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This is Undaunted Life, a man's podcast. I'm your host Kyle Thompson. Let's get into it.
0:45
All right, guys, before we get into today's subject matter, got a couple of things we need
0:48
to take care of. First of all, I wanted to read one of the latest reviews that we've gotten
0:53
on Apple iTunes. So I'm going to go ahead and read this five-star review to you here. It's by
0:57
a guy named B Corbett. Hands down, this is the best podcast I've come across in a long while.
1:03
You can tell that Kyle genuinely cares about the growth and development of his fellow man,
1:07
and he offers a whole new perspective on a lot of current topics both spiritually and socially.
1:12
You'll definitely be challenged by some of the things that he says, but that's the whole point.
1:16
A man can't grow if he isn't challenged. I can't recommend this podcast enough. So
1:20
to be Corbett, if you're listening to this episode, thank you very, very much for taking the time
1:24
to leave us this review. It really helps us, right? Because the thing is, is when we're sitting here
1:29
recording and preparing this podcast, we don't really know if it's landing with you guys,
1:34
but this just helps prove to us that it actually is landing. And so this is also my encouragement
1:38
to all of you that if you want this content to get out to more guys, like yourself, if you want
1:42
guys to be able to develop, if you want them to be able to cultivate spiritual, mental, and physical
1:46
toughness, if you want to cultivate mainly resilience and we want other guys to do that with you,
1:50
the best way to do that and the best way for this podcast to grow is if you leave a five star review
1:55
and leave a few sentences, right? Because the algorithms are trying to block out things that
1:59
might seem like robots. And so it's not just the five star review. Take a quick second to leave a
2:03
few sentences because I promise we look at the reviews and we look to see if people are liking
2:07
it or not liking it or whatever. So that is the end of that. So before we move on again to the
2:12
subject matter for today, we need to do a little bit of an abortion update. So haven't talked about
2:16
abortion in a few episodes. And so there's always seemingly nowadays, there's always stuff happening
2:21
in the world of abortion. So there's a few things I wanted to get you up to date on just in case
2:25
you were not up to date. So first of all, the Democratic front runner for the 2020 ticket
2:31
is currently Joe Biden. Now he is kind of slipping. He's kind of he's kind of finding it difficult to
2:36
to find his footing here in this party because he's trying to put himself as, you know,
2:41
just old Joe, you know, the Joe that you know, and the guy that's been around for 40 plus years in
2:45
politics and, you know, not really going to rock the boat more moderate, you know, more likable.
2:50
He's, you know, Trump's, or he's Obama's best friend, not Trump, but he's, he's trying to be
2:54
that guy. But at the same time, he's trying to be radical because the political left right now is
3:00
incredibly, incredibly radical. And so he flip flopped on something on the abortion debate that
3:07
really was one of the more astonishing flip flops that we've ever seen probably in modern
3:11
politics. And no, I'm not being hyperbolic. Because typically when you see someone flip flop,
3:15
they're flip flopping after a short period of time believing a certain way. You don't really,
3:20
you don't really see somebody with a really, really long political career, think one way,
3:24
and then late, way late in their careers, change their minds on a huge topic. But that's exactly
3:29
what Joe Biden did with the Hyde Amendment. So if you're not familiar with the Hyde Amendment,
3:33
the Hyde Amendment basically bans federal funding going towards abortions. Now the Hyde
3:38
Amendment doesn't exactly do that because if you know this by now, the federal government already
3:42
gives like $500 million to Planned Parenthood every year. And they're saying, Oh, well, that
3:48
can't go to abortions. But it's like, really, if all the money goes into the same pot and some of
3:52
it goes to fund abortions, like really is that not how it goes? But anyway, the Hyde Amendment has
3:56
basically been one of those stalwart things where it's like, basically, if you are in support of
4:01
that, you're fairly extremely left or sorry, if you're anti the height of amendment, rather,
4:06
you are pretty far on the left of the issue of abortion. But the thing about Joe Biden
4:11
is even though he considers himself to be pro choice, right? This is a supposedly Catholic
4:17
individual that says, you know, he basically doesn't want to bring his morality into how he
4:21
helps legislate. But for 40 years that he has been in national politics, he has been in support
4:28
of the Hyde Amendment, which would block the federal funding of abortions. And now,
4:34
all of a sudden that he's running for president, for the crowded democratic ticket,
4:40
he's changing his position on the Hyde Amendment. So it's pretty astonishing. I mean, I would,
4:45
I would have you try to figure out another person that has made such a huge shift this late in his
4:50
career. I mean, this guy's, you know, well into his 70s, right? So I don't really know what exactly
4:56
happened to him, or if he's just playing politics, which it seems like that's what he's doing right
5:00
now. Now also, we have the democratic party that for the 56th time blocked a bill that would stop
5:07
infanticide. So we've talked about this, this bill on episode 64 of this podcast. But basically,
5:14
the democratic party is the party of death and they continue to keep proving it, because stopping
5:18
infanticide, which is basically having a baby be born, like, you know, they're outside the womb,
5:25
and preventing somebody from actively taking steps to make sure that that baby dies.
5:30
That should be pretty easy, right? But the democrats just keep shooting it down. It just doesn't
5:34
fit their narrative. So they're out on it. But I would like to say that that is the craziest thing
5:38
that democrats have done this week, but not to be outdone. The Illinois governor, JB Pritzker,
5:44
I guess is how you say his last name, he signed a bill legalizing abortion up to the day of birth.
5:50
So Illinois joins the latest of several states that are moving towards that direction. And I
5:57
believe if I've got the calculations correct, or if the news that I'm seeing is correct,
6:01
by the time you guys listen to this podcast, I'm recording it a few days before it comes out,
6:05
Rhode Island might be added to that list. There are states that are just rushing to see how
6:10
extreme they can make their laws. The thing about it is though, is how can you outdo yourself when
6:16
you're approving a bill that allows abortion on the day that a woman could potentially give birth.
6:21
And again, they're always saying like, Oh, well, that does, that's not going to happen for no
6:25
reason. It's going to happen because you know what, what happens, you know, if the mother is having
6:29
some major complications. Yeah, you don't need to do an abortion. I mean, you just deliver the baby,
6:36
right? If mom's having complications, you deliver the baby. I mean, C section regular birth, like
6:41
that's just kind of what you do. But apparently if you're on the modern political left, that is
6:45
just a completely untenable position. You can't possibly do that. We want to make sure that these
6:50
women have complete bodily autonomy all the way up until the day that the human being inside of
6:55
them is going to be potentially born, at which point they can decide whether or not they're
6:59
going to allow that to happen. So that's pretty awesome. But it's not all jury and not all bleak
7:04
because Donald Trump, which I've said before, I'm not a huge Trump guy. I'm not a maga maga
7:07
all the time type of guy. But you just got to say it, there has never been a more pro life
7:13
president than Donald Trump. He is so pro life like I'm considering voting for the guy in 2020.
7:19
But it's probably not going to happen. I mean, I'll probably leave the top of my ballot blank
7:24
and we can talk about that later. But here's the thing. Trump has continuously done things
7:28
to take away to cut out the knees of the abortion industry in the United States. And he had a huge
7:33
thing that was announced here recently. He basically unilaterally is stopping the sale
7:38
of pieces of aborted children for medical research. Because there's been a lot of medical research
7:45
that is done using the tissue of babies that are the products of abortion. And there's a lot of
7:51
people coming out basically saying, Oh, Trump's anti medicine. Now he's anti science. He's anti this
7:55
he's anti maybe he's just anti killing babies and profiting off of it. Is that possible? Is that
8:03
plausible on any side of the planet that that's what the guy's doing? Again, Donald Trump doesn't
8:09
have a huge long record of being pro life. He was basically pro life about two seconds after he
8:14
decided he was going to be a red candidate Republican. But at the same time, you can believe one thing
8:19
and then you can act one way. So let's just say in his heart of hearts, he's pro choice. Look at what
8:24
he's doing. Look at the lives that he might potentially be saving. And again, I'm not always
8:29
Trump or type of guy. I'm not the guy that is shouting his praises. But when he does something
8:34
good, I will praise him for it. And when he does something bad, I hope I'm the first person that
8:37
calls him out. But guys, let's go ahead and get into the podcast episode for today. So there was a
8:42
really interesting article that my buddy sent out to me and a bunch of guys that were in a group
8:47
text. And it was titled why I'm not a Christian Jordan Peterson. And so this article is an opinion
8:52
article and I'll talk about it maybe a little bit more here at the end. But basically, there was a
8:56
really big event that was done about a month ago. And so it was the 2019 Prager U summit. So if
9:02
you're not familiar with Prager U, that's Dennis Prager. And it's a very conservative think tank
9:07
type of thing. They put a lot of videos out on YouTube. They've been demonetized from YouTube.
9:12
They're they're basically suing YouTube and all these different things. And so that's not what
9:15
this episode is about. But at the Prager U summit, kind of the main event was this hour long conversation
9:22
between Dennis Prager, who runs Prager U and Jordan Peterson. And so the thing about this is I
9:27
would encourage you. And of course, I'm going to give you the link to this entire thing. I would
9:30
encourage you to listen. It's about a 53 54 minute long video. I want you to listen to the entire
9:35
thing. But there was an unbelievably interesting interaction and answer from Jordan Peterson very
9:41
early on in this podcast, or sorry, in that interview that I'm going to play here on this podcast.
9:46
But Jordan Peterson is constantly asked about his position on Christianity. He is constantly
9:54
asked whether or not he's a Christian. He's constantly asked about the deity of Jesus Christ,
9:59
right? And on Jordan Peterson's YouTube channel, his he has the link to this talk and Dennis Prager
10:06
has one on his. But the title of it on Jordan Peterson's epic or on his channel is on claiming
10:12
belief in God, which is a really interesting way to put it. But essentially, the reason why people
10:17
are so interested in what Jordan Peterson thinks about Christianity is because he spent so much time
10:22
talking about it. So again, he kind of rose to prominence in his reaction to Bill C 16 in Canada.
10:29
But beyond that, he rose to prominence because he did these incredibly lengthy, you know, diatribes
10:36
and deep dives into Genesis and kind of the, you know, psychological importance of some of the
10:44
Genesis stories. And he's going to be doing Exodus here coming and I think it's coming out this year.
10:49
He's going to be doing a deep dive into Exodus. But he's talked so much about biblical principles.
10:53
But there was a very interesting quote that he gives us at a lot of different, a lot of different
10:58
events. So if you hear him speak or you hear him on these panels, he always says kind of the same
11:02
thing. Okay. So what I want to do is as opposed to spoiling it, I'm going to go ahead and let
11:06
Dennis Prager set it up for you. So I'm going to show you this clip. So if you're watching this clip
11:10
from the, I think it's the Jordan Peterson, but none of this would be from the Prager U1.
11:15
It's about nine minutes and 50 seconds in. And then we're going to let it play until about the 14
11:20
and a half minute mark. But I just want you to listen to this interaction between Jordan Peterson
11:24
and Dennis Prager. You, you have said on a number of occasions, and in every, on every
11:31
occasion that I have watched you say it, not a single person in the panel, you often talk on panels,
11:38
not one person has ever actually reacted to it. I totally get it. Nevertheless, it's one of the
11:46
most important things you regularly say, you live as if there is a God. Is that correct?
11:54
Well, people ask me if I believe in God. You know what? I just, I, I'm going to release
11:59
podcast about that because I answered that question for about two hours in Australia,
12:05
because people kept asking me that question, which I really don't like. I don't like that question.
12:11
And so I sat and thought about it for a good while, and I tried to figure out why. And then I thought,
12:17
well, you say, you believe, you say, I thought, who would have the audacity to claim that they
12:30
believed in God? If they examined the way they lived, who would dare say that to, to believe,
12:41
you think, to believe in a Christian sense, to actually, this is why Nietzsche said there was only
12:46
every one Christian, and that was Christ, to have the audacity to claim that means that you live it
12:54
out fully. And that's an, that's an unbearable task in some sense. I just debated Slavojijek
13:05
about a week ago, although it wasn't really much of a debate. It was, it was a strange event,
13:10
but he said something very brilliant. And to me, that justified the entire event, at least from my
13:15
perspective, he talked about Christ's moment of crisis on the cross when he cried out to God that
13:24
he had been forsaken. And what Jijek said was that what that meant was that the conditions of
13:31
human existence are so tragic, that even God himself in human form lost faith for a moment in the
13:41
goodness of being. And I thought that was a remarkable observation because, well, if God himself would
13:48
lose faith under such conditions, what would you expect from normal human beings confronted with
13:55
what we're confronted by? And to be able to accept the structure of existence, the suffering
14:11
that goes along with it and the disappointment in the betrayal, and to nonetheless act properly,
14:17
right, to aim at the good with all your heart, right, to dispense with the malevolence and your
14:23
desire for destruction and revenge and all of that. And to face things courageously and to tell the
14:29
truth, to speak the truth and to act it out, that's what it means to believe. That's what it means.
14:37
It doesn't mean to state it. It means to act it out. And unless you act it out, you should be very
14:46
careful about claiming it. And so I've never been comfortable saying anything other than
14:52
I try to act as if God exists because God only knows what you'd be if you truly believed.
15:01
I mean, if you think about it in some sense, that's the central idea in Christianity, is that if you
15:08
were capable of believing it would be a transfiguring event, a truly transfiguring event. And I know
15:14
people experience that to one degree or another, but we have no idea what the limit of that is.
15:19
And we have no idea what the possibility is within each person if they lived a life that was
15:26
maximally courageous and maximally truthful. You know, because maybe you're running at 60%
15:32
or 70% or 20% and at cross purposes to yourself, God only knows what you'd be if you believed.
15:40
And so, while I act, I try to act like I believe, but I never claim that I manage it
15:51
because it's too it's it's a law to manage properly. And you have to be careful about
15:58
claiming to manage things that you can't manage. And so that's part of the answer to that question.
16:05
It's a great answer.
16:06
So there you have it, guys. Again, if you are much of a Jordan Peterson person,
16:17
obviously you've heard something very similar to this before. And if you're not a Jordan Peterson
16:22
person, obviously just go to YouTube, type in Jordan Peterson, you can get caught up pretty quick.
16:25
Twelve Rules for Life is probably the best-selling book from 2018. So you need to make sure you go
16:30
and pick that up. But the thing about his answer to this question is I felt like it was wholly unique
16:35
to how he normally posits his answer. Right? I felt like it was very different. And it didn't
16:41
have anything to do with Dennis Prager. He didn't really frame it up in any unique way. But the
16:47
thing about Jordan Peterson is sometimes when he's asked this, you can tell he's a little bit
16:50
flummox by the question. And sometimes he's a little bit even just frustrated like, "Man,
16:54
why do I keep getting asked this question?" But you can just tell it's nagging at him and it's
16:58
eating at him and it's also eating at all of his followers. But there's a couple of quotes that I
17:03
want to kind of go into a little bit further from what he said. The first one's a little bit shorter
17:07
and it was from the beginning of his answer. And the second one's a little bit longer because regardless
17:12
of Jordan Peterson's worldview, I think that the way that he answered this question, which in normal
17:17
Jordan Peterson fashion, it was carefully and very forthrightly. But he brings up several questions
17:24
that we have to wrestle with his Christians as well. Okay? So the first quote, I'm going to go
17:28
ahead and give that to you here. Who would have the audacity to claim that they believed in God?
17:34
If they examined the way they lived, who would dare say that? To believe, to believe in a Christian
17:40
sense, to actually, this is why Nietzsche said there was only ever one Christian and that was Christ,
17:46
to have the audacity to claim that means that you live it out fully. And that's an unbearable task
17:52
in some sense. And so the big thing I wanted to focus on here on this quote was this part here,
17:59
to have the audacity to claim that means that you live it out fully. So let's just talk about
18:07
the Jordan Peterson side of that. And then let's talk about the us side of that. So for Jordan
18:12
Peterson, this is obviously a very smart guy, a very accomplished guy. Some people call themselves
18:18
or are called intellectuals and they just aren't. He is a heavyweight intellectual. And you can tell
18:24
that he's wrestled with this question. Now it's clear in some of his answers, this one being one of
18:29
them that he hasn't wrestled with it fully. He hasn't really taken it to ground. But he even
18:36
recognizes as someone that sees himself on the other side of faith, like are not on the other
18:41
side, I guess, on the outside looking in on faith in God or faith in in Jesus Christ or a definitive
18:46
deity or any of those types of things, right, a savior of any kind for the world. He's basically
18:52
saying that if you claim to be a Christian, if you have the audacity to claim that, what you have
18:59
to do, the logical outcome for your actions is to live that reality out fully, which begs the
19:07
question to us, do we do that? I mean, again, I'm not, I'm not putting down any preachers,
19:15
because again, I've learned a lot from preachers. I talk a lot about him here on this podcast,
19:19
but can a preacher really push you in the same way that Jordan Peterson has?
19:22
Because when you walk into a church or you go to some conference or you're watching a YouTube
19:26
video or a podcast with a pastor or something like that, you kind of know their arguments before
19:31
they say them. They might do it in a piffy way or in an interesting way or one of those types of
19:35
things. And you kind of have your style that you like, but it almost takes a guy that's on the
19:39
outside looking into positive in this way for you to be like, geez, he's right. Because he's wrestling
19:47
with this because at the very last thing he says is, and that's an unbearable task in some sense.
19:52
He's acknowledging that it's pretty much impossible. I guess not even pretty much. I kind of put my
19:58
own caveat on there, but no, it's not pretty much impossible. He pretty much said this thing is
20:03
unbearable that it's impossible even to put words in his mouth. So this is where I feel like Jordan
20:11
Peterson is, is maybe missing the point where he maybe hasn't fully wrestled with his question,
20:15
because nowhere does he get to the answer of grace? Because I think he's thinking of it in terms of
20:23
man, this is just a really long checklist of things that I'm going to have to do perfectly.
20:28
And I just don't know that that's possible. So that's what he's wrestling with. However,
20:34
at the same time, he's saying, if you truly believe in Christianity, if you truly believe
20:40
in the Christ, if you truly believe in all that, would you not try and check off all those boxes?
20:47
Not so that you can say, I look, I checked off all these boxes and look how great I am. But would
20:52
you not shoot for that? And something that you can kind of, you know, get from some of the things
20:58
that Jordan Peterson says here is that he's watched Christians and he's watched them not even get
21:04
close to the standard. That's why I feel like he says it in the way that he does,
21:09
to have the audacity to claim that, because a lot of people have the audacity to claim that.
21:14
They claim that they are Christians, that they are followers of Christ, that they are followers of
21:19
the way. That's what they claim. And yet, when you look at the fruits of their life, you don't
21:23
really see it there. So that was a really interesting way for him to put it. But there was a second
21:29
quote that was equally as interesting a little bit longer, but it kind of gets even deeper into what
21:34
you see Jordan Pearson wrestling within his brain on the subject. So let me go ahead and give you the
21:37
quote here. To be able to accept the structure of existence, the suffering that goes along with it
21:43
in the disappointment and the betrayal, and to nonetheless act properly, to aim at the good with
21:49
all of your heart, to dispense with the malevolence and your desire for destruction and revenge and
21:54
all of that, and to face things courageously and to tell the truth, to speak the truth and to act it
22:00
out. That's what it means to believe. That's what it means. It doesn't mean to state it. It means to
22:10
act it out. And unless you act it out, you should be very careful about claiming it. And so I've
22:16
never been comfortable saying anything other than I try to act as if God exists, because God only knows
22:23
what you'd be if you truly believed. If you think about it, in some sense, that's the central idea
22:30
in Christianity, is that if you are capable of believing, it would be a transfiguring event,
22:36
a truly transfiguring event. And I know people experience that to one degree or another,
22:42
but we have no idea what the limit of that is. We have no idea what the possibility is within each
22:48
person if they lived a life that was maximally courageous and maximally truthful. No, because
22:54
maybe you're running at 60% or 70% or 20% and a cross purpose to yourself. God only knows what you'd
23:01
be if you believed. And so, well, I try to act like I believe, but I've never claimed that I
23:08
manage it because it's too, it's a lot to manage properly. And you have to be careful about claiming
23:14
to manage things that you can't manage. I mean, guys, there's so much there. I mean,
23:23
there's so many things to talk about, but one of the things I wanted to kind of pull out of there
23:27
is that unless you act it out, you should be very careful about claiming it. I think that
23:32
that's a great standard that Christians should adopt is that you've got those Christians,
23:40
you know, these by faith, I don't know that I want to categorize people into any type of category
23:45
because everyone, depending upon the denomination that you grew up in, maybe you've got different
23:49
language around it or something like that. But you've always got these different ideas about
23:53
how a Christian should act after they've been saved, even if you use the word saved, right?
23:57
But the thing about it is, is the way that some people act, perhaps they shouldn't claim Christianity
24:04
at all, because you don't see the reality of Christ's death and resurrection in their life.
24:10
You don't see it as truly changing them. And this is, you know, kind of what he talks about again,
24:16
is that if you think about it, in some sense, that's the central idea of Christianity, is that
24:20
if you are capable of believing, it would be a transfiguring event, a truly transfiguring event.
24:26
And guys, there's a lot of you out there that are listening to this that maybe you had kind of
24:31
that overwhelming transfiguring event. Maybe you had that overwhelming experience that, you know,
24:36
heroin needle in your arm, you know, should have died hovering over your body, but you didn't
24:40
die type of situation. But then there's a lot of us out there that didn't have that, right? They
24:45
didn't have that central event that, you know, sounds good inside of an autobiography or, you know,
24:50
in some sort of like crappy movie on TV and or something like that. Like, maybe, maybe we don't
24:54
have that event. But regardless of where your starting point was, the subsequent actions in your
25:00
life should look transfiguring. And that that's why I love the way that he said it, is because if
25:07
there's if this is true, if we really believe that this is true, wouldn't it change everything?
25:13
Like when we read the stories of Jesus in the gospels and we read, you know, what's happening
25:19
with the apostles and acts and things like that, like these were people that were just claiming
25:23
something and then just kind of, you know, fluttering around doing their own thing.
25:27
Like these are truly transfiguring events for these individuals. There was no going back.
25:32
And the thing about it is, is we obviously don't have these these long anecdotes or we don't have
25:38
these long autobiographical stories about these people from the Bible for a lot of these people
25:42
that accepted Jesus. We don't know if if they're faith waned or kind of where they were at with
25:46
all these types of things. But we truly see that it was that transfiguring event. And so
25:53
it's some it's given me a lot to think about. I mean, this is what a five minute clip
25:58
from an hour long conversation. But even just that one part that the transfiguring event,
26:04
I mean, he even repeated himself a truly transfiguring event. Like what would that look like?
26:08
And so again, it kind of goes back to the original question with Jordan Peterson,
26:13
which is why does he decide to act as if God is alive? Like if God is real, that God's a real thing,
26:20
right? The thing is pretty clear to me as to why he does that. And I don't think it's because of,
26:27
you know, he's just trying to hedge his bets just in case, you know, he's going to believe all the
26:30
things he really believes, what he's going to say publicly, he believes in God just in case,
26:33
you know, God won't some item or something like that. I don't really think it's that.
26:36
But I think that Jordan Peterson sees the utility of the Christian worldview. And he also sees the
26:45
logical outcomes of other worldviews, because here's a connection that I don't think Jordan
26:50
Peterson is really made. And I've listened to hours and hours and hours of Jordan Peterson talking.
26:55
And I can see him almost circling the wagons a little bit, but I feel like it's going to hit him one day.
27:00
He keeps talking about it, about what basically happened in the 20th century, how the 20th century
27:06
was the bloodiest century and the most atheistic century that we've seen on record, because of what
27:11
we saw in communist China, what we saw in communist Russia, what we saw in the rest of the Soviet
27:18
Union and what we saw with with Hitler and what we saw with Polpon, what we saw with all these
27:22
individuals, these are all atheistic regimes, right? These are all regimes that had basically
27:28
divorced any type of morality from any type of a deity. And we had the bloodiest century we've ever
27:34
had. And potentially the buddies, the bloodiest century that we will ever have, right? I don't think
27:39
there's a whole lot of people lining up wanting to have a repeat of what we saw in the 20th century,
27:43
which is why it's so concerning for, you know, people that we see on the political left that are
27:47
basically saying they want things like socialism in some of these gigantic Western countries. It's
27:52
just like, guys, we've tried that. Like we tried socialism, literally everywhere it's been tried,
27:57
it's failed. And a lot of the places it's failed with a lot of blood on the other side. But don't
28:03
worry guys, I'm not going to get off on a tangent there about socialism. But the thing about it is,
28:07
is Jordan Peterson just hasn't drawn the connection yet. He hasn't drawn the connection between
28:12
the psychological significance of the biblical stories and of the things that we see in Genesis,
28:18
with the reality of who Jesus is, and the reality of if you follow him and if you truly
28:24
follow the Christian worldview, that you won't get things like what we saw in the 20th century.
28:29
That if the men that were in charge at those times, if they were living a gospel-centered
28:36
life, and we're following the teachings of Jesus, there's no way that that would have happened.
28:40
There's just no way. It doesn't compute. It's like when people like to complain, or they like to
28:46
compare Christianity in Islam, it's just like, well, you have to look at things like the ninth
28:52
Surah of Islam and see what that says. And so you look at that and use that to filter
28:59
basically what you see from Boko Haram and ISIS and al-Qaeda, and you see that, oh, they're just
29:03
doing what their prophet said, right? But then if you look at the teachings of Jesus, you don't see
29:09
that. So there have been plenty of people throughout history that have perverted or, you know,
29:14
unknowingly exegeted the scripture improperly and did some really evil, sinful things,
29:20
but it doesn't jive with whatever Jesus taught, not even close. But again, at this point,
29:26
Jordan Peterson hasn't fully gone there yet. So again, I mentioned it earlier on the podcast,
29:31
but he's done a long, you know, study and dive into Genesis, but he's going to be doing a deep
29:37
dive into Exodus as well. And so basically what he does is he takes one chapter of one of those
29:42
books and then he spends like two hours on it or more, basically lecturing through some of the ideas
29:48
that he's gained from that. But the thing that I think will be the transfiguring event for Jordan
29:52
Peterson is when he eventually does the same thing with the gospels, just any of the gospels.
30:01
Because the thing is, is he's he's finding this psychological significance of these very famous
30:06
books. Even if you're not a Christian, you've heard of Exodus, you've heard of Genesis, right?
30:09
And you've heard of a lot of the stories therein. But it goes way beyond psychological. I mean,
30:14
don't we know that guys? We know that it's so much deeper. And the thing is, is we've got to trust
30:21
that the Holy Spirit can work on a guy like Jordan Peterson, an incredibly high-minded,
30:25
genius level intellect type of person, because it doesn't even require any of those things to have
30:31
faith in Jesus. It just doesn't. But hopefully he can kind of get over some of those hurdles.
30:37
And here's the thing guys, is can you imagine if Jordan Peterson becomes a Christian,
30:41
like a real question, Christian, not like a nominal Christian, like, Oh, well, I'm from the west,
30:47
so I guess I believe in God. No, no, no, like an actual believer. I mean, I know Christians kind
30:53
of get excited. Anytime there's any like quasi D list celebrity that like, you know, says they
30:58
kind of believe in God or they went to church once, we're like, Oh, yeah, we got one on our side.
31:02
But if Jordan Peterson started claiming some of these things and started saying that he believed,
31:07
I think it would be incredible. Like it would be, it would just be earth shattering in a lot of ways,
31:13
because you know, it's kind of easy for some people to dismiss William Lane Craig and Ravi
31:18
Zacharias. It's like, Oh, well, you know, these guys get paid to go around the world and defend the
31:23
gospel and all these different things. And you know, regardless of if they know anything about
31:26
those guys individually, but it would be really, really hard to push back on Jordan Peterson.
31:32
Because here's the thing is Jordan Peterson has basically been living in this milieu of the last
31:37
two or three years of basically being in one controversy after the other after the other after the other.
31:42
And he's good friends with Joe Rogan. Joe Rogan says that he's probably the most misrepresented
31:45
person on planet earth of anybody that he knows. But could you imagine a podcast with Jordan
31:51
Peterson and Joe Rogan across from one another? And Jordan Peterson laying out the reasons for
31:56
why he believes that Jesus is a son of God and why he rose again on the third day to save all of us.
32:00
I mean, like literally I'm getting chills just thinking about that because he's just going to
32:06
continuously be a guy that comes on the Joe Rogan podcast. Every time he writes a book,
32:10
he's going to come on there every time there's a controversy, he's going to come on there.
32:13
Just can you imagine a three hour discussion about that? Because I was listening to the Joe
32:18
Rogan podcast episode a while back. I think it was just one that he was doing with one of his buddies.
32:22
And he asked his buddy across the table, he goes, hey, do you think Jesus actually existed?
32:27
And the answer his buddy gave doesn't really matter. But the fact that Joe Rogan
32:33
could even ask a question like that, a historically ignorant question like that
32:40
was astonishing to me. Because he wasn't being sarcastic. He wasn't being funny. He was honestly
32:45
asking like, Hey, do you think this Jesus guy was a real guy? I mean, I would put it to you this way.
32:52
There's more evidence that Jesus of Nazareth was a real person than that Julius Caesar ever lived.
32:58
That gang is con ever lived that Alexander the great ever lived. And certainly the historical
33:05
and or not the interpretations, but the historical accounts of Jesus's life, we have even more than
33:11
those other guys that I mentioned. We have four accounts, like day by day, like walking with this
33:19
guy accounts of Jesus of Nazareth, a Jew, a Jewish carpenter from the middle of nowhere.
33:24
I think that's an astonishing truth. And so to see Joe Rogan and Jordan Peterson work through,
33:33
that would be absolutely incredible. And so that's one thing that I'm looking for,
33:38
because I know I've got a lot of buddies that listen to this podcast, that they're not huge
33:41
Jordan Peterson fans. They feel like Jordan Peterson has not done the Christian walk or the Christian
33:46
worldview any favors. And to a certain degree, I can see where they're coming from, right?
33:50
Yeah, people that are listening to Jordan Peterson and not listening to their pastor,
33:53
they're reading 12 rules for life and they're not reading the Bible. And look, I get it. And I
33:57
would probably agree with you on some of those sentiments. But the thing about it is, and this
34:01
kind of goes back to last week's episode when we were talking about Jeff Durban and Andy Stanley,
34:04
and Andy Stanley made the point of, hey, I don't really care what the on-ramp is to Jesus. I just
34:09
care that someone basically gets on it and goes down the on-ramp. Whether they come to it through
34:14
the Old Testament, where they come through it, you know, to it from a spiritual interaction,
34:19
you know, that was of the worldly or they do it at a church camp or they do it at church on a
34:22
Sunday night, like whatever the thing is, they don't really care as long as they get to Jesus.
34:26
And that's the point. And guys, to be honest, that's why we're here. I've told you this before,
34:31
and if you've heard me talk, I talk about this all the time. But part of the reason why this
34:34
ministry is even here is because we feel like there are some more alpha male type guys that
34:39
miss out on who Jesus is because they go to church and the church service and the church
34:44
decorations and the people inside the church, it basically screams, you're not welcome here.
34:48
We did not make this for you. This is for a different type of person. If you want to be a Christian,
34:53
you have to be this type of a guy. And so that's why we're here because we don't think it's appropriate.
34:59
That guys that are more alpha that are a little bit more testosterone filled mess
35:03
miss out on who Jesus is. And I feel like if a guy like Jordan Peterson comes around,
35:07
we're going to get a lot of the intellectual types as well. And look, I'm not diminishing
35:12
the power of God by any stretch of the imagination. But obviously he works through circumstances,
35:17
he works through people. And it would just be an incredible, incredible thing to see Jordan
35:21
Peterson come to faith in Christ. All right, guys, before we let you go,
35:24
we're going to do a quick resilience boost. As you know, by now, we are a men's ministry and our
35:28
mission is cultivating manly resilience. Specifically, we do that by providing content like this
35:32
podcast that for just spiritual, mental and physical toughness. So today,
35:36
just a little rundown of the information that we got for you. We got the two different versions
35:39
of this talk between Jordan Peterson and Dennis Prager one from the Prager U channel and the other
35:44
one from the Jordan Peterson channel. And then I also include that article, which kind of sent me
35:48
down this rabbit hole. And this was a Australian website, I believe. And again, it's an article
35:53
entitled why I'm not a Christian Jordan Peterson and how you might ask him about becoming one.
35:58
And so it kind of gives you a little bit of a rundown of the talk that he had with Dennis
36:01
Prager. But it also kind of gets more into some things that if you were a friend of Jordan Peterson,
36:06
some things that you might bring up to him, that would maybe lead him towards Christ.
36:09
All right, guys, thanks so much for listening to the podcast. If you would, please subscribe on
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on the top of the episode, please leave us a five star review and a few sentences letting us know
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why you like the content. I'm currently booking speaking engagements for the remainder of 2019
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and the beginning of 2020. So if you want me to come speak to your team on your podcast,
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36:48
we want to thank the band August Burns read for allowing us to use their entire music library for
36:52
our content. The entire outro track on this podcast is our song King of Sorrow, which is off
36:56
their latest record entitled Phantom Anthem. The links to all of this are in the description.
37:00
I'm your host, Kyle Thompson. Remember, keep cultivating manly resilience,
37:06
keep forging spiritual, mental and physical toughness. Keep seeking the lion of Judah.
37:26
[Music]