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[Music]
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This is Undaunted Life of Man's Podcast. I'm your host Kyle Thompson. Let's get into it.
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For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles
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of Christ, and no wonder for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is no surprise
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if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to
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their deeds. That is 2 Corinthians 11, 13, or 15 may be a kind of ominous beginning to this episode.
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If most of you guys are used to our episodes and used to kind of what we talk about normally,
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and if you got any hints from the title today's episode, you shouldn't be too terribly surprised.
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But before we get into today's content, which is very, very important, I want to talk about
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something that we're doing that is really, really awesome. We're doing a knife raffle.
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Okay. So as you guys know, I'm big fans of Blaine and Sean Stevenson from Stevenson Knives
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down in Florida. And so this is kind of like knife week. So we got, you know, Josh Smith from
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Montana Knife Company on Tuesday. Now we got, we're talking about this. These guys made me a
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custom knife that they did a while ago. I wanted an all black knife. I'm showing it here on the
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screen now. It's got the Undaunted Life logo. I don't know if you can see that right there.
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But this is like, you know, going to be a hunting knife that I'm going to use and, you know,
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definitely going to be a knife that I passed down. But those guys reached out to me at the
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end of last year and they're like, look, we love what you're doing. They're huge supporters of
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our show and what we're doing. But we want to help you raise some money. So what would you think
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if we made a knife specifically for your audience and you like raffled it off to help raise money
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for, you know, your operations and the stuff that you're trying to do? And I was like, yes,
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absolutely. That's great. But an awesome thing is the idea actually morphed from that initial
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idea because I was a little bit a little bit weird, like about all the money kind of coming to us.
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You know, I wanted to see what we could do to support some other entities. So this is what
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we decided. So what me and Blaine and Sean Stevenson decided to do is we're going to raffle off a
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knife that I'm going to show you here in just a second. 50% of that is going to go to support
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the operations here at Undaunted Life. And then 50% of that is going to go to the local
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pregnancy resource center here in my town of Edmond, Oklahoma, the Hope Pregnancy Center.
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And so let me tell you a little bit about the Hope Pregnancy Center. When a woman has a crisis
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pregnancy of some kind in this area, and they go online and do any Google search,
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it leads them to this facility where they will, you know, basically help them with health care.
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They're going to help them with financial support. They're going to give them, you know, baby formula
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and basically everything they could need. Once the baby is here to take care of that baby,
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they minister to the men that get these girls pregnant. So it's not just the woman feeling like
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she's alone. They do ultrasounds. They do everything. And they save lives literally every single day.
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And so I wanted to see what we could do to maybe support them. So let's talk about this knife.
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So I'm literally like unwrapping it from the bubble wrap. Okay, so this is called the Florida
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Hunter. And so this is there. I'm showing it on screen right now. But guys, this will be posted
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online on our Instagrams and every other place. But look at this thing. So this is the Florida
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Hunter knife by Stevenson knives. This normally retails for around $300. This is
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five two one zero zero ball bearing steel. And then this handle right here is actually really,
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really cool. They call this their crazy fiber scales handle. And then obviously with every Stevenson
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knife, you get this amazing, you know, custom made to the knife handmade leather sheath. It's
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an absolutely, absolutely gorgeous knife. And the thing about it is we wanted to do a raffle. We
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wanted to kind of give it away like what's the way that we could give this away and like the
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coolest way, but also the most fair way possible. So we decided to do a raffle. And so this is how
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you can enter. So guys, this is very, very important. Any person, okay, that donates $20
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through the undaunted life donation website between now and February the 23rd. Okay, that's
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the next three weeks and puts the word this is important and puts the word knife in the comments
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section will automatically have their name entered into a randomized drawing for the Stevenson
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Florida hunter knife. Okay, so every $20 you donate equals one spot in the wrath. So if you
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donate a hundred bucks, your name goes in the randomized or five times if you donate a thousand
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bucks, your name goes in the randomized or 50 times, you know, so on and so forth. But also,
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we've had a lot of supporters that have supported us for a very long time. So I want to take care
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of you guys as well to all the current monthly donors. Okay, so as of the recording of this
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podcast, if you were currently a monthly donor, regardless of how long you've done that or how
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much you've been donating, I'm going to go ahead and just put your name in the randomized or twice
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just as a thank you. So obviously to all the people that are monthly donors, we love you guys.
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But if you all want to make an additional donation for the knife to support us and also the hope
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pregnancy center here in Edmond, Oklahoma, you just need to, you know, donate for every $20. You'll
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get another, you know, you get your name added into the raffle every time that you add another
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$20. So I'll likely do a video of the drawing on Instagram or something like that the week of
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February the 23rd. And then I'll announce the winner on Instagram and then again on the show.
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But again, guys, the donation link is in the show notes. Most of you guys are familiar with
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that. Or you can just go to undaunted.life/donate. So go to the show notes wherever you're listening
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to this or go to www.undaunted.life/donate. Don't forget to put the word knife in the comments
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section. And again, minimum of $20 donation, 50% goes to us, 50% goes to literally save lives.
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But I just wanted to give a big shout out and thank you very, very much to Sean and Blaine
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Stevenson from Stevenson knives for doing this. You know, it's time to flow it out, boys. I mean,
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let's let's make this workout. And they are in the show notes as well. So if you guys want to check
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out some of the stuff on their website, they're not an enormous operation, but they make some of
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the best knives that you will find here in this country. And again, guys, if you haven't left a
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review for the show, please do so. And if you haven't checked out origin gear, that is in the
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show notes as well. Now, we need to get into the business end of today. We're not doing any quick
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hitters. And the reason is because I want this episode to stand alone. Okay, I may do another solo
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episode, you know, there's standalone episode because there's something else that I really,
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really wanted to talk about. But this has been, you know, on my mind for the last week or so. And,
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you know, it's time to talk about it. And so obviously, if you're reading the title of this
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episode, it's called Andy Stanley is a heretic. Okay, so stick with me and I'll explain to you why
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and bear with me today. Because in order to get where we we are today, you know, where we're
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what we're talking about, we need to do a quite a bit of foundational work. Okay, so I need to
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really set the stage for you. And also, there's an upcoming the forging table episode where Andy
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Stanley comes up. But that particular episode, and I can't remember when it's coming, it could be
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this Sunday, it could be three or four Sundays for now, I literally can't remember when we talked
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about it. But this, that forging table episode was recorded way before this latest controversy
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was stirred up just last week. So when you hear us talking about him in the future episode,
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just note that because we didn't have all this information. So if you're not familiar with who
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Andy Stanley is, I guess I should kind of bring you up to speed on that. So he is the senior pastor
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of North Point Community Church. That is a non denominational church in the Atlanta area. He's
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the son of Dr. Charles Stanley. So Dr. Charles Stanley was a giant in the televangelism world and
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the radio world. And I think he still does some of that. He's the senior pastor of First Baptist
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Church in Atlanta. I think he's still that he founded in touch ministries. He's twice been the
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president of the Southern Baptist Convention. So heavyweight Andy was a student minister at his
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dad's church for a while. He wanted to attract a different kind of audience, different type of
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crowd than First Baptist. So he founded North Point Community Church in 1995. He wanted to have the
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church have it be a church that unchurched people would love to attend. Okay. So it exploded to like
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over 30,000 weekly attendees. And it did that pretty quickly. And it's consistently like in the top
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two, maybe top three biggest churches in America. I think it's behind, you know, Joel Osteen's church
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and sometimes life churches in there, but consistently in the top three. And he was invited to do the
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National Prayer Breakfast for, you know, President Obama back in 2009, he's been named to list like
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the most influential living pastor, the most effective preachers. He's authored a ton of books.
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His book deep and wide was actually on our book list for several years. He's childhood best friends
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with Louis Giglio from Passion Church. You know, the truncated versions of his sermons used to be
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in it. I think they may still be on Netflix. But this also gives you a little bit of an insight into
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how his brain works. Acts 1519 is framed and on his office wall. And if this was spoken by James,
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the, the half brother of Jesus, it's, it is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it
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difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. Okay. So in terms of my history with Andy Stanley,
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I was not aware of Andy Stanley until he came and did a guest sermon spot at life church
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over 10 years ago. Okay. So I was attending life church, you know, this Craig Rochelle's church here
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in Oklahoma. And he came and did this, this thing. And I was like, Oh my gosh, this guy is,
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this guy is awesome. He's very pragmatic. And he's very engaging and he's making these great points.
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And he's very intellectual, at least I thought at the time. And so I started listening to his stuff
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and reading his books. And for years and years and years, I listened to his content. I took notes
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on his sermons and I even kind of daydreamed about man, if I lived in the Atlanta area, I would
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love to go to his church. And so I consumed his stuff. He was literally one of the main voices
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that I was taking in as I was kind of growing in my Christian walk. And then again, at different
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points, I wasn't really reading my Bible. I wasn't really spending that much time on my Christian
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walk. But he was a big part of that for a very, very long time. And then around four years ago,
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there was the unhitch controversy that I'm sure many of you are aware of. And I actually
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covered this on a very early episode of this podcast episode 23. It's called Andy Stanley,
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a heretic question mark or it was Andy Stanley the heretic. So I'll put that in the show notes
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if you guys want to go all the way back to episode 23 when I still didn't even know how microphones
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worked. But that whole kerfluffle stemmed from one line in his sermon entitled not difficult.
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Okay. And this was the line. Peter James, Paul, elected to unhitch the Christian faith from their
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Jewish scriptures. We must as well. Okay. So unhitching the Old Testament from the New Testament. Okay.
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Now the that sermon, you know, not difficult was part of a three part series entitled not
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difficult. Okay. Or I got the names all mixed up, but it was a three part series. And this was like
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the last one of that series. It's in the show notes. You guys can check it out. But the entire
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series focused on what the, the, I guess, foundation of the first century church was.
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And that was the resurrection, not the scripture, according to Andy Stanley. And you know, because
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essentially the biblical corpus had not yet been fully written or compiled at this time,
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obviously, the big quote from part one of that series was this, because again, I was listening
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to all these at the time. Here's the quote. If you gave up on Christianity because of something
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in the Bible or something about the Bible, something that was actually in the Bible,
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or something that you heard or read about the Bible, you may have given up on Christianity
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unnecessarily. So I want you to make sure that you remember that quote and kind of how he talks
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about the word of God as we continue to unpack this. Now the big quote from part two of that series,
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again, this is before like the major controversy. This is speaking about Paul, quote, he immediately
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let go of God's temporary and conditional covenant with Israel to embrace God's permanent
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and unconditional covenant with the human race. New covenant values and imperative stand in sharp
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contrast to the values and imperatives of the old covenant. Okay, so keep that in mind as well.
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And then again, in part three, Stanley summarizes his thesis of the three part series.
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And this actually could also, I guess, be the summary for the book that he released after the
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sermon series called irresistible, reclaiming the new that Jesus unleashed for the world. So here's the
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quote. Many of lost faith because of something about the Bible are in the Bible, the Old Testament
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in particular. Once they could no longer accept all of the historicity of the Old Testament,
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once they couldn't go along with all the miracles, once somebody poked a hole in the
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Genesis creation myth, once all that went away, suddenly their house of cards came tumbling down
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because they were taught that it's all true. It's all God's word. And if you find one part that
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's not true, uh, oh, the whole thing comes tumbling down, not Christianity. The Bible did not create
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Christianity. The resurrection of Jesus created and launched Christianity. Your whole house of
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Old Testament cards can come tumbling down. The question is, did Jesus rise from the dead and the
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eyewitnesses said he did? Okay. Now we need to go back to the quote that really defined the
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controversy. But I'm going to read, you know, the entire quote from that sermon. Peter James and Paul
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elected to unhitch the Christian faith from the Jewish scriptures and my friends, we must as well.
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And I'll tell you why. It's actually the same reason they did because we must not make it
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difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. They didn't. We shouldn't either. The faith of
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the next generation may depend on our willingness and our ability to get this right. Okay. So that
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caused a whole bunch of, you know, craziness. Uh, you know, that wasn't the first time that he said
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anything like that. I think that same year during his Easter service, he said some similar things to
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that. But also the summer of 2016. Okay. There was a series that he did called who needs God. And in
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week three of that, it's called the Bible told me so. So I want to read a quote specifically from
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that. And the reason why I'm not showing the clips is because I don't really have permission or
12:56
access to all of these clips. And I don't want them to be taken down later. So the clips I do
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show today, I know I can use, but some of these I don't know. So here's the quote from that sermon
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series. Many of you were brought up to believe this. Jesus loves me. This I know for the Bible
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tells me so this is where our trouble began because the implication is, and this is important,
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the implication is the Bible is the reason we believe. In other words, I can believe Jesus
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loves me because it's in the Bible. I grew up in a church where basically the byline, the subtitle
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of everything was if the Bible says it, that settles it. And so we need kids or we send off,
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send kids off to college with a, if the Bible says it, that settles it. And all of a sudden they
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realize, oh my goodness, that didn't settle it. The problem with that is if the Bible is the
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foundation of our faith, as the Bible goes, so goes our faith. Christianity cannot survive if
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somehow every single part of the Bible isn't absolutely true if the Bible is the foundation
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of our faith. LinkedIn is pretty great at a lot of things, like helping you tap into the latest
13:56
trends and insights in your field. We cannot stop your coworker from tapping her pencil.
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LinkedIn can help you find new jobs that align with your career goals. We cannot help you find
14:07
the source of that weird smell in the office fridge. Yeah. And while we can't stop your
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coworkers from bringing their hobbies into the office, LinkedIn can help you bring your career
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to the next level. LinkedIn is the network that works for you. Okay. So in light of all that,
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the unhinged controversy absolutely exploded. He was accused of being a modern day,
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Marcian, you know, Allah, Marcianism, which is essentially, you know, not thinking that the
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Old Testament was authoritative for Christians. He was accused of being a Gnostic, so Gnosticism,
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you know, being a heretical, anti-Christian, anti-Biblical worldview. He was accused of being
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a relativist, you know, people warned that the unhinged action could eventually be performed on
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any parts of scripture that you individually don't like. And in episode 23 of this podcast,
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I actually defended Andy Stanley and I tried to qualify his statements for him,
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even though he only continued to double down on his original sent original sentiment. So I was
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defending a guy that wasn't technically defending himself. And then there was the debate with Jeff
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Durbin of apology at church, obviously big time Calvinist reform guy on unbelievable with Justin
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Briarley. Okay. So this is something that I did a big breakdown on episode 82 of this podcast.
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It's called Andy Stanley versus Jeff Durbin. So you guys can check out episode number 82.
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But Stanley's thesis in this debate was the Bible is not the foundation of Christianity.
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The resurrection is it's not a difference in theology. It's a difference in approach.
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Thus we need to come closer to the resurrection. So that's his thesis. But then Jeff Durbin's thesis
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in this argument in this debate is the Bible is the foundation of Christianity. Our theology will
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lead us to practice and methodology. Thus we need to come closer to the word of God. So when you
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break it down and break down that debate and you can go back to my episode who most people thought
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one, if you were a pragmatic business minded logic first person, you thought Stanley won.
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But if you were a deep thinking theologically focused, you know, solo scripture person,
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you thought Jeff Durbin won. And you know, in terms of who I thought one,
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I thought that Jeff Durbin smashed Andy Stanley in this. He had a couple of even mic drop moments
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and Andy Stanley was getting visibly upset and you could even hear it as voice he was getting upset.
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But when Andy Stanley seems to get upset, it's almost this narcissistic like, I'm better than this
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person. I'm smarter than you. Like, how are you not understanding this? But Jeff Durbin just very,
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very calmly kept going back to the scripture, going back to the scripture, going back to the
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scripture, not really depending on his own philosophical arguments. Okay. So from that time on, you know,
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I wasn't really following any Stanley and it wasn't really necessarily because of all that,
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but I was like, okay, this is very concerning. But I kind of moved on to some other people and
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started, you know, doing my own podcast. And so, you know, I just kind of for the last several years,
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certainly I haven't really paid any attention to Andy Stanley. But then all of a sudden, last week,
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he goes viral and he's been basically the focus of my attention for the last week or so. So a clip
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started making the rounds and it was just a couple of minutes from a talk that he gave in May of last
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year. So May of 2022 at his church's drive conference. Okay. So this is the interesting thing about
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this particular talk that he did, because again, this is just a too many clip and it's like, oh,
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it's taking out a context. That entire sermon has been deleted from the conference app and the website,
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which is really odd because every other sermon that Andy Stanley delivered and everybody else,
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presumably, it's all still up on the website. But if you go to the app or the website and you
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click on the link, this entire talk is gone for some reason. Okay. Now I'm going to put the full
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11 minute clip about this entire thing in the show notes, but it's much of the same sentiment.
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But here is the clip that went around the world and went viral. So here's the two minutes here.
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Figure out how to get straight people as excited about serving and engaging as the gay men and
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women. I know we would have a volunteer backlog. That's my experience in our churches. Well, I'm
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a gay person. I'll just read it to you. A gay person. When I say gay and men and women, okay,
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a gay person who still wants to attend church after the way the church has treated the gay
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community. I'm telling you, they have more faith than I do. They have more faith than a lot of you.
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A gay person who knows, you know what? I might not be accepted here, but I'm going to try it anyway.
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Have you ever done that as a straight person? Where do you go that you're not sure you're going
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to be accepted and you go over and over and over and over? Only you're in law's house. That's the
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only place you go where you know you're not completely accepted, but you go over and over
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and over and it's because you have to. But other than the in-laws, what environment do you continue
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to step foot in knowing at any moment you may feel ostracized? No, please. I'm telling you,
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the gay men and women who grew up in church and the gay men and women who've come to faith in Christ
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as adults who want to participate in our church. Oh, my goodness. I know 1 Corinthians 6 and I know
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Leviticus and I know Romans 1, it's so interesting to talk about all that stuff, but just oh my goodness,
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a gay man or woman who wants to worship their heavenly father who did not answer the cry of their
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heart when they were 12 and 13 and 14 and 15. God said no and they still love God.
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We have some things to learn from a group of men and women who love Jesus that much and who
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want to worship with us. And I know the verses. I know the clobber passages, right? We got to
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figure this out. And you know what? I think you are. So again, this is a conference that people paid
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money to go to and that too many clip is in the show notes. And then the full 11 minute clip that
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I found is also in the show notes. So my reaction to that, you know, even relistening to it just now
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gets gets me all fired up and I'll try to calm down so I can make my points here. It's egregiously
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dismissive of the word of God. I mean, just go back to his quote, you know, I know 1 Corinthians 6
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and I know Leviticus and I know Romans 1. I know the verses. I know the clobber passages,
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the clobber passages. So he's obviously making the point like, oh, yeah, these are the scriptures
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that people used to beat up on gay people. But is it beating up on them to point to their sin and
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say, Hey, this could send you to hell. You probably shouldn't do that. You need to repent. You need
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to depend on Jesus and really orient your life behind his dictates and moral order, clobber passages.
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And then let's actually go through those passages because he mentioned them and didn't cite them. So
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outside them for you, 1 Corinthians 6, he's talking about verses nine through 11. Or do you not know
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that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither the sexually
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immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulters, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy,
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nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some
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of you, but you were washed. You were sanctified. You were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus
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Christ and by the spirit of our God. And then in Leviticus, we're looking at 1822,
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you shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. And then again, in Leviticus
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2013, if a man lies with a man as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination,
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they shall surely be put to death. Their blood is upon them. And then he talks about Romans 1.
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We're looking at, you know, verses 26, 27 and 32. For this reason, God gave them up to dishonorable
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passions for their women exchange natural relations for those that are contrary to nature.
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And the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one
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another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for
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their error. Now, verse 32, though they know God's righteous or they know God's righteous decree
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that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them, but give approval
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to those who practice them. Remember that one. But I'll go and add a couple to this clobber
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passage category. Let's go to the words of Jesus. Even though, again, there's no difference between
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the red letters of the Bible and the black letters of the Bible as, you know, Vodie Pockham taught me
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if you believe in the triune God, all the letters are red letters, because Jesus is part of the
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Godhead. But let's go to Matthew 15, 19. These are the words of Jesus for out of the heart,
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come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, slander.
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These are what defile a person. So you might think to yourself, well, he didn't mention
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homosexuality there, but he said sexual immorality. Now he would have said it in, you know, ancient
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Aramaic, it would have been recorded in Greek. And the Greek word that was used for sexual immorality
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was poor Nia or poor Nia. Now, what the first century hearer or reader of that would know
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is that Jesus is talking about all sexual immorality. So that would be homosexuality. That would be
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sex outside of wedlock. That would be, you know, sex with animals. That would be sex with children.
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All of that. All of those things would be in that same category. And then we got 1 Corinthians 618.
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Free from sexual immorality, same word, poor Nia. Every other sin a person commits is outside the
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body. But the sexually immoral person sins against his own body. The reason why I included this from
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Paul is because I've talked to Christians that I know very, very well that are like, yeah, I don't
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know why people make such a big deal out of, you know, homosexuality. It's, it's just sin. It's
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just like lying. It's just like cheating on your taxes. But no, it's not. We see from God's word
23:27
in Scripture via this letter from Paul to the church in Corinth that this is a single sin
23:34
that is fundamentally different than every other sin. Because what, what that relates to this would
23:39
say is that, yeah, you know, all sins are, are, you know, they're basically the same, right? You
23:44
know, they're, they're, they're fundamentally the same and they're superficially different as a way
23:47
to say it. But they're superficially the same and fundamentally different as it pertains to sexual
23:52
immorality, which includes homosexuality. Okay. So what, what Andy Stanley is doing here is he's
23:59
essentially LGBTQ affirming. Now when people have said that on, you know, Twitter or wherever else
24:04
this week that's like, no, he never said that. And you know, just go back to the clip and you never
24:07
actually says that. But the public reaction has been very, very interesting because Bible-believing
24:13
Christians like me are absolutely appalled that he would say these things. But all the progressive
24:18
woke, you know, you go along to get along Christians like let's not make anybody mad. Let's be known
24:24
for what we're for, not what we're against Christians. They loved this clip. Seriously,
24:29
just type Andy Stanley into the search bar on Twitter and every person with, you know, pronouns
24:34
in their bio that also claims to be a Christian. They love it. They're using this as an example.
24:39
This is what everybody in evangelicalism and Christianity writ large should do. Okay. Now,
24:45
when this came up, I was like, all right, I haven't been paying attention to any Stanley for the
24:49
last several years. I'd kind of moved on to other people. But now I need to dig in. What is even
24:54
saying since all the unhitch controversy stuff? Okay. So as I was doing this research and thanks
25:00
to Ryan on our team that helped me do some of this research research as well, that is the same
25:03
Ryan from the forging table. But from his sermon series called Christian, in part five, that's
25:08
called when Gracie met truthy. Okay. So there's a seven minute video that I can't put here because
25:13
I don't have permission, but it will be in the show notes. You should listen to this. Okay.
25:17
Because in that sermon, he does like a seven minute story about a husband leaving his wife and child
25:24
or children to be with another man. Okay. But then through the description of this story, right,
25:31
the other man in this story was actually married to a woman as well. But the initial guy had divorced
25:37
his wife and child so that he can seek out a homosexual relationship with this man. But that
25:42
other man was still married to a woman. He wasn't divorced yet. Now the shocking thing about this
25:47
story that he told, you know, it wasn't just the convoluted affairs that were involved. That would
25:52
have been enough. It was two things that that really stood out to me now that I've watched it
25:56
through new eyes. He only seems saddened by the fact that the gay couple left one of his churches.
26:01
Okay, because they were volunteers and then, you know, they kind of had a discussion and then
26:05
they left because they didn't feel welcome again. Go go watch it. It's seven minutes, you know, go
26:09
watch it. But then the second thing is, as Andy Stanley never once decries the sin of homosexuality
26:16
as he's describing the story, never once, he decries the fact that one of the gay men wasn't
26:21
divorced yet, meaning he's an adulterer, but he never talks about homosexuality. Ever.
26:27
Unless like he's just describing these homosexual men, but he never talks about the sin
26:32
of homosexuality. Now, the funny thing is, is I was following Andy Stanley at this time. I remember
26:38
loving this Christian series. It was like six or seven, you know, episodes or whatever. Okay.
26:43
But I didn't catch the craziness of this story at the time that I watched it, which, you know,
26:47
just kind of goes, you know, a little bit more into kind of how I've evolved and how I've adjusted
26:53
and how I've become closer to the word and how I notice these things that, you know, however long
26:56
ago, whenever he did that, I just didn't notice. But also let's keep going down the list of things
27:00
that I, you know, found this week. He sent a tweet out March six of last year, I believe,
27:06
which has since been deleted, which said this, this is his words. Andy Stanley tweeted this.
27:10
The Christian faith doesn't rise and fall on the accuracy of 66 ancient documents. It rises and
27:16
falls on the identity of a single individual, Jesus of Nazareth. So being fairly dismissive
27:22
of the Bible, again, he deleted this and he didn't delete it for no reason. Then I found a quote
27:26
from a sermon of his and it said this, when you anchor the authority of your teaching to the Bible,
27:32
you reinforce an assumption that has the potential to weaken rather than establish your faith. I
27:38
actually have a screenshot of that, like someone sitting at his church and like the seventh row,
27:43
take a picture of this behind him. And it's so grainy like it's, it's definitely not photoshopped.
27:47
Again, let me read that quote again. When you anchor the authority of your teaching to the Bible,
27:52
you reinforce an assumption that has the potential to weaken rather than establish faith.
27:59
So he's, he's going right at the authority of scripture there. And then as I was looking through
28:04
this, I see this thread, a seething thread from pastor Ryan Visconti from Generation Church in
28:09
Arizona. He's actually a podcast alum. He came on here on episode 232 and 238. Now guys, the entire
28:15
thread is in the show notes. So I'm just going to go through the first part of it. So let me just
28:18
read this part of his thread. On September 19, 2019, I was invited to a private dinner with about 15
28:24
pastors at a local church in Gilbert, Arizona to participate in a Q and A with Andy Stanley
28:29
after he finished speaking at a conference. The subject of homosexuality came up and over the next
28:33
one and a half hours, Andy shared overtly heretical views that clearly contradict what the word of
28:39
God says. I was shocked to find myself arguing with Andy Stanley, along with the other pastors
28:45
despite our respect for him. Andy Stanley said homosexuality is quote, really a disability,
28:51
unquote, using the analogy that, quote, telling gay people that they have to stop being gay to
28:56
follow Christ is like taking a wheelchair away from a guy who can't walk, unquote. Andy Stanley
29:02
also said, quote, I don't do gay weddings, but I can't say I would never do a gay wedding.
29:07
If my granddaughter asked me someday, maybe I would, unquote, worst of all, Andy Stanley said this,
29:13
quote, we need to make room for gay men who choose to be married to each other in our churches,
29:19
because that's as close as they can get to a New Testament framework of marriage. Unquote,
29:25
Andy Stanley also said, quote, I believe in gay people. Some people are gay. They can't change,
29:31
unquote, which is directly contradicting 1 Corinthians 6 9 through 11. He said, quote,
29:37
I know I shouldn't let experience dictate my theology, but I have. Maybe I'm wrong. Unquote.
29:43
Yes, he is. So that's a thread again. The entire thread from him is down there.
29:48
And then literally this morning, okay, literally this morning, I was made aware
29:52
of this. And this is just going to slam home everything I'm about to go through here in a minute.
29:56
This is according to the center. Again, the link to the article will be in the show notes.
29:59
The the name of the article is Andy Stanley's church has open lesbian on staff leading LGBTQ
30:06
ministry. So I'm going to read directly from the article here. In the midst of all that has been
30:10
uncovering all that has been the uncovering of a much deeper issue at Stanley's North Point
30:15
church. Not only has Stanley taken a soft and unbiblical approach to sin, but it's now been
30:20
discovered that Stanley has an openly identifying lesbian on staff at his church who leads the
30:26
church's LGBTQ ministry. Earlier this month, Q Christian fellowship held a conference for
30:31
openly queer people who claimed to be Christians along with their parents and allies to affirm
30:37
their aberrant sexuality and tell them that God is indifferent to their sin. According to the
30:42
conference schedule, one of the speakers at the conference was a staff member from North Point
30:46
and North Point named Amy Blakely. On the conference schedule biography, Blakely claims to work on
30:51
North Point staff as part of the care staff and describes herself as gay and as a proud parent
30:57
of an adult child who I also identifies as gay below is her bio. Hello, my name is Amy. I identify
31:03
as gay by pronouns are she her and I'm a proud parent of three adult kids, one of whom also
31:08
identifies as gay. Over the past 10 years, I've had the privilege of meeting with hundreds of
31:12
parents of LGBTQ plus children throughout my or through my position on the care staff at North
31:17
Point Community Church. As more and more parents reached out to the church for support, I began
31:22
meeting with them in their homes. Parent Connect was birthed, one of the first church-based ministries
31:26
in the nation created specifically for Christian parents of LGBTQ plus kids. Thankfully, Parent
31:31
Connect paved the way for many other churches to begin ministries for parents of LGBTQ plus kids,
31:36
where the focus is on helping parents to love their LGBTQ plus kids well. Currently, I am a
31:43
full-time graduate student studying clinical mental health counseling. As a future counselor,
31:47
I hope to continue to support LGBTQ plus individuals and their families. I live in Atlanta, Georgia,
31:51
and enjoy not exercising drinking coffee, diet, Mountain Dew, and living an authentic life.
31:56
Good grief. How, how narcissist, just to end with that, I missed that the first time in living
32:00
an authentic life. What a tool. But when you when you dig a little bit further, you also found that
32:06
Blake's Lee is also involved with the Reformation Project, a completely apostate and totally queer
32:12
affirming quote unquote ministry founded by the infamous gay Christian apologist Matthew Vines.
32:17
Okay. So I saw that my head starts spinning and it's like, I shouldn't be shocked, but it's still
32:22
am shocked. And if that weren't enough, Protestia, which is a website and they have a Twitter account,
32:26
they uncovered this video, which they posted on their Twitter account in this clip that I'm about
32:31
to show for you. For those that are just listening, it's an interaction between Debbie Causi, who is
32:37
the director of North Point care ministries. The same thing that this Blake sleep person kind of
32:41
works with. She's the director of that at Stanley's church and Greg Johnson, who is a North Point
32:46
ministry leader and seemingly his life or his wife rather. So just listen to this interaction.
32:51
It's about two minutes. Parents want to know how can I find a safe counselor who can help my
32:58
child or who can help me who can help my family. Right. That's so I don't get to do as much counseling
33:07
as I used to because of the there's at least 11 ministries at North Point that are under care. And
33:14
so we do a lot of one time appointments where we're assessing, but we do refer people to safe
33:21
counselors when it comes to this subject. I think there's what is it called, Greg? The closet.
33:29
Yeah, closet, they are a great group. And they do it over. They do it virtually. So you don't have
33:40
to live in the Atlanta area. I do have a list of counselors in the Atlanta area that we will refer
33:46
to if the person is in the Atlanta area. And so, you know, feel free to email me at debbie.causy@northpoint.org
33:55
if you are in the Atlanta area and you are looking for a safe counselor. But yeah, I would probably
34:01
turn to the Christian closet if you're not. And they are known to be fairly safe when it comes to
34:10
this. And I am the founder of the Christian closet. What is the Christian closet? Probably a lot of
34:17
you hopefully have already heard of us. But we are a team of LGBTQ counselors and coaches. And we do
34:26
online therapy and coaching and spiritual direction. And I would say probably all of us are sort of
34:33
living our dream job when we get to meet with all of you. I know for me, being gay and Christian
34:40
was such a huge part of my own journey. And so we get to journey with folks online from all over
34:47
the world around themes of coming out and being the intersections of queer and Christian.
34:54
So I didn't set that clip up perfectly. The last part of that clip, because again,
35:00
they're talking about Christian closet, it actually goes to another zoom meeting where this person
35:04
from Christian closet and you can hear her talk about what it is. It's this gay affirming LGBTQ
35:09
plus affirming supposedly Christian organization. And it looked like there was like three or four
35:14
five other people in the video. And they are essentially being part of a training for all this.
35:19
So in light of everything I just went through, okay, we've got Andy Stanley who is completely
35:25
dismissive of God's word and is essentially 100% LGBTQ affirming, even though apparently he's too
35:33
cowardly to just come out and say that. But when you have people on staff that are being paid
35:38
presumably by your tithes to all you people that go to that church, right? When you tithe or donate
35:43
to that ministry, you're helping pay the salary of somebody that is trying to convince people
35:47
that that are gay or whatever that that's okay. That that's just the way that God made you and
35:52
he loves you anyway, right? You know, you don't need to change at all, right? You know, Jesus
35:56
or whatever, like you're just fine. So why all this is so dangerous? There's a lot of reasons why
36:01
all this is so dangerous and concerning. The first thing is that Andy Stanley leads one of the largest
36:06
churches in America. I think as of right now, it's the second largest church in America.
36:09
He has a lot of influence literally over tens of thousands of people that go to his church
36:14
and then the millions of people that pay attention to him. And Andy Stanley as well influences
36:19
tens of thousands of pastors, minimum worldwide. It's hard to get an exact number of the pastors
36:26
that are listening to Andy Stanley Sermons, but he's influencing all of them with his chosen
36:32
theology, right? And also his success has caused people to stop checking him.
36:38
And you guys know how this is. Like whenever you've been around somebody that's maybe really
36:42
successful in business or really successful athlete or maybe they're an influence or something like
36:46
that. And then they say something that is wrong, like completely wrong or they've lied about
36:50
something and you don't call them out because they're so successful. Because he's been so
36:55
successful for so long, that has caused people to really to stop like checking on him or checking
36:59
him when he says something crazy. And also why this is so dangerous and concerning. My last point
37:04
here is he seemingly has a growing distaste for the word of God. It's not like, you know, he started
37:10
thinking, yeah, you know, the Bible is probably not that accurate. You know, we don't need to,
37:13
you know, deal with these 66 books and make sure they're, they're all correct and all those different
37:17
things. Over time, his comments are becoming more and more dismissive of the word of God.
37:23
Again, one thing that I've tried to tell people that I'm trying to do is I don't, I don't say
37:27
the Bible says anymore. I say God says through his word. That's what I'm trying to change my
37:31
brain to be like, because it's not the Bible says it's God says, because that is his word, right?
37:36
And there's, there's ultimately this terrible formula at play here. It's, you know, attractive
37:41
personality, plus wildly gifted communicator, plus large audience, plus church success, plus
37:49
commercial success, plus no biblical accountability, plus you not reading your Bible, plus them not
37:55
teaching the Bible equals almost certain disaster. Okay. There's just this witches brew of nonsense
38:03
that is leading to a disastrous outcome for the earthly kingdom of God. Okay. But all this leads
38:11
to a big question here. Is it fair to call Andy Stanley a heretic? Because again, whenever I talked
38:18
about that, you know, an episode, what was a 23 and 82 or whatever, I stopped short of saying
38:23
that he was a heretic. But for those of you that maybe aren't even familiar with, with that label,
38:27
there's actually a definition from the American heritage dictionary of the English language.
38:30
It's this. This is what a heretic is specifically in theology, a professed believer who adopts and
38:36
persistently maintains religious opinions contrary to the accepted standards of his church. Okay. Now,
38:44
some people are like, Oh, you can't be here to take unless it's Catholic. No, no, no, this expands
38:47
to all of Christendom. Okay. Which leads to another question. Is Andy Stanley a heretic?
38:53
Or is he just saying heretical things? Okay. Now, the reason I bring that up is because I think
38:59
I've said on the show before I certainly maintain this opinion. But you know, when people talk about
39:03
racism, like are you a racist? If you say or do something that is racist. So, so as an example,
39:11
let's say you tell a racist joke, right? Where the punchline of the joke is categorizing people
39:17
based on their immutable characteristic of how much melanin they have in their skin. Okay,
39:20
that is a racist joke. Does that make you a racist? Because I would say no,
39:26
laughing at a racist joke or saying a racist joke again, I don't think that that's a edifying
39:31
thing. I don't think God would want you to do those things. Again, James, too, we should have no
39:35
partiality whatsoever. But I don't think that makes you a racist. I don't think if you laugh at a racist
39:40
joke that you should be branded for the rest of your life as a racist. Being a racist is a decision
39:46
that you've made in your heart to see people that don't look like you of any color and you can be
39:52
any color and looking at them and judging them harshly just based on their immutable characteristic
39:58
of the level of melanin in their skin. That's what racism is. So when a black person looks at an Asian
40:03
person and says, man, you know, this Asian or whatever, that's a racist thing. When they dismiss
40:08
somebody, when a white person does that with a Latino person or whatever connection of races that
40:12
you can make, that's what you're communicating is that in your heart, you believe that you are
40:17
better than them because of an immutable characteristic that you have that they don't. That's racism.
40:22
Okay. But in this instance, I do not think that you can separate the teachings and embracing of
40:29
heresy and the person doing the teaching because these things that Andy Stanley thinks that he has
40:36
formulated into thoughts that he has shared with the world through spoken word and written word,
40:41
that is what he believes. These are heretical, anti-biblical, A-biblical viewpoints. Okay. They come
40:49
from the pits of hell and he keeps maintaining those viewpoints and doubling down on them.
40:54
So to answer the question, is it fair to call Andy Stanley a heretic? Yes. And I will do so.
41:00
And I will continue to do so unless he changes more on that in a second. But there's also a big
41:04
question that you have to ask yourself here. Where can Andy Stanley go from here? So my guess
41:11
is further down the path of heresy because guys, there are no signs that he intends to repent
41:17
and turn around from the stuff that he's teaching and saying. Again, he's literally doubling down
41:22
every chance he gets. He does the sermon series, says we should unhitch the Old Testament from
41:26
the New Testament. This big, you know, craziness pops up. He does a bunch of interviews and then
41:30
he writes a book, best-selling book, irresistible that people read and they're like, Oh, yeah,
41:35
totally get it. Because again, he's pragmatic. And he's got to, he's very, very smart. He's
41:40
literally one of the most gifted communicators in all in Christendom. Christendom. That's why he's
41:44
so effective. And that's why this is so dangerous. Now, my prediction. Now, I hope this is wrong.
41:50
I literally don't want this to be true. I think that he will eventually, probably in the next few
41:56
years, come out explicitly as LGBTQ affirming. Because again, he's kind of been really cagey
42:01
about it, right? But I think he's going to explicitly come out and do a sermon or a sermon series
42:06
being full on affirming. I think that's just about guaranteed at this point. But my deeper
42:11
prediction is that eventually he'll deconstruct. So for those of you that aren't familiar with
42:18
that, that is where someone who is a prominent Christian, typically a prominent Christian,
42:21
they deconstruct their faith and then they lose it. He may go full deconstruction. Again,
42:27
I hope that he doesn't do that. But this is where this path leads. When he talks to be able to
42:31
have deconstructed their Christian faith, a lot of it started with LGBTQ plus stuff. Well, but I
42:37
love my gay friends. And then all of a sudden, they don't believe in God anymore. They don't
42:40
believe in the sufficiency of the blood of Jesus, right? Or abortion or some other typically left
42:45
wing viewpoint on a particular issue that we see in society. Okay. Now, before I wrap up on Andy
42:50
Stanley, I want you to stick with me. Okay. This is a sidebar and a side note. And this isn't me
42:55
just like throwing stones. I'm just making you guys aware because this is something that was just
42:59
like clinging around in my brain. So I've got to get it out there to you guys. Okay. Everyone
43:04
that listened to this show or that's going to watch this later, share it around, that likes or as a
43:08
fan of Craig Rochelle of life church needs to heed this warning I'm about to give you. Please do not
43:15
put your faith in Craig Rochelle or his church. And for that matter, and I've said this a lot before,
43:23
please listen to me. Don't put your faith in any senior pastor at any church. So if you're a Craig
43:30
Rochelle guy or you're a TD Jakes guy, or you're a John MacArthur guy, or you're a Matt Chandler guy,
43:36
or if you're a Joby Martin guy, or if you're a whoever guy, do not put your faith in people.
43:42
Because I didn't list those people because I think they're going to do something crazy.
43:47
But all of them are certainly capable of it because all of us are capable of doing saying
43:53
and acting out in horrifically destructive, sinful ways. So if you put your faith in a senior pastor
44:00
or a teaching pastor or a church or a ministry, look at Ravi Zacharias. RZIM doesn't exist anymore.
44:06
Ravi Zacharias International Ministries, the entire thing folded because of him,
44:11
right? Because he was a sexual deviant. And so many people put their faith in RZIM and in Ravi
44:17
Zacharias. If you put your faith in anyone or anything other than Christ, you will be found
44:22
wanting at some point. But back to my point here. Specifically, I want to talk about Craig Rochelle
44:27
in life church. You probably heard this quote before. This is from an entrepreneur, author,
44:33
motivational speaker, guy named Jim Rohn. So he once said, you are the average of the five people
44:38
you spend the most time with. So essentially, the message is who you associate with says a lot
44:42
about you and who you are. So I want to take you through a list of some of the men that Craig Rochelle
44:48
has lent his pulpit to. Again, I attended Craig Rochelle's church for like 11 or 12 years.
44:53
And I saw all these people speak at his church. First, Bill Heibels of Willow Creek Community Church,
45:00
who I know, know for a fact was a personal mentor to Craig, or at least still is. He was
45:04
credibly accused of sexual assault. And he essentially was forced to resign from his job as senior
45:08
pastor at his church that he founded. Brian Houston, founder of Hillsong Church. He covered up child
45:14
sexual assault by his own father. Essentially, he was forced to resign from his job as senior
45:20
pastor for a church that he founded. And he could end up going to jail for what he did. He's currently,
45:24
you know, going through trial at the beginning part of this year. Then we've got Carl Lince,
45:28
Hillsong, New York City. He cheated on his wife with multiple women amongst other moral failings.
45:33
And he was fired as lead pastor of Hillsong NYC. Stephen Furtick, founder of Elevation Church.
45:38
Apparently, he's super close with Craig, or at least wasn't one time, but I think they're still
45:41
super tight. He preached multiple, he has preached multiple heretical things and could easily be
45:46
categorized as a false teacher. Andy Stanley, founder of North Point Community Church, as we've
45:51
discussed at length on this episode, guilty of preaching heretical things and could easily be
45:55
categorized as a false teacher. And here's the thing, the reason why I bring up all those guys that I
46:00
know of, and there's certainly more, but those are the ones I wanted to highlight. If it would shock
46:04
you to hear that Craig Rochelle is guilty of something heinous, or goes full woke heretical
46:11
pastor at some point in the future, or does something that that is a moral failing that would
46:17
basically say, you know, you could no longer have this job as senior pastor. If that would shock you,
46:22
you're a fool and a sheep. And again, this isn't me just throwing stones at Craig Rochelle just for
46:27
fun. I don't know him to have any moral failings as a person. And I'm certainly not saying that's
46:33
going to happen. There's nothing in me that would ever want such a thing to happen for him to have
46:38
some sort of moral failing or some sort of horribly egregious thing. But it wouldn't surprise me one
46:42
bit. I mean, look at the people he has shared his pulpit with is somehow Craig Rochelle,
46:51
fundamentally different from those other men. He might be. He certainly might be. But until we
46:58
knew all the depraved things that those other men did, we just thought he was just a normal,
47:02
great speaker, great guy, great church leader, great, you know, expositor of the well, not really
47:08
expositor, but you know, a great preacher of the word, or you know, great life lesson guy,
47:12
or you know, good guy in business. And look at this big church. Again, Craig Rochelle is very similar
47:18
in terms of his, you know, public Christian profile to all of those men that have now been
47:23
bounced out of ministry because of the heinous things that they did. So again, I'm not just throwing
47:27
stones at Craig Rochelle for no reason. I don't think he's going to do any of those things.
47:31
And I'm certainly praying that he never does anything crazy. But if it would surprise you and
47:35
shock you, man, you really need to get your head out of sand. But let's get back to Andy Stanley.
47:39
So what are we to do about Andy Stanley? The people listening to this podcast right now,
47:44
I'll give you a few reasons or a few things that you can do rather. Number one, we must judge him.
47:51
We must judge him fairly, but firmly. So I'm going to take you to 1 Corinthians 5, 12 through 13.
47:59
For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to
48:06
judge? God judges those outside purge the evil person from among you. So when you get this,
48:13
we shouldn't judge people crown near you're acting like a Pharisee and you're just throwing
48:16
stones for no reason, crowd. We are given this biblical dictate via God, via Paul writing to
48:22
the 1st century church in Corinth that we are to judge people that are inside the church.
48:30
Fairly, but firmly, we are to do that. So we must judge him as followers of Christ that are part of
48:38
God's macro church here. The second thing we're to do with Andy Stanley is we must call him out.
48:45
We must. That's why I'm doing the show. We're close to an hour in of me calling out Andy Stanley
48:50
publicly. Go back to Galatians two versus 11 through 14. You know, I'm not going to read it here,
48:55
but we did an entire the forging episode on Galatians two where we go into that. That's where Paul
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rebuked Peter in public for everyone to see. Okay. He called him out because he was being
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sinful and he was leading people down a destructive path. We must do the same. We also
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must pray that Andy Stanley repents. We have to pray that he repents of this and repenting is not
49:20
saying, Oh God, I'm sorry. Will you forgive me? It's literally turning away from your sin 180 degrees
49:26
turning away from your sin. So let's read 2 Chronicles 7, 14. If my people who are called by my name
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humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear
49:38
from heaven and will forgive their sin and heal their land. But they need to pray,
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seek his face and turn or repent from their wicked ways. Also acts 319, repent therefore
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and turn back that your sins may be blotted out. Because guys, if he doesn't repent,
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then we should hope that he has some sort of moral failing or something else that basically
50:07
says you're disqualified from vocational ministry. I know that's kind of weird. Like,
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you know, I just got through saying with Craig, I hope that doesn't happen. But if Andy Stanley
50:15
keeps going down this path, we need to root for something that will get him out of ministry.
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No, that doesn't mean he gets beat up or that he gets killed or no, I'm not advocating for violence
50:24
against Andy Stanley to repeat. I'm not advocating for violence against Andy Stanley,
50:28
but we should hope that he will no longer have the platform that he is used to become a destructive
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force in Christendom. We should hope for that. Some sort of moral failing or some sort of whatever he
50:40
just decides to retire. We should hope for that. And the fourth thing in terms of Andy Stanley is
50:45
until or unless he does repent, I call on everyone that attends North Point Community Church,
50:52
which is, you know, the headship or the, you know, flagship church, I guess,
50:55
and any of their separate campuses. So that's Browns Bridge Church, Buckhead Church, Decatur
51:00
City Church, East Cobb Church, Gwynette Church, Hamilton Mill Church, or Woodstock City Church,
51:05
or any of their network churches that pipe in his sermons and or, you know, sits under his
51:10
leadership and guidance to leave those churches immediately and make sure you let the church know
51:16
why. So I posted something about Andy Stanley last week on Instagram and I get an email from a guy
51:21
that goes to one of these network churches. And he's like, man, you know, my wife and I, you know,
51:26
we made great friends here and this is like our community. This is our tribe. But you know,
51:30
our church just uses Andy Stanley sermons and we sit under his leadership and obviously he's saying
51:34
these crazy things and he just went viral this week. You know, what am I to do? Like, should I just
51:38
quietly leave or blah, blah. And my advice to him when I responded to him, I was like, no,
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you should leave loudly. Let everyone in your small group know why you and your wife are leaving
51:48
the church and try to bring them with you. Now they may not really care and maybe they're not
51:51
really serious about their Christian walk. And maybe they're not really Christians. Maybe they
51:54
don't understand what heresy is. Maybe it's just like, oh, he's just, you know, giving, you know,
51:57
good life advice. Like what's the big deal? But at the end of the day, his responsibility is to him
52:02
and his wife and, you know, the catacizing of his entire family. And so I was like, you need to leave
52:06
that church and go to a church where there's an expository preacher that goes line by line through
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the Bible and doesn't just add a bunch of life lesson stuff. Again, that's why I was attracted to
52:15
Andy Stanley back in the day and his teaching because it was so practical and so applicable to,
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you know, excuse me, it was so applicable to kind of everything in my life that I was going through
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at that time, right? But if you're going in one of those churches right now, if he's not going to
52:30
repent for this, you have to get out because it will not get better. You think he's just going to stop
52:35
with the LGBTQ plus affirming? You think he's just going to all of a sudden,
52:38
a fall in love with the Bible? Again, I certainly hope so. I pray that that happens. But you cannot
52:44
torpedo your family because Andy Stanley is trying to be, you know, as, you know, widely available
52:50
and popular with an audience of people that hate him, right? I'm talking about non-Christians and
52:54
secularists. They may wink and nod at the stuff that you're saying, but ultimately they are of a
52:58
different worldview than you. They hate you, but he doesn't really understand that.
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And the last thing that we need to really think about and do in terms of the Sandy Stanley thing
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is we must rest easy knowing that he will face judgment for how he has shepherded his flock. He
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will. Hebrews 13 17, obey your leaders and submit to them for they are keeping watch over your souls
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and those who will have to give an account. Let him do this with joy and not with groaning
53:27
for that would be of no advantage to you. Here's the key as those who will have to give an account.
53:32
When he goes before God, when he dies, he is going to have to give an account for how he has
53:40
shepherded his flock. Every pastor in these churches, they will have to give an account
53:47
for how they've shepherded their flock. So Andy Stanley will stand before God and have to try to
53:53
make his case for why he is teaching people the heretical things that he's teaching them.
53:58
So to conclude, as of right now, Andy Stanley is a heretic 100%. But he doesn't have to stay
54:07
that way. He can and should repent. And let's pray that he does so. All right, guys, before we let
54:13
you go, we are going to do a quick resilience boost out undaunted life or mission is equipping
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50% of that money will go to support what we're doing here with undaunted life. And the other
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50% is going to go to save babies through the hope pregnancy center here in Oklahoma City area
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in Edmund where I live. And then everything else I've got in the show notes, I'm not going to actually
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list them all. But everything that I like sign posted in the talk of like, Oh, here's this link
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and I'll put that in the show notes. All that will be right here. So you can check all that out.
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On Facebook and check out our website for everything else, including how to donate to keep
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more content like this coming your way. Just go to www dot undaunted dot life. And as always,
55:23
we want to thank the band August Burns read for allowing us to use their music for our content.
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The musical in this podcast is our song cutting the tides, which is off their 10th anniversary
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re recording of their album leveler. The links are in the description. I'm your host Kyle Thompson.
55:37
Remember, keep pushing back darkness, keep forging spiritual, mental and physical resilience.
55:43
Keep seeking the lion of Judah.
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