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This is Undaunted Life of Man's podcast.
0:33
I'm your host Kyle Thompson.
0:35
Let's get into it.
0:39
Let me say how much I love you.
0:42
Let me speak of your mercy and grace.
0:45
Just let me live in the shadow of your beauty.
0:48
Let me see you face to face.
0:51
Just let me hear your finest whispers as you gently call my name.
0:56
And let me see your power and your glory.
0:59
Let me see your spirits flame.
1:02
So let me say how much I love you with all my heart I long for you, for I am caught in
1:09
this passion of knowing this endless love I've found in you.
1:19
So if you've listened to this podcast for any length of time, you're a little bit caught
1:24
off guard by that intro, and I hope that is the case because you might be thinking to
1:28
yourself right now, wow, Kyle, that was beautiful.
1:32
Was that Shakespeare?
1:34
And no, no, it wasn't Shakespeare.
1:36
You know, you might be thinking, wow, Kyle, that that was so moving.
1:40
Did you write that for your wife?
1:42
And I would have to say, unfortunately, no, I did not do that.
1:45
You might even be saying, you know, wow, Kyle, that was so titillating.
1:48
Was that from a romcom?
1:50
Nope.
1:52
Those were just a selection of lyrics from the song.
1:56
Just let me say by Hillsong worship.
2:00
So for today's episode, we're going to talk about something that I've promised that I
2:05
was going to talk about for literally years now.
2:08
Okay.
2:09
I've literally been promising.
2:10
I was going to talk about the subject of contemporary worship music and today is finally
2:14
the day.
2:15
Guys, I think I mentioned on episode like one and four of this podcast.
2:19
I'm talking back in 2017, 2018 that I was going to talk about men, manhood and contemporary
2:26
worship music and how those things are kind of like oil and water.
2:29
But here, I'm finally doing it.
2:31
But before we really get into the meat potatoes of the podcast today, I need to talk a little
2:35
bit about my own personal history with contemporary worship music.
2:39
And guys, there's a lot of ways to describe it categorically.
2:42
Some people just call it contemporary worship music.
2:44
Some people just call it worship music.
2:45
Some call it modern worship music, you know, there's a lot of different ways to describe
2:48
it.
2:49
But for the most part today, I'm going to say contemporary worship music.
2:51
Now for me, my first exposure to any type of, you know, quote, unquote church music was
2:57
being at the church of Christ in Lawton, Oklahoma.
3:00
So my mom was raised kind of the church of Christ sort of a thing wasn't really that
3:05
big of a part of her life or her family's life.
3:07
But that was kind of my first exposure.
3:08
So I would have been in elementary school.
3:09
And if you know anything about the church Christ, I know, especially here in the United
3:12
States is there is no musical accompaniment to them.
3:16
It's just a cappella, it's just voices, the first second and fourth verses, never the
3:21
third verse.
3:22
And that was basically my exposure.
3:24
Then I started going to a Baptist church in junior high school, and they kind of had,
3:28
you know, the typical organ and piano worship service with one guy kind of leading worship
3:34
and, you know, doing the hand signals for music and all that, I'm not really a music
3:37
guy.
3:38
But that was kind of my next exposure to worship music, but then some of the people in there,
3:43
they listened to contemporary worship music, so they were listening to, you know, news
3:46
boys or DC talk or stuff like that.
3:49
And so I kind of got a little exposure to it there.
3:52
And I also remember, and I'll remember this for the rest of my life, Pastor Jamie, a first
3:57
Baptist West when I was in high school, I got saved as a 10th grader.
4:00
But you know, I was part of the youth group and I'm there for Sunday, Sunday morning
4:04
service.
4:05
And I remember when I first started going to that church, the pastor said something along
4:09
the lines of if you don't like worship music, then you better get used to it.
4:15
Because that's all they're going to be singing in heaven.
4:19
And all I can remember thinking is how miserable that sounded, like in my head, it was just
4:26
going to be one long worship service in heaven.
4:29
And I could not fathom having to deal with that for eternity.
4:33
Because to be frank and to be honest, I never really enjoyed the Christian music that I was
4:39
listening to.
4:40
I didn't enjoy the music at the church of Christ really.
4:42
But then as there was more musical accompaniment, like in the Baptist church or even whenever,
4:48
you know, the youth band would play from from here or there, I just didn't really like most
4:52
of the songs.
4:53
There was just something in me that that I couldn't really get into.
4:56
And I know that that's reflective of a lot of guys, but I do want to say a few things
4:59
real quick before we get into the subject matter because it could be potentially offensive
5:02
for for some of you.
5:04
The main reason for this episode today is not to, you know, dog on your taste in music.
5:10
If you just so happen to love the music, they play on K love.
5:13
I'm not dogging on your taste in music.
5:15
Everyone's got their own taste in music.
5:16
Some people are more eclectic.
5:17
Some people stay in their category.
5:19
Some people don't even listen to music.
5:20
So it is what it is.
5:22
Also another main reason is not to critique for the sake of critiquing because I will
5:26
be fairly critical of different things in this podcast today, but I'm not doing it just
5:30
for the sake of critiquing.
5:31
And I'm also not trying to be needlessly offensive.
5:33
I know it's kind of easy to poke fun at people that like things or do things that you're
5:37
not really a fan of.
5:38
That has nothing to do with this episode for today.
5:41
The main reason for this episode is to put forward this message.
5:47
If you don't like contemporary worship music, that's okay.
5:54
That's okay.
5:56
Now that might seem like that's a small or maybe unimportant goal, but really it's not
6:02
because there is this feeling put out there in modern Christian circles that if you don't
6:07
like contemporary worship music that you are somehow the problem.
6:13
So a few years back, a worship leader buddy of mine, he and I are buddies not because of
6:17
worship music, we're just buddies because we're buddies, but he leads worship at a local church
6:21
here.
6:22
And this is a church that would consider themselves to be kind of worship centric.
6:25
A lot of things kind of hinge on their music and it's a more of a, I don't know really
6:31
how they would categorize themselves, so I don't want to, don't want to say something
6:34
that's not true.
6:35
But I remember me and this guy were sitting down and we were kind of having this chat
6:37
about how I'm not really a fan of Christian music, I'm not really a fan of worship music
6:41
especially.
6:42
And he literally told me that I needed to get saved because in his mind, in his artistic,
6:49
you know, worship leader mind, I didn't like people because I didn't like the type of music
6:54
that he and his band made or that similar bands make that I was somehow not saved.
7:01
Now aside from that being highly offensive, I just kind of laughed it off because I'm
7:04
not really a guy that gets offended so easily by stuff like that.
7:07
But you see, there is that attitude in some people that if you don't like music, if you
7:11
don't lift your hands during worship, that something's broken.
7:15
Perhaps you're not even saved because I know that there are a lot of men that do not like
7:19
contemporary music, worship music, okay, but they don't voice that or talk about it because
7:25
of the level of shame that is brought on them when they admit something like that.
7:30
Like it doesn't literally make sense to some people that you can be a Christian and hate
7:34
the music that Christians produce.
7:37
So I honestly believe a large reason why many men avoid going to church at all is because
7:44
they can't stay in the music.
7:45
I think that has a lot to do with it actually.
7:48
There's obviously more reasons that I've talked about that at nausea on this podcast
7:51
and in other episodes.
7:53
But music is something that communicates to the soul and the heart of a person, but many
7:58
men just aren't stirred by the overwhelming majority of contemporary worship music or the
8:03
music that they hear in churches.
8:05
And let me say one thing as well as a little bit of an aside here.
8:08
I don't want it to ever come off like I'm being critical of these worship bands on Sundays
8:14
that are really given at their all.
8:16
For the most part, any church that you go to that has any type of a band or something
8:20
like that, these are volunteers.
8:22
Perhaps the worship leader is paid by the church, but there's a lot of churches that don't
8:26
even pay their worship leader.
8:27
Maybe they give them a little stipend here there, you know, to kind of make it worth
8:30
their time.
8:31
But a lot of these people, they don't make, they don't make really good money.
8:34
The rest of the people in the band, the guitars and the basis and the keyboard player, these
8:37
people are just volunteers.
8:40
And so I think there is kind of this overreaction to worship music where you just start dogging
8:44
every contemporary worship band.
8:46
If they're on the radio and they're touring and making money, I think they're kind of,
8:49
you know, fair game, but you know, I'm not going to be an overly critical of people that
8:52
just give it their all, their, their decent at their instrument and they donate their time
8:56
to their church because I feel like that's valuable.
8:58
But I'm going to talk about a lot of things in this podcast, but I, I'm going to kick
9:01
it off here with the top problems with contemporary worship music and I, and I have eight of them.
9:06
And guys, I had to kind of whittle this list down.
9:08
And so you might be like, good grief, a list of eight.
9:10
That's a huge list, but let's just go and fire up, you know, go in here.
9:13
The top eight problems that I have with contemporary worship music.
9:17
Number one, and these are in no particular order, by the way, number one, this is primarily
9:20
the biggest problem.
9:21
It has become the reason why people go to a particular church or support a particular
9:28
ministry.
9:29
So you think about it.
9:30
It's like, oh, hey, are you a Hillsong person or are you in a elevation person or are you
9:35
a Bethel person, right?
9:37
It's like you're categorically a type of person because of the worship that you listen to.
9:42
Or I don't really go to that church because they play a little bit more Bethel and I'm
9:45
more of an elevation guy, you know, that you kind of hear people say that.
9:48
But also, if you heard some people say this, that and you maybe even heard yourself say
9:53
it, we left that church because the music wasn't very good or it wasn't really our style.
9:58
Right?
9:59
I've said that before, but worship music and the type of music played at the church you
10:04
go to has been the reason why people associate themselves with a particular church feel like
10:08
this problem.
10:09
Another problem, this is number two, it puts the attention on you and not God.
10:15
If you step back and gosh, you guys are going to be doing this a lot after this episode,
10:19
if you step back and just watch the lyrics go by on the screen as you're singing them,
10:25
most of the songs are me centric.
10:29
What God can do for me, how God feels about me, how I'm emoting in this situation.
10:36
They're not about the God of the universe.
10:39
They're not about the Creator.
10:41
And that's a huge problem because we're not the point.
10:45
It's kind of like you've heard some pastors say, if you read the Bible and think it's
10:48
about you, you're missing the point entirely.
10:50
Same thing with worship music.
10:52
Third problem I have with contemporary worship music is it reduces the God of all creation
10:58
to your buddy.
10:59
He's just your buddy.
11:01
Like God is my friend and it's just like, how can we talk about the omniscient, omnipresent,
11:08
omnip everything, God in a way that would reduce him to being our buddy that we would
11:13
just hang out with casually.
11:15
It's inappropriate.
11:17
Another reason, another problem with contemporary worship music is number four.
11:20
It reduces Jesus our Lord and Savior to a boyfriend.
11:25
Yeah, some people just got offended with that one, but again, if you look at the lyrical
11:30
content, just go back to the lyrics I read from the beginning.
11:33
And that sounds like a person singing about the grandeur of God or the totality of the
11:40
grace of Jesus of Jesus Christ.
11:43
No, it's just this cute guy named Jesus who we just love and we just want to embrace him
11:50
and bring him close to our bosoms, right?
11:53
It reduces Jesus to this small thing, small enough for us to understand and roll up in
11:58
our pocket and walk away with, but not big enough to understand who he really is.
12:03
Theologically, another problem with modern or contemporary worship music, number five,
12:09
the Lion of Judah is unmentioned and unmentionable because he is unsafe.
12:15
I mean, funny enough, this morning at church, we did sing a song that talked about the Lion
12:20
of Judah.
12:21
The rest of the content of the song wasn't really that great, but it did talk about the
12:24
Lion of Judah.
12:25
But guys, can you think about the number of times you've heard the Lion of Judah mentioned
12:29
in a worship song versus the Lamb of God?
12:34
And part of the reason why it's not mentioned during the worship and also why your pastor
12:38
doesn't mention it is because the Lion of Judah is kind of scary.
12:41
The Jesus of Revelation is pretty scary.
12:45
He's not as easy to cuddle up with.
12:47
And that's a problem for some of these people.
12:50
The sixth problem I have with contemporary worship music is this.
12:53
It puts an overemphasis on emotions and we'll get more into that in the next section.
12:58
But that's part of the reason why it doesn't really jive with a lot of guys is because
13:00
we don't tend to be overly emotional.
13:02
We're not all out in tune with our emotions, but we're just not emotional.
13:08
The seventh problem with contemporary worship music is that it's just flat out, not good
13:12
musically.
13:13
I mean, if you think about it, most modern worship music is simple.
13:17
It's repetitive.
13:18
It's formulaic.
13:19
Maybe it lets the shift gears a little bit.
13:22
Part of the problem that people have with country music is it's very formulaic.
13:26
You know, what is it, three bars on the truth, you know, that's how many number one hit songs
13:30
have been written like that.
13:31
If you look like at some of the kind of classical country guys, like maybe a Clint Black or
13:36
a George Strait or those types of guys, Johnny Cash even, you know, more outlaw country,
13:41
these types of guys, their songs sounded very much the same.
13:44
They found a formula and they just rinsed and repeated it.
13:47
We see that a lot in modern worship music as well.
13:49
And here's the thing guys is Christians should be able to produce the most impressive music
13:56
considering how they should be able to have a deeper level of the overall grandeur and
14:02
beauty and power of God.
14:04
I've heard that point made before that like, man, if you really understand the face of
14:08
God and the beauty of creation and the craziness of grace for all of our sins, that should open
14:15
you up in a in a way more creative way, but then consistently the best music across the
14:21
board in the open market for the music industry is created by secular people, people that
14:26
wouldn't consider themselves Christ followers.
14:29
And the last problem with modern worship music is it's theologically bankrupt.
14:35
It's just bankrupt.
14:37
There are no theological truths.
14:40
There's no deep level of truth in any of these songs.
14:44
They were made to be catchy.
14:46
They were made to where the chorus would stick in your brain so that when you're skipping
14:50
out of church that day, you're just humming that course, right, you know, singing it
14:53
on the way home or whatever.
14:55
But with a lot of things that I literally just got through talking to a buddy of mine
14:58
who's fairly theologically adept, we were talking about Bethel and we were talking about
15:02
another one.
15:03
Jesus culture or something like that, I wasn't very familiar with it that he mentioned, but
15:07
it's like a lot of times what these people are singing about.
15:11
It's not stuff that you could base in the bot in in the Bible.
15:15
You couldn't trace it back the thoughts to anything inside the Bible.
15:20
And that becomes a large issue, especially when most modern Christians don't read their
15:24
Bibles.
15:25
So when your pastor says something that is theologically incorrect or when the worship
15:29
leader is singing about something that's theologically incorrect and you don't read your Bible and
15:34
you don't hang out with anybody else that reads their Bible, you're going to miss it.
15:38
You're just going to take it and accept what these people are saying.
15:41
So those are the top eight problems that I have with modern worship music and temporary
15:45
worship music, but now I want to shift gears into the top five reasons why contemporary
15:51
worship music is for women and effeminate men.
15:55
So obviously the title of this podcast, that's the title of this podcast.
15:58
It's going to offend a lot of people.
15:59
A lot of people aren't even going to listen to this show.
16:01
They're just going to pass by and assume they know what I meant.
16:03
But I'm going to give you the five reasons why contemporary worship music is for women
16:09
and effeminate men.
16:10
So here we go.
16:11
Women literally consume it way more than men do.
16:17
So I'm going to read an excerpt from a book by David Moreau.
16:20
It's called Why Men Hate Going to Church.
16:22
That's on our 100 books.
16:23
Every modern Christian man should read lists.
16:25
It's on our website.
16:26
Just go to www dot on dot to dot life backslash book list and I'm going to read several excerpts
16:31
from this book today because a lot of my initial thoughts kind of came from David Moreau and
16:35
some of the things that he said in this book that I read, I don't know, probably close
16:38
to 10 years ago now, but let me go and read this to you here.
16:42
Women are more likely to listen to their local Christian radio station.
16:45
Radio listeners in general are the exact replica of a of the population, 51.7% female,
16:52
48.3% male, but Christian AC radio, the format playing on most contemporary Christian music
16:58
stations today draws an audience that's 63% female and 37% male Christian stations garner
17:05
on average 21% more female listeners than do mainstream stations.
17:10
I do not know of any Christian radio station anywhere on Earth that draws as many male
17:15
as female listeners.
17:16
Caleb, America's largest syndicated Christian music radio network, targets its programming
17:21
to at 18 to 45 year old females.
17:24
Two thirds of Caleb's listeners are women.
17:27
In sister service, the upbeat air one also draws twice as many gals as guys Christian
17:33
radio stations around the nation report up to three quarters of their core listeners
17:37
are female.
17:38
Okay.
17:39
So when I say women literally consume it way more than men do, it's because they literally
17:43
consume it way more than men do.
17:45
And part of the thing is, is because it's marketed to them.
17:49
It's made for them and for their sensibilities into their liking.
17:54
And here's the thing.
17:56
Can you really blame these Christian radio stations and Christian bookstores?
18:01
I mean, if most of your buying audience is women, then why not cater to them?
18:06
I mean, can you really blame the churches?
18:09
I mean, if most of your congregation, most of your, you know, plugged in congregation
18:12
are women, why not cater to them?
18:15
I'm not blaming them.
18:16
It's just the reality.
18:18
The overwhelming majority of this music is made for women because it's consumed by them.
18:23
And the second thing I want to talk about here, the second reason why it's for women
18:26
and effeminate men is because of the emphasis is on emotion and feelings.
18:31
So I mentioned this a little bit earlier, but I'm going to pick back up on that same quote
18:34
from why men hate going to church.
18:36
Here we go.
18:37
As the name implies, K loves playlists is heavy on love songs, tunes that express our
18:42
love for God and his love for us.
18:44
Like most Christian music stations, K love shies away from anything edgy or raucous.
18:49
Its on-air slogans are positive, encouraging and safe for the whole family.
18:54
It's not unusual for Caleb to play a heart-tugging testimonial from a listener whose life was deeply
19:00
touched in some way by something she heard on the station.
19:04
The Caleb diss jockeys have created a mythical average listener whom they call Kathy.
19:10
She is a mother in her mid-30s with two kids, a minivan and a mortgage.
19:14
Kathy is very busy driving her kids to soccer practice, piano lessons and youth group.
19:19
As she drives, she listens to Caleb.
19:22
Kathy's name comes up frequently during staff meetings and the DJs make sure their on-air
19:26
antics won't upset or offend her sensibilities.
19:31
So again, Caleb, air one, when you listen to these stations, it's a lot of very emotional
19:38
and emotive music.
19:40
That's something that appeals to a majority female audience.
19:44
Now, there are guys out there, even guys that listen to this podcast, guys that I appreciate
19:47
the listen to this podcast, that in their heart of hearts, they know they're a more
19:50
emotional guy, they're on the more emotional scale.
19:53
They want to talk about their emotions.
19:55
They express their emotions a lot and they're going to have a tendency to want to listen
19:59
to that type of music that tends to be a more effeminate quality, whether it's in a female
20:05
or a male.
20:07
So the third reason why modern worship music, contemporary worship music is for women and
20:12
effeminate men is because it is all lamb and no lion.
20:16
All lamb and no lion.
20:18
Again, I talked about earlier about how there's always mention of the lamb of God in the sermons
20:23
and in the music, but the lion of Judah, it's just like, ooh, it even sounds scarier, but
20:29
men are naturally more drawn to the strength of the lion of Judah than they are to the tenderness
20:36
of the lamb of God.
20:38
And I'd be remiss if I didn't point out something that I pointed out a lot.
20:41
I'm never, whenever I saw an eye, I saw an eye off by saying, you know, keep seeking the
20:44
lion of Judah, that doesn't mean that you shouldn't be seeking the lamb of God.
20:49
No, no, no, like don't misunderstand me, but everyone else is covering the lamb of God.
20:54
They got the lamb of God part on lock.
20:57
So I don't need to worry about talking about the lamb of God.
20:59
And I would never diminish the lamb of God in that way by saying you should only focus
21:03
on the lion of Judah.
21:05
The problem is, is when nobody talks about the lion of Judah, somebody has to fill the
21:09
gap.
21:10
So that's what I'm doing.
21:11
That's what this ministry, that's what undaunted life is here for, is to help you
21:14
seek the lion of Judah.
21:16
And I want you to keep seeking the lion of Judah.
21:18
That's why we sign off like that with every episode.
21:21
But again, men are more naturally drawn to strength unless they're an effeminate man and
21:27
then strength actually makes them turn inward.
21:29
So the fourth reason why contemporary worship music is for women and effeminate men is because
21:34
much of the music is written and or performed by effeminate men or by women.
21:41
So here's another excerpt from why men hate going to church.
21:45
As I visit various churches, one constant is the softness many worship leaders bring
21:49
to their ministry, softness in their personalities, their vocabulary, and the way they express
21:54
themselves.
21:55
Spiky hair, skinny jeans, fake plastic glasses, and flat-toed shoes are now standard attire
22:00
among worship leaders.
22:01
What causes this?
22:03
In the Old Testament, priests led worship.
22:05
So you had a diversity of personality types and leadership.
22:08
But today's worship leaders have one thing in common, they're all musicians.
22:13
That means the bulk of our worship pastors are right-brained artistic types.
22:17
They may be feminizing worship just by being themselves.
22:21
So this is another time for me to go back to say, I'm not trying to just needlessly offend
22:25
anybody because we need artists.
22:28
We need right-brained people.
22:29
But his point is not incorrect in that all the people that you see on stage that are male,
22:35
they all tend to be artists because they're musicians, and they were more attracted to
22:40
the artsy side of things that they were more attracted to the guitar and not the football.
22:46
And that doesn't make them bad in any way, shape, or form, it just makes them different.
22:50
But again, I'll read that part again.
22:52
That means the bulk of our worship pastors are right-brained artistic types.
22:55
They may be feminizing worship just by being themselves.
22:59
And so I think it's important for us to look at when we're looking up onto the stage, and
23:03
I recalled it this morning because I knew I was going to be recording this today.
23:07
And I looked at our stage, and there were 11 people, which, you know, that's a little
23:10
sidebar.
23:11
Do you really need that many people?
23:12
Like, do you really need seven people?
23:14
They're people?
23:15
You're not singing a seven-part harmony.
23:16
Not everyone needs a microphone.
23:17
But anyway, there were 11 people on stage, and there was a bunch of women, and the men
23:22
were fairly soft, soft-looking dudes, dudes that you would, you know, want to hold the
23:28
hand of your grandmother if she wasn't feeling well, but you wouldn't necessarily want them
23:31
by your side if you were charging up a hill, right, to go, you know, attack something that
23:35
was going on on the other side, okay?
23:37
But much of the music is written and/or performed by effeminate men or women, so you're obviously
23:42
going to have it bend more towards those people.
23:46
And the fifth and final reason why contemporary worship music is for women and effeminate men
23:50
is because if the lyrical content was actually written with men in mind, then it's homoerotic.
23:59
So let's go back to the stuff I read from the very beginning.
24:02
It's the "Just Let Me Say" by Hillsong.
24:04
Let me read this one section to you.
24:06
So let me say how much I love you with all my heart I long for you, for I am caught in
24:11
this passion of knowing this endless love I've found in you, okay?
24:18
I mean, that's supposed to be us singing to Jesus, right?
24:24
But it just seems like it's two dudes talking to one another and these two dudes may be attracted
24:30
to each other.
24:31
So I'm going to read another expert here from Why Men Hate Going to Church so I think it
24:35
will elucidate the point a little bit further, but here we go.
24:38
Picture two male hunters sitting in a duck blind, shotguns resting on their laps, one
24:43
hunter decides to express his affection for the other using the words of a popular praise
24:47
song.
24:48
He turns to his friend and says, "Hey, buddy, your love is extravagant.
24:53
Your friendship, it is intimate.
24:55
I feel I'm moving to the rhythm of your grace.
24:58
Your fragrance is intoxicating in this secret place."
25:01
That's a song by Darryl Evans called "Your Love Is Extravagant" for those wondering.
25:06
Readers, I cannot imagine saying these words to another man, especially one carrying a
25:10
loaded shotgun.
25:12
Lovey W. Praise songs force a man to express his affection to God using words he would
25:16
never, ever, ever say to another guy.
25:20
Even a guy he loves.
25:22
Even a guy named Jesus.
25:24
The Bible never describes our love for God in such erotic terms.
25:28
The men of Scripture loved God, but they were never desperate for him or in love with him.
25:35
Men are looking for a male leader, not a male lover.
25:41
And so when I see some of this lyrical content at my church, at other churches I've been
25:47
to, certainly at your church, and you read them as if you were reading it to another man,
25:52
it would come off as homoerotic.
25:55
And so a lot of people claim, "Oh, no, no, this song isn't written with women and effeminate
26:00
men in mine.
26:01
It's written for everybody in mine, especially the manly men."
26:03
Well, if so, it's homoerotic, which means it misses the mark just categorically.
26:09
So we've talked about some of the problems with contemporary worship music, the reasons
26:15
why I would say that it is for women and for effeminate men.
26:19
So what can be done about this?
26:21
And so I'm going to make some prescriptions for a couple of different groups here.
26:25
So I have some prescriptions for worship leaders, and then some prescriptions for men that are
26:30
like me, which I would say is the overwhelming majority of this audience.
26:33
So let's start off with the prescriptions for worship leaders.
26:35
And the reason why I'm going to address these people directly is because I know you're
26:38
listening.
26:39
I actually received an email from a worship leader, and it was great because he responded
26:44
to just the overall tone and tenor of what we do here with Undaunted Life, and it started
26:49
affecting what he was doing at his church, which was awesome.
26:52
Okay?
26:53
So here's my prescriptions for worship leaders.
26:55
I have several.
26:56
So first one's here, ask yourself, am I effeminate or am I soft?
27:04
And if the answer to that question or those questions is yes, then fix it.
27:13
Because the worship leader of that church, you are Ergo, a leader of that church.
27:18
And if there are men inside your church, that Ergo makes you a leader of men.
27:23
But men don't typically want to follow a soft effeminate man.
27:29
Men a lot of times also don't want to follow a woman for some of the same reasons, their
27:33
softness and their femininity.
27:36
And so if you find yourself on that spectrum, perhaps you are more right brain, perhaps
27:40
you are more artistic and thank God that he made you that way because we need you.
27:45
We need all kinds of people, but your softness and effeminacy could be a deterrent to your
27:51
ability to lead men and you need to fix it and you can fix it in a lot of different ways.
27:56
You can go to the Jiu Jitsu school, but if you're afraid, you're going to get your fingers
27:59
messed up and you're a guitarist, you can start doing triathlons, you can maybe start
28:03
doing CrossFit, you can, you know, those are all kind of workout examples.
28:07
But you know, try to really rough, make yourself a little rougher around the edges.
28:11
I just, I normally go to Jiu Jitsu because that's one of the easiest ways to create a
28:14
little bit of toughness and resilience.
28:16
Another prescription for worship leaders is this, consider the men, really consider the
28:22
men, consider them in your song selection, consider the men when deciding who you let
28:28
on stage, when deciding how to present yourself on stage.
28:33
So let's go back, let's talk about song selection.
28:35
So that's really something that I got from this worship leader that reached out to his
28:39
via emails.
28:40
He said, after listening to your podcast, I became way more aware of the men in my audience.
28:44
That might be really, really manly.
28:46
And so I try to pick songs that are going to speak to them a little bit more.
28:48
And I'm like, that's, that was just freaking awesome.
28:50
I loved that email.
28:52
I was so glad he sent that to me.
28:54
But then, you know, when deciding who you let on stage, again, there's this tendency by
28:58
worship leaders is they don't want to offend anybody and they don't want to, you know,
29:02
leave anybody out and there's this big stage, so why not add more people?
29:06
But adding three or four women on stage that aren't singing the harmonious parts, whose
29:09
microphones might not even be turned on.
29:12
What is that actually doing for the men?
29:15
And then also how you present yourself on stage.
29:17
Again, I'm not worried as much about what a worship leader wears.
29:21
Like, I know a lot of guys are concerned about, you know, worship leaders, jeans being too
29:25
tight and all that.
29:26
But hey, that's kind of a style thing and I'm not really a stylistic guy.
29:29
You know, I can't really deal with the tightness of jeans because I need my situation to have
29:33
room to operate if you know what I mean.
29:35
But some guys like that, they like tight jeans.
29:37
It's part of their style.
29:38
I don't give a crap.
29:39
But when you present yourself in a certain way, you shouldn't be offended when people
29:43
respond in a certain way to that.
29:45
So consider the men.
29:47
Another prescription for worship leaders is solicit feedback and input from the men in
29:51
your congregation.
29:52
Man, if I were you, if I were bold enough, maybe you'd sang four or five songs and there
29:57
was a whole group of guys in one corner that didn't respond a bit.
30:00
They sat there with their arms closed.
30:02
Maybe they pulled their phone out at some point.
30:03
They never sang a word of what you said.
30:06
Go up to them and ask them for feedback.
30:07
Hey, man, I couldn't help but notice that you and your buddies weren't really singing.
30:13
Was it the music?
30:14
Did you enjoy the music?
30:16
Are you just nervous to sing in front of people?
30:18
See what questions that you might get answered because I honestly think guys are going to
30:23
be able to tell you like, yeah, man, I'm just not really into that and maybe they don't
30:26
even know why because a lot of guys are a little bit shut off emotionally.
30:30
Not everybody.
30:31
That's, you know, we're not a gigantic group, but a lot of them are kind of shut off emotionally.
30:34
They don't realize that they don't like modern worship music because it's so effeminate because
30:38
the lyrical content is so home erotic.
30:40
They can't like figure that out inside their brains.
30:43
Maybe you can help them do that.
30:45
Another prescription for worship leaders is don't be afraid to go aggressive.
30:50
Like and that kind of leads into the next thing, which is don't be afraid of the Psalms.
30:54
Like really don't be afraid to sing the Psalms.
30:57
And I am using the word afraid on purpose because a lot of worship leaders are afraid
31:01
of the words written in the Psalms.
31:04
They're terrified of it because they're more war driven and they're more, you know, emotional
31:09
but in a scary masculine testosterone filled kind of way.
31:14
That's the aggressive part.
31:15
Don't be afraid of that.
31:16
So there's a great excerpt from the book, Future Men by Doug Wilson, which says this.
31:21
The fact that the church has largely abandoned the singing of the Psalms means that the church
31:25
has abandoned a songbook that is thoroughly masculine in its lyrics.
31:30
The writer of most of the Psalms was a warrior and he knew how to fight the Lord's enemies
31:35
in song.
31:37
With regard to the music of our Psalms and hymns, we must return to a world of vigorous
31:42
singing, vibrant anthems, more songs where the tenor carries the melody, open fists,
31:48
and glory.
31:50
Our problem is not that such songs do not exist.
31:53
Our problem is that we have forgotten them and in forgetting them, we are forgetting our
31:57
boys.
31:58
Men need to model such singing for their sons, okay?
32:03
So guys, this is a hard part for me because I got to be honest, like I don't sing at church
32:10
and that is a me problem, okay?
32:13
Because I can say, oh, I got problems with this and, you know, philosophically, I disagree.
32:18
I just can't do it.
32:19
There's something stuck in my brain where it's like, I just can't sing these songs.
32:23
But when they're singing a psalm or even an old hymn, something different happens.
32:30
It's just, I have a different tone and tenor and right now, baby James is eight months old.
32:35
He doesn't really know things.
32:36
He barely knows who mom and dad are, but eventually he's going to be watching dad during church.
32:42
You know, his dad, you know, reading the Bible along with the pastor or is he checking Facebook?
32:47
You know, is dad singing along or is he mentally checked out?
32:50
Why is dad sitting there with his arms crossed?
32:52
I mean, you've seen this in your own families, if not, you've seen it in other families.
32:56
If a dad's kind of a stick in the mud, usually one of his kids is a stick in the mud.
33:00
You know, I've got a family member who won't smile in pictures, will not smile in pictures.
33:05
He's just an absolute turd when it comes to taking pictures with his family.
33:09
And his oldest daughter is that way, amazingly, because she's watched daddy make a big deal
33:14
about not smiling in pictures and basically ruining family pictures for the entire side
33:19
of this family and his daughter won't do it either.
33:22
Because daddy won't do it.
33:23
Why should she have to do it if daddy doesn't do it?
33:26
So I'm going to have to kind of figure out some of that as I move along.
33:28
But to kind of get back into the part about not being afraid to go aggressive or being
33:33
afraid of the Psalms, I think the modern worship band Shane and Shane has blazed a fairly
33:38
unbelievable trail in this area.
33:40
Now they've created a lot of music that would fit into some of the effeminate categories
33:44
that I really talked about earlier.
33:45
But they have two albums called Psalms and Psalms to and Psalms to especially.
33:50
I feel like man, more so than any other strictly contemporary worship type music really, really
33:58
gets the masculine juices flowing, okay?
34:01
The song Psalm 46, which is the first song off the Psalms to track, it's called Lord
34:05
of hosts, man.
34:08
It is such a powerful song and Shane and Shane, it's just two guys named Shane, right?
34:12
So sometimes they have musical accompaniment with like, you know, another guitarist and
34:15
a bassist and a drummer, sometimes it's just those two dudes and a acoustic guitar.
34:19
And I'll include that song for you later so you can check it out.
34:23
But there is a pathway that you can follow if you're willing to go down it, okay?
34:27
So those are the prescriptions again, just for worship leaders, you know, ask yourself,
34:30
am I feminine or am I soft?
34:32
If yes, you need to fix it, consider the men.
34:35
Also solicit feedback from those men in your congregation.
34:37
Don't be afraid to be go aggressive.
34:39
Be afraid of the Psalms and, you know, maybe embrace some of the Psalms that other people
34:43
have done.
34:44
So now I want to go into the part that a lot of you have been waiting for.
34:47
Really, it's the prescriptions for men like me.
34:49
So men like me that don't really categorically like praise and worship music or modern worship
34:54
music or contemporary worship music, whatever you want to call it, okay?
34:57
Let's get in those prescriptions.
34:59
First one here, encourage change in your home church, but don't expect it.
35:05
So you can sit there for years and years and years on end and hate the first 20 minutes
35:10
of every service you ever sit through or you can maybe do something about it.
35:15
Send this episode to the lead pastor of worship at your church, you know, share it around
35:20
with some other people, have a conversation with some of your pastors and express some
35:24
of your concerns about how the music that's being played, if this fits your church, which
35:28
I assume it would, about how feminine it is and how it doesn't really appeal to a manly
35:32
man like you.
35:34
And for, to the men that have that robust sense of, of duty and honor and, you know, testosterone,
35:39
like how it's not really landing with you and how you don't want it to be that way.
35:44
But again, don't expect it to change.
35:47
Typically people that work at these churches, they're not terribly concerned about them
35:50
in.
35:51
They say they are, but then everything that they do is kind of counter to, to what would
35:54
be good for men.
35:55
So you should still encourage them though.
35:58
Another prescription from then like me would be to tell your lead pastor that you will
36:02
have his back if he decides to make his church man friendly.
36:07
So I'm going to go back to the interview that I did with Stephen Mansfield last summer and
36:11
talk about some of the churches that he was affiliated with that he knew of the pastors
36:15
that had made their, their services man friendly, made their churches man friendly.
36:21
And the cool thing that Stephen talked about is that these churches didn't have a men's
36:26
ministry quote unquote, right?
36:27
They didn't have, you know, a men's ministry pastor.
36:30
They didn't have, you know, these events that were specifically for the men's ministry.
36:33
They didn't do the Saturday morning prayer breakfast type thing.
36:36
These are just dudes that created a church that dudes wanted to be at.
36:41
And this one specific church, I think it was in the, in somewhere in Virginia, there were
36:44
a lot of special operations guys that were kind of in that area that were drawn to that
36:50
church.
36:51
Some of the baddest dudes of, and you could use the categories of manhood and they checked
36:55
so many of the manhood boxes.
36:57
They wanted to go to this church because the church was manly the pastors were manly, right?
37:02
That doesn't mean everybody, you know, had neck tattoos and, you know, could bench 315
37:06
for a set of 10 and, you know, drove a big truck.
37:08
Some of those people might have been there, but they were just manly men through and through.
37:12
And so part of the thing is, is a lot of your pastors think that there will be an uprising
37:17
from the women, right?
37:19
If they start to make the church more man friendly, but these man friendly churches, again, going
37:24
back to that conversation with Stephen Mansfield, the women are so excited and so involved and
37:31
so enthralled with their church and with their men.
37:34
It's almost as if that it's a reflection of what should be going on inside of our homes.
37:40
Because if you have a manly God-centered man as the center of the household, the leader
37:45
of the household, the woman is not oppressed.
37:48
The children are not held down.
37:51
Everybody is elevated.
37:52
Everybody is lifted.
37:54
So, tell your pastor that he decides to net up and, you know, reach down the front of
37:57
his pants and realize he still has a pair that you'll have his back, all right?
38:02
Other prescriptions from in like me realize that worship music exists outside of the quote
38:10
contemporary Christian genre, okay?
38:13
So my favorite worship music just so happens to be metal surprise, surprise for the people
38:19
that are used to our normal intro and outro music for 170 plus episodes of this podcast.
38:24
My favorite type of worship music is metal music.
38:28
It goes back to the time when my buddy let me borrow the society's finest album and living
38:34
sacrifice reborn.
38:35
That was the first real Christian underground metal album that I'd ever experienced and
38:40
I loved the music and I loved how aggressive the vocals were even if I had to kind of read
38:45
along with it to understand what was being said.
38:48
It's because of songs like this and I always point people to this song.
38:51
It's the song Devastator by four today.
38:54
So four today is no longer together, but they did leave us several albums to enjoy.
38:58
I'm going to read the entirety of the lyrics to this song Devastator and I'm going to include
39:03
a YouTube video here at the end of the episode so that you can listen to it for yourselves.
39:07
But I want you to compare these lyrics.
39:08
I'm about to read to you to the Hillsong lyrics from earlier.
39:13
See if you can pick up any differences in these songs.
39:15
So here's Devastator by four today.
39:18
Hell, fear me.
39:20
I am the one that will bring you down and when you fall, feel me.
39:25
You'll see my face on the battleground.
39:28
Hell, fear me.
39:29
I am the one that will bring you down and when you fall, feel me.
39:33
You'll see my face on the battleground.
39:37
Let my name be feared at the gates of hell as I exalt the savior, the one that died to
39:43
buy my victory and gave me a new name.
39:46
Let my name be feared at the gates of hell as I exalt the savior in the name of the holy
39:51
one of God.
39:53
I will cast you down at the foot of the cross he hung from.
39:56
I will stand behind my savior as he burns your kingdom down and I will see you on your
40:01
knees before the king of kings.
40:03
You will lose your throne to the chosen ones.
40:06
The chosen ones will rise.
40:09
Tear it to the ground, this is the army we've been waiting for, tear it to the ground.
40:14
We will storm the gates of hell and we will tear it to the ground.
40:18
We will stand behind the one that conquered death, tear it to the ground and we will stand
40:24
when there is nothing left.
40:25
Tear it to the ground, tear it to the ground.
40:29
Justice, justice, justice, God bring justice, justice.
40:34
We will come against the bondage of hell, justice and we will take back what's taken
40:39
from us.
40:40
Justice, this is our right as heirs to dominion.
40:44
God bring justice, this war will end.
40:48
I am the one that will bring you down and when you fall, feel me, you'll see my face
40:53
on the battleground.
40:55
Hell fear me, I am the one that will bring you down.
40:58
And when you fall, feel me, you'll see my face on the battleground.
41:04
Now guys, did you feel a little something?
41:08
When I was reading that, now I don't have the lowest groveliest voice in the world.
41:13
But imagine if Jocko were reading those lyrics and then go listen to the song, you tell me
41:18
that doesn't get you fired up, you tell me that doesn't make the hair on your form, stand
41:23
up a little bit, you're, you're at attention, you know, you're, you're tuned up a little
41:27
bit, your oodle loop is going crazy or you're looking at your situation.
41:31
When's the last time you had that feeling when you're listening to Hillsong?
41:37
You can't conquer the hill listening to that music.
41:42
It's not possible.
41:45
And that's not the only song like that.
41:46
And I'm not going to read any more lyrics to you, but I will kind of give you some more
41:49
another metal band called O-Sleeper.
41:51
They have a song called The Finisher, okay?
41:54
That song is from the perspective of God talking to Satan.
41:58
In the first song of that album, it's kind of Satan talking to God, saying all the things
42:02
he's going to do and how he's weak and how his followers are terrible.
42:06
And this is the last track on the album and it's God's response.
42:10
And he's telling Satan what he's going to do to him.
42:13
And it crescendos at the end by God telling him that while the angels are watching him,
42:19
he was going to cut off Satan's horns.
42:22
I have a tattoo on my right arm and shoulder of this happening.
42:27
I kind of changed a form of a statue that's in Florence of Hercules fighting a centaur
42:32
and it's God chopping off the horns of Satan and Satan's depicted as a winged goat, as
42:38
a behemoth.
42:40
That song really gets me going.
42:42
I mean, the end of that song, every time I've heard it, I've heard it probably hundreds
42:45
of times now, I still get fired up.
42:48
I still get my heart pumping, my heart rate goes up, like I'm ready for war, like not
42:52
really again, guys, I wasn't a soldier, but it's like I feel like that, I get that feeling.
42:56
But also, there's other categories like hip hop, you know, one of my buddies down in
43:01
Lawton, he runs the great 580 down in Lawton, Oklahoma, you know, he's talking about his
43:06
names, Jeff, he's talking about KB and Tripoli and, you know, LaCray before he went woke.
43:11
Like there are different hip hop artists whose lyrical content is more theologically sound
43:16
than some of the stuff you're going to hear from the pulpit.
43:18
Okay.
43:19
So that's kind of a long category to basically talk about how realize that worship music can
43:24
exist outside the contemporary Christian worship like model.
43:28
But the last thing I want to say as a prescription for guys like me is this is remember, it's
43:33
very likely not a you problem, because again, especially the worship leaders, maybe some
43:38
of your friends, people are going to think this is a you problem.
43:41
And it might be a you problem, but it's very likely not.
43:45
I don't think you should be racking your brain and feeling guilty on a regular basis because
43:50
what's being presented to you is so paltry and so poor and not for you.
43:57
So again, to recap the prescriptions I have for men like me is encouraged changing your
44:01
home church.
44:02
But again, don't expect it.
44:03
Tell your lead pastor that you have his back, he decides to make a man friendly church refocus.
44:09
Also realize that worship music exists outside of the contemporary Christian genre.
44:14
And then also just realize that it's very likely not a you problem.
44:18
So as we wrap up today, there's a quote that I found from Douglas bonds, stand fast in the
44:23
way of truth.
44:24
Okay, so let me just read this to you and then we'll get out here men are less interested
44:28
in attending church regularly and even less inclined to commit themselves to ministry
44:32
responsibilities and leadership in the church in part because there is a significant shift
44:37
in how Christians worship relational songs and emotive courses have replaced the strong
44:42
manly hymns that were sung by men and boys and their families in worship for millenniums.
44:48
Instead of stout hymns about battles and triumphant songs about conquering enemies and doctrinal
44:54
poetry calling men to base their lives and deeds on solid biblical foundations, the contemporary
44:59
church seeing superficial songs that make real men feel like they have to act like a
45:04
woman in order to be Christians.
45:07
Young men who grow up under pressure to sing breathy feminine songs in worship will never
45:12
be spiritually intellectually and emotionally capable of godly leadership in their homes
45:18
in Christ church or in the world.
45:22
So guys, I hope this episode has been a blessing to you.
45:24
Make sure you share it around.
45:25
But guys, before we let you go, we are going to do a quick resilience boost.
45:28
As you know, by now we are a men's ministry and our mission is cultivating manly resilience.
45:32
Specifically, we do that by providing you content like this podcast.
45:34
It helps you forge spiritual mental and physical toughness.
45:37
So here are the resources I've got for you today.
45:39
First is the book that I quoted often in this episode.
45:42
It's called why men hate going to church by David Morrow.
45:44
So it's a link to the article or sorry to the Amazon and so you can go and check that
45:49
out.
45:50
I've got an article from art of manliness.
45:52
So you've heard me talk about the podcast here on this podcast, but they've got some
45:55
great content on their website.
45:57
They've got kind of this really, really long article.
45:59
It's almost like a miniature book called the feminization of Christianity is written by
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the two founders of art of manliness.
46:05
So I would definitely check that out.
46:07
Also I've got a YouTube link for you to the for today song called Devastator and in the
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very next link after that, I've got the lyrics.
46:14
So this is the official video for Devastator, but again, it's more aggressive vocals.
46:19
It's kind of hard to understand the lyrical content.
46:20
If you're not used to listening to that type of music.
46:22
So I've got the lyrics there for you.
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Then I've also got the official video for the finisher by O sleeper and that's the song
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I was talking about where God says he's going to cut off saints horns.
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So you can watch that video and then I've got the lyrics there for you as well in the
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next link.
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And the last link is the YouTube video to Psalm 46, Lord of hosts lyric video.
46:39
This is the Shane and Shane video.
46:40
I believe I gave you the live version if I remember correctly, but guys, this is especially
46:45
for those of you that are in charge of worship music.
46:48
There is music out there that you can train yourself and the rest of your band to learn
46:52
that is going to drive the hearts of men and is going to stir them up so you should check
46:56
it out.
46:57
All right, guys.
46:58
Thanks so much for listening to the podcast.
46:59
I do appreciate it.
47:00
If you would, please subscribe on Apple podcast, iTunes, Spotify, Google podcast or Stitcher
47:03
and refer your friends to listen and share this on social media.
47:06
Guys, if we deserve a five star review, please leave us five stars letting us know why you
47:10
like the content.
47:11
I'm currently booking speaking engagements for all of 2021.
47:14
So if you want me to come speak at your team, at your men's event, at your school, whatever,
47:18
hit me up info at undaunted.life.
47:20
That's I N F O at undaunted.life.
47:23
The website is www dot undaunted.life.
47:25
You can follow us on Instagram and Twitter at undaunted life or Facebook.com backslash undaunted
47:29
life.
47:30
Check out our free devotionals on the U version Bible app.
47:32
Just search undaunted life under plans.
47:34
And as always, we want to thank the band August Brins read for allowing us to use their entire
47:38
music library for our content.
47:39
The intro out to a track on this podcast is our song defender, which is off their latest
47:43
record entitled guardians.
47:45
The links are in the description.
47:46
I'm your host, Kyle Thompson, remember, keep cultivating manly resilience, keep forging
47:52
spiritual, mental and physical toughness.
47:55
Keep seeking the lion of Judah.