thing that destroys Christianity is, you know, the resurrection not being real. So if
21:25
you can literally prove that Jesus never rose from the dead or that Jesus never died, right,
21:31
that Jesus didn't die in the first place, but he went and hung out somewhere for three months
21:35
and got a bunch of like, you know, sage oil or something like that spread on all of his wounds.
21:40
And then he came back, he looked better. Everyone thought he died, but he was actually alive.
21:44
So I guess that's kind of where I was, I was thinking about it. I was trying to think about it from
21:47
like a, if I was a strict material, satheus, and I was trying to destroy Christianity and
21:52
looking at the evidence for it, that would be one way to explain it. Like, oh, it wasn't three days,
21:56
you dummies. It was actually three months, he went and healed, he went and hid and healed. And then
22:00
when he came back, everyone was freaking out because they're like, Hey, the Romans, they always
22:04
shoot their shot with crucifixion. And they always hit their target. Does that make sense?
22:08
It does. The only thing is there is a little bit of difference between like a Roman calendar
22:13
and a Jewish calendar, but it's only a few hours off. And the difference is, is that like in the
22:19
United States, we would say we would use a day in 24 hours interchangeably, but any part of a day
22:26
for the Jewish calendar is a day. So like, they talk about a Sabbath day, but it's not even, you
22:31
know, it starts one day and ends the other day. So it would only be a few hours off, you know,
22:35
because technically, if he goes into the grave Friday evening and he comes out Sunday morning,
22:40
you know, that that's less than three 24 hour days, but it's a part of three days. That's what
22:46
that's where you get the three days from. So that would even all fall apart. But I did like,
22:51
I mean, I feel like Rogan was just asking inquisitive questions.
22:54
You know, the whole thing is, is the amount of evidence for the resurrection is just absolutely
23:02
overwhelming. I mean, from a human nature standpoint, from a sociological standpoint,
23:07
from a physical standpoint, and like Huff said, even the most hardcore atheist agree that
23:13
the Romans did not put an almost dead guy in the grave. He was dead, dead all the way dead, you
23:18
know? And so all Rome had to do is produce the body. Nobody dies for a lie. We've been over these
23:25
a hundred times. But the, in fact, Kyle, sometimes if I, if and when I have moments of doubt,
23:32
the thing that brings me back to the certainty of my faith is the overwhelming evidence of the
23:39
resurrection of Jesus Christ. When I get to confusing things in the Bible about, you know,
23:44
because it's not like a house of cards built upon some, it's all built on is the, did the
23:51
resurrection happen or not? And because it did, now I can believe, I mean, that's my whole first
23:58
two books. If the tomb is empty, anything is possible. So he's already pulled off the greatest
24:01
miracle of all time through the resurrection. So I can believe him for all kinds of things.
24:04
Well, and also don't un hitch. Yeah, don't un hitch from the Old Testament. That's not what he's
24:08
saying. And then also the, you know, if we want to get minute, the minute thing is that it was
24:14
recorded that clear liquid came from when his heart was punctured. That can only happen postpartum
24:21
or post mortem. Sorry, not postpartum, but post mortem. That's the only time something like that
24:26
can happen. We got time for maybe a couple more questions here. So I want to get into this. This
24:29
is from a donor Reg Reg. Thank you for being a donor. Reg was one of our very first donors. So
24:33
shout out to Reg. We appreciate you. And it's kind of a flowing question, but psilocybin mushrooms.
24:38
Obviously, we're talking about Joe Rogan. He's had guys on a show that just spent three hours
24:41
talking about mushrooms. We've heard about veterans that go down and do these psilocybin
24:45
mushroom and this these ayahuasca trips and things like that. But these are still in America considered
24:50
to be controlled substances. There are some people that are like, Hey, man, these are not free lunch
24:55
things. All right, this is not like, Hey, it's it's natural man. What does it matter? It's like,
24:59
yes, it is helping people, but it is also hurting other people. And there are downstream consequences
25:04
that we're not considering. And that people like Joe Rogan and people that go on a show are not
25:07
considering either. But specifically as it pertains to Christians, these things are categorized as
25:12
drugs. And for the most part, you know, all of us good kids that grew up Southern Baptist or whatever,
25:17
it's just like drugs bad. We're not going to do it. I went through the dare program. And just where
25:22
are you at on that? How should Christians think about that? Some people see it as medicine. And
25:26
some people see it as a psychedelic drug. I don't think I'm very well informed. First of all,
25:33
secondly, I would say there are some things the Bible is clear about and getting drunk would be
25:38
one of them. So you need to avoid that. I don't I don't trust our FDA as far as I can throw it.
25:46
So I get all that. The question would be, so why do you want to do this thing? Like what is it that
25:53
you are pursuing? If if a person is actually pursuing health for the sake of glorifying God
26:00
with all of their strength and mind, okay, now I would have to get more informed on what that is,
26:06
you know, like I wouldn't fault if you had some kind of cancer and there was a there was something
26:14
that was illegal in the States, but it was legal in Mexico. And you were going to go do that to be
26:18
healed so that you could be the dad and the and the husband that you've been called to be. I wouldn't
26:23
fault you whatsoever for that. The drug thing makes it a little different. Rogan, if he's being
26:28
honest, just wants to do drugs. Yeah, he wants to get high. Yeah, correct. And so, and okay,
26:34
whatever. I mean, you know, he's not a believer. So if if if folks would just be real about what
26:40
their actual intentions are, that's the real root of whether this thing is okay or not.
26:47
Now that's different from like government policy, like here in America. I mean, here in
26:54
in Florida, there was a ballot about legalizing marijuana. Man, I voted no because just the amount
26:59
of people that would be exposed to it. And if we could give them the time machine and back up and
27:05
have different societal idea about what marijuana is and about what alcohol is, okay, maybe and I
27:11
hear all that, but we can't. We live here. And here's what I know. If that thing is legalized,
27:16
there's going to be a bunch of 18 year olds or 21 year olds that have no business ever touching
27:20
the stuff and they're going to try it and they're going to ruin their lives over this thing. And so,
27:24
asking a question theologically and governmentally, I might even give you two different answers.
27:31
The question behind the question on it, should you do those kind of silicile mushrooms and all
27:35
that kind of stuff? In my opinion would be what's the what's the why behind what you want to do?
27:40
Now that being said, I wish we had the kind of government that would really research this stuff
27:46
if it actually did help veterans fight against PTSD and come off alcohol and help with suicidal
27:53
thoughts. And if that was the why behind it, then okay. But if you just are looking for a loophole
27:59
to get high, then bro, just say what it is. That's a sin. All right, very good. Well,
28:04
we got time for one more question and it's it's a tough one. And I mean, we probably need more
28:09
than five minutes to to unpack it, but five minutes is what we got. So in the last year or so,
28:15
I've had the unfortunate duty, I guess, of talking to several men that are in categorically
28:22
sexless marriage marriages. And essentially, I think what that means is they're having sex
28:27
six or less times a year. And with the men that I've been exposed to, again, I'm getting one side
28:33
of the story, it is completely being controlled by their spouse. Okay, they desire sex, they want
28:39
sex and their spouses withholding it from them on purpose. It is a power play. And one guy,
28:46
it didn't end up so good. And the other guy is still in his marriage. And he is doing everything
28:51
he can to lead his wife, right, whatever the hell that means. And so both of these guys,
28:56
I just like, I just I don't know what to tell them because it's like there's only so much you can do
29:02
to create fertile soil for the plant to grow. But if the woman refuses and she is not going to
29:10
listen to Godly counsel, even if she claims to be a Christian, she won't listen to other women
29:14
that are going to tell her what you're doing is sinful. She's not going to listen to her husband,
29:18
she's not going to be led by her husband in a lot of these cases, she has the more dominant
29:22
personality than the husband. Anyway, the husband has not been the leader. They've usurped their role
29:26
as the leader of the household, the women have taken over. But just straight up, what do you tell
29:33
the guy in that situation? Like, when the world is he supposed to do? Yeah, be faithful and it sucks.
29:40
I mean, I've got no good news based on all those parameters you laid out that you're supposed to
29:48
love her like Christ loved you. And so that's a part that's this incredible gift of God given by God
29:55
that you have to lay down in order to love and serve her till death through his part in good times
30:03
and bad and sickness and health. So it's sick and it's bad. And that's what you signed up for.
30:08
That sucks, dude. And I mean, you know, the best thing that could happen is if she could get
30:16
around some godly women and have some godly women pour into her 1st Corinthians 7 on
30:22
she's in sin. Like, Porneo is not just about that Greek word Porneo, sexual immorality is not
30:30
just about going outside of your marriage. Like in fornication or homosexuality or pornography and
30:38
lust, it's also abusing sex within your marriage. That would also be sexually immoral. Whether that
30:43
means the guy is emotionally or theologically or physically beating up his wife in order to get
30:50
sex, that would be sexually immoral or a wife with a power play withholding sex from her husband
30:57
to punish him is also sexually immoral. So she is living in sin and what he needs to do. I mean,
31:04
listen, people are like counselors are going to give them all kind of like tips and tricks on how
31:08
to communicate and share needs or whatever. But fundamentally, what that brother's got to come to,
31:13
which is this sucks, man, but is that you take up your cross and you follow Jesus and you die to
31:19
yourself and you love her unconditionally like he's loved you. And the only way you're going to be
31:27
able to pull this off is through the gospel of Jesus Christ and the spirit of God living in you.
31:31
And every time your advances get turned down, even when they're good and godly and you did it right,
31:37
then you remember Christ on the cross crucified for you. And this is just an opportunity for you
31:44
to be Christ like to her, even if you never get what you want. I mean, dude, the gospel
31:50
that's what we've been called to. And I can't imagine. I mean, you know, I have a really godly
31:58
awesome wife who likes me and acts like it. And even, and even, I know there's some women
32:05
listening to this and, and, and the last thing I would ever want is for some guy to use some
32:10
verses out of first grade, you seven to like manipulate or force his wife or whatever. But
32:16
my wife has a really incredible understanding of my wants and needs. And she's a really,
32:22
really godly wife when it comes to that. So that is the ideal, but where the ideal is unrealized,
32:28
then grace abounds. But dude, it's a, it sucks. I mean, that poor guy. And it's going to damage
32:35
everything in his marriage. It is because you talk about the thermostat and the thermometer.
32:41
Through the bedroom, it can set the temperature for your whole house. It can. And, but yeah, you,
32:49
you made a vow and God commands you to love her like Christ loved us. So even when we're terrible,
32:55
which she's being terrible, then, then you got to love her. And that really does mean that not
33:03
manipulator that I really love her. Not, not be resentful towards her, but really love her.
33:11
It's brutal, but I obviously think that you're right, but we're out of time. That's all for me.
33:16
Anything else you want to get off your chest? Well, that's a fun way to end, huh? Good luck.
33:20
Good luck sucks to be here. I could have ended, I could have ended with another one, but I went
33:23
this route. So of course you did. Of course you did. The guy that loves to lament Psalms more than
33:27
anything else. I didn't say I loved him. I just said I learned from him. Okay. And I did end with a
33:32
baby Hitler joke or a scenario. So, you know, count your blessings. All right, Joby. We'll see you next
33:36
month. Peace. Thank you for listening to this podcast. Wherever you're listening to this,
33:40
please subscribe, rate, and leave us a positive five star review. If you want me to come speak live
33:44
at your event or on your podcast, you shoot me an email to info@undonton.life. That's iNFO@undonton.life.
33:51
Follow us on Instagram and like us on Facebook and check out our website for everything else,
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including how to donate to keep more content like this coming your way. Just go to www.undonton.life.
34:00
And as always, we want to thank the band Holy Name for allowing us to use their music for our
34:03
content. The music on this podcast is our song Perpetua, which is off their self-titled debut
34:08
album on Face Down Records. The links are in the description. I'm your host, Kyle Thompson.
34:13
Remember, keep pushing back darkness, keep forging spiritual, mental, and physical resilience.
34:20
Keep seeking the lion of Judah.